View Full Version : What's the best way to sell my collection?
lovejones
05-18-2009, 20:57
I don't want to break any rules here, but due to a little financial problem....I'd like to sell my collection.
I guess Ebay is an outlet? Are there any other ways to sell bottles of bourbon as a private citizen?
How many bottles are in your collection?
wadewood
05-19-2009, 05:29
How big is collection and how may unique bottles? If you have a great collection of Makers Mark bottles, not many of us would be interested.
There are a few of this board that have bought entire collections (I'm not one), so you will probably get a few PMs.
Ebay has issues; it is still illegal and perhaps you could get in trouble with your state (unlikely). Bottles can break during shipping, buyers can claim chargebacks, ebay/Paypal/shipping fees add up quick.
lovejones
05-19-2009, 07:01
Thanks. I've received quite a few PM's, and it looks like person to person is the way to do it. Please consider this a response to your PM if you sent one, as most asked the same question.
I'm going to put a list together and post it here tonight. PM me if you're interested. Since the prices will be set, I'll take the first to respond...with one exception. IF someone wants to buy multible bottles, they will get the sale over someone who only wants one bottle.
Although I need the money, I'm not going to try to auction these off. Instead I'll price them what a current bottle of the same sells for today...if that's fair? So a bottle of 2006 Stagg will cost what a bottle of 2008 cost, not what I paid.
I do have a few rarities that will be hard for me to price. Honestly, what's fair for a Double Barrel BTEC? Or a 40th Anniversary Four Roses? Or a signed bottle of Pappy 15?
I didn't buy these to resell, honestly. I hate doing this, but a mortgage payment is worth more to me now....and selling these will help.
Again, I apologize if this offends anyone or breaks any rules on the forum.
P.S. I do have one MM bottle : )
I'll post the list tonight, and PM me what you would like at that time, not before. Thanks.
lovejones
05-19-2009, 19:42
I'm not going to post a list. If you've sent a PM, I'll get back to you. PM me if you haven't previously.
It's probably worth pointing out that the sale of alcoholic beverages without a license is illegal everywhere, with no exceptions. All such sales on eBay are illegal, despite the meaningless fig leaf eBay offers by way of a disclaimer. There isn't a lot of enforcement, although a guy in Tennessee who had a million dollars worth of Jack Daniel's bottles got into some big trouble with the state ABC a few months back. If you live in a state that permits it, and I think about a dozen do, including New York, you can sell through a licensed auction house. That's the only way to sell a collection legally.
I'm sorry for your misfortune.
PM'd and still haven't seen a list.:skep:
Has anyone heard from lovejones?
I PM'd him too but have had no answer... :skep:
DeanSheen
05-27-2009, 16:39
Nope. Figure thats it for that.
BunkerBooze
02-15-2010, 08:16
Hey Guys:
I'm kind of in the same boat as LoveJones now plus I have way to many bottles and no more room to house any future whiskeys. Any one knows any good licensed auction houses here in California? If you do, email me. Thanks.
Much appreciated.
Hey Guys:
I'm kind of in the same boat as LoveJones now plus I have way to many bottles and no more room to house any future whiskeys. Any one knows any good licensed auction houses here in California? If you do, email me. Thanks.
Much appreciated.
If you are having space issues, you aren't drinking enough. You have a plan now. Get to it!
ErichPryde
02-16-2010, 11:37
PM'd and still haven't seen a list.:skep:
I PM'd him too but have had no answer... :skep:
Nope. Figure thats it for that.
I have a feeling that his stuff went on e-bay, I saw a bottle of PVW15 that had been signed along with some of the other bottles he mentioned, for prices that weren;t terribly outrageous. but I could be wrong. This was several months ago.
If there's anything going on anywhere except eBay, I don't know about it.
For people wondering about this sort of thing, and speaking just for myself, I have nothing against the idea of people collecting and that inevitably involves buying and selling. Most of the hostility to eBay has to do with people who quickly scoop up limited editions like the BTAC and immediately post them on eBay at ridiculous prices. It's offensive because you have people (the buyers) who are too lazy to participate in the hunt but have enough money to simply write a check to get what they want, and people (the sellers) who don't care about the whiskey, they're just looking to make a buck. I also have nothing against people trying to make a buck, but selling whiskey without a license is criminal, so I'm entitled to think of such people as criminals and disdain what they do, while at the same time feeling that--in a perfect world--it would be possible for whiskey collectors to trade and deal the same way collectors of everything from baseball cards to fine art do.
Lost Pollito
02-20-2010, 21:57
If there's anything going on anywhere except eBay, I don't know about it.
For people wondering about this sort of thing, and speaking just for myself, I have nothing against the idea of people collecting and that inevitably involves buying and selling. Most of the hostility to eBay has to do with people who quickly scoop up limited editions like the BTAC and immediately post them on eBay at ridiculous prices. It's offensive because you have people (the buyers) who are too lazy to participate in the hunt but have enough money to simply write a check to get what they want, and people (the sellers) who don't care about the whiskey, they're just looking to make a buck. I also have nothing against people trying to make a buck, but selling whiskey without a license is criminal, so I'm entitled to think of such people as criminals and disdain what they do, while at the same time feeling that--in a perfect world--it would be possible for whiskey collectors to trade and deal the same way collectors of everything from baseball cards to fine art do.
You are correct Sir in your statement. The reason I hate this flipping thing is that the bottled product is intended for drinking after it hits the retailer. This is not the stock-market. Somebody grows the corn, wheat/rye, and barley. It's melded together and aged. A flipper takes from retail, and turns a profit. A fanatic misses out for on reason or another, and a flipper benefits. Seems pretty lame to me.
If there's anything going on anywhere except eBay, I don't know about it.
Chuck,
I sent him a link to McTear's auction house. It specializes in whiskey auctions, but I believe they are based in Great Britain and therefore not subject to US Law.
Of course I'm still curious to see a list of what he has available.
I also have nothing against people trying to make a buck, but selling whiskey without a license is criminal, so I'm entitled to think of such people as criminals and disdain what they do, while at the same time feeