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View Full Version : Bitter Truth 24yr Rye



libertybar
01-09-2009, 16:04
So, now Bitter Truth is getting into the whiskey game. http://www.the-bitter-truth.com/webshop/engl/media/images/w-rye.jpg

They have just released 240 bottles of a 24yr Kentucky rye, "once distilled in a long defunct distillery by masters of their craft."

Stephan Berg, are you hanging out here? I'd love to know the story on your barrel.

In the short line of hand-picked barrels, this is the latest of available well-aged whiskey that has been released in the last few years for general consumption. Amongst those examples is Lenell and her Redhook Rye, Blue Smoke had their 18yr Van Winkle, and there are the liquor stores that buy their own barrels of which there are many (Blantons, Eagle Rare, etc...).

I look forward to seeing the results of the care and aging of this barrel.

Old Lamplighter
01-09-2009, 20:16
Any idea on what/where this will be distributed? Also, cost range?

scratchline
01-09-2009, 20:23
European distribution from Germany. Although I'm sure they'll be happy to send one back stateside for you for 270 euros, more or less. Serious coin but in the William Heavenhill territory. Barrel proof and unchillfiltered. 69.2% alcohol. Oh, and only 700ml, not 750.

-Mike

callmeox
01-09-2009, 21:32
OK, can someone help me with the math here?

240 bottles * 700ml = 168 liters or 44.38 gallons

It's listed as single barrel, cask strength and non chill filtered.

So, the barrel aged for 24 years and there was just a bit over 16% loss in total volume. Assuming that the evaporation rate was linear, that would mean that the volume loss was in the neighborhood of 0.75% per year. That is just 25% of the "normal" rate of 3% of the remaining volume per year.

Were the angels unimpressed with this one so they passed on their share while it was aging?

Something doesn't seem right to me.


Also, the bottle is listed at 189.95 Euro (255 bucks). 271 euros is the per liter price. Maybe the 1 liter price is listed for comparison shopping. :cool:

scratchline
01-09-2009, 21:38
Sorry. Thought the 270 was with the VAT and shipping. But Scott's right. Only 189 euro. Starting to look like a better deal. Now who's going to pony up the dough and post the tasting notes?

-Mike

libertybar
01-10-2009, 03:06
Any idea on what/where this will be distributed? Also, cost range?

I didn't want to get into that, as I for some ridiculous reason was worried about making this post to ad-like. A silly concern - duly noted.

Here's the link (http://www.the-bitter-truth.com/webshop/engl/spirits/kentucky-straight-rye-whiskey-24-jahre-alt.html)


Now who's going to pony up the dough and post the tasting notes?

I'm all over it. One for drinking and one for saving. Shipping; by the way, for three bottles was 33.00 EUR.

I'll be back in a week with a number of reviews. I'm in the Washington State Bartender's Guild, so we'll be doing a tasting, no doubt.

This is an interesting trend, by the way. I look forward to see what crazily-priced by interesting spirits are released in the coming years.

smokinjoe
01-10-2009, 08:40
OK, can someone help me with the math here?

240 bottles * 700ml = 168 liters or 44.38 gallons

It's listed as single barrel, cask strength and non chill filtered.

So, the barrel aged for 24 years and there was just a bit over 16% loss in total volume. Assuming that the evaporation rate was linear, that would mean that the volume loss was in the neighborhood of 0.75% per year. That is just 25% of the "normal" rate of 3% of the remaining volume per year.

Were the angels unimpressed with this one so they passed on their share while it was aging?

Something doesn't seem right to me.


Also, the bottle is listed at 189.95 Euro (255 bucks). 271 euros is the per liter price. Maybe the 1 liter price is listed for comparison shopping. :cool:

If your math is right Scott (math ain't my strong suit--so I'm of no use), or unless we're missing something, I agree. Josh! Help us out here!! :) Something doesn't sound right. Looking back at the Data Sheets for this years BTAC showed evaporation rates on the Stagg, WLW, and Saz to be in the 50% range. And, these were "only" aged around 16-18 yrs. Heck, the ER17 was in the 60's for evaporation at 17yrs. Maybe, there's more than 1 barrel? But, I would think there'd be different ABV's for each one.
Veddy, veddy, interestink...:skep:

Old Lamplighter
01-10-2009, 09:09
[quote=libertybar;154387]I didn't want to get into that, as I for some ridiculous reason was worried about making this post to ad-like. A silly concern - duly noted.[quote]

Not a problem. I get lost when it comes to euros, dollars, exchange rates, etc......math not my strength either. Thanks for the info. As much as I would love to acquire a bottle, sounds too far out of my wallet range and being across state & international lines.......well, that would not work too well trying to get it to TN anyhow!

Jake_Parrott
01-10-2009, 18:30
OK, can someone help me with the math here?

240 bottles * 700ml = 168 liters or 44.38 gallons

It's listed as single barrel, cask strength and non chill filtered.

So, the barrel aged for 24 years and there was just a bit over 16% loss in total volume. Assuming that the evaporation rate was linear, that would mean that the volume loss was in the neighborhood of 0.75% per year. That is just 25% of the "normal" rate of 3% of the remaining volume per year.

Were the angels unimpressed with this one so they passed on their share while it was aging?

Something doesn't seem right to me.


Also, the bottle is listed at 189.95 Euro (255 bucks). 271 euros is the per liter price. Maybe the 1 liter price is listed for comparison shopping. :cool:
This barrel is from the pile of barrels that Doug Philips did his two Willett ryes from (as well as our Iron Fist and Velvet Glove). When the current owner (KBD) of these barrels bought them, they sought and received approval to dump the barrels and consolidate them (into the best-looking of the barrels from which they were dumped). So when they acquired them (in the early 2000s) the barrels were full, and so they have only been evaporating since then. And since the barrels were quite old and saturated at the time, there's a decent chance they've been evaporating less than normal over the 7 or 8 years since consolidation.

fussychicken
01-10-2009, 19:23
This barrel is from the pile of barrels that Doug Philips did his two Willett ryes from (as well as our Iron Fist and Velvet Glove). When the current owner (KBD) of these barrels bought them, they sought and received approval to dump the barrels and consolidate them (into the best-looking of the barrels from which they were dumped). So when they acquired them (in the early 2000s) the barrels were full, and so they have only been evaporating since then. And since the barrels were quite old and saturated at the time, there's a decent chance they've been evaporating less than normal over the 7 or 8 years since consolidation.

Interesting info Jake! Thanks for this! I had no idea these barrels had been consolidated.

Frankly speaking though I'm getting pretty tired of this slow agonizing roll out of the KBD rye. Don't get me wrong, I'm very grateful to those that have purchased barrels and brought them to market. In fact, I purchased two bottles myself from Jake. And I am glad that it was available.

However, I think this is starting to get a little ridiculous. There are now AT LEAST 10 "different" rye brands all coming from the same batch of Bernheim DSP1 Rye that KBD now owns. Couldn't we have just made this easier and launched it all under one brand? Did we really have to confuse the hell out of everyone with so many different "expressions" of this?

Another unfortunate side effect is that as we get down to the last couple of barrels, the price is starting to sky rocket. 190 euros a bottle!! Yikes! In addition to this, many talked about how the first couple of bottlings that were made from this old batch of rye were the best. That of course would imply that this later whiskey isn't as good as the first couple of honey barrels that were bottled.

My plea to KBD for 2009: Please sell all of your old rye barrels this year. Maybe put everything in the classic Willett bottles? Thats a nice bottle! My brain can't handle the increasing cost and complexity of this slow roll out...

smokinjoe
01-10-2009, 19:37
This barrel is from the pile of barrels that Doug Philips did his two Willett ryes from (as well as our Iron Fist and Velvet Glove). When the current owner (KBD) of these barrels bought them, they sought and received approval to dump the barrels and consolidate them (into the best-looking of the barrels from which they were dumped). So when they acquired them (in the early 2000s) the barrels were full, and so they have only been evaporating since then. And since the barrels were quite old and saturated at the time, there's a decent chance they've been evaporating less than normal over the 7 or 8 years since consolidation.

Thanks for the info, Jake. So if I'm reading this right, the Bitter Truth barrel is from a dump of several other barrels? Kind of like a "Small Batch"?

Rughi
01-10-2009, 19:54
Thanks for the info, Jake. So if I'm reading this right, the Bitter Truth barrel is from a dump of several other barrels? Kind of like a "Small Batch"?

The entire supply was batched for transport about two years before the first Willett, IIRC. It's amazing how quickly the variations stratified - for instance, the second Willett (Neal & Doug) had a much more pronounced rye spice than the first.

smokinjoe
01-10-2009, 20:39
The entire supply was batched for transport about two years before the first Willett, IIRC. It's amazing how quickly the variations stratified - for instance, the second Willett (Neal & Doug) had a much more pronounced rye spice than the first.

I've had at least 3 of the iterations of this batching. Unfortunately, not back-to-back-to-back. So, I can't speak to the differentiation that the rebarreling had on each. Roger, any ideas on why the variations stratified so quickly? Do you think that the barrels that the batch was re-dumped in, created this? BTW, do you know how many original barrels were dumped into the new batch?

callmeox
01-10-2009, 23:14
This barrel is from the pile of barrels that Doug Philips did his two Willett ryes from (as well as our Iron Fist and Velvet Glove). When the current owner (KBD) of these barrels bought them, they sought and received approval to dump the barrels and consolidate them (into the best-looking of the barrels from which they were dumped). So when they acquired them (in the early 2000s) the barrels were full, and so they have only been evaporating since then. And since the barrels were quite old and saturated at the time, there's a decent chance they've been evaporating less than normal over the 7 or 8 years since consolidation.


Thanks for your insight, Jake. I assumed that it was a combination of barrels to meet the volume, but I wasn't aware of the consolidation that took place early on.

anvil_houston
01-11-2009, 13:54
Probably not going to have the opportunity to try this rye, but I am excited about Bitter Truth putting out spirits now in addition to their bitters. This and their recently release of a sloe gin is quite exciting given the high quality of their other products. The celery bitters and repeal bitters are so far ahead of anything put out by the other smaller companies doing bitters. Not to bash the alternatives, which are also good, but there is just something special about Berg and Hauck's understanding of bitters production and cocktail functionality that distinguishes their labels. So, for those of you who are going to opt for this bottle, might I also suggest ordering some of the bitters and sloe gin since you are already paying for shipping.

AVB
02-11-2009, 19:01
If it changes anyones mind you don't pay the 19% VAT so one bottle will run 183.52€ or $236.97 delivered to the US at todays exchange rate.

nor02lei
06-11-2009, 02:37
Have anyone tasted this brand yet? If so what did you think about it? It is a bit expansive but it is very interesting to bay for our local bourbon club witch mean we only have to pay 1/18 part each.

Leif

AVB
06-11-2009, 06:00
It seems to be an EU or perhaps Germany only release as the only places I can find it for sale is in Germany in the 165 range.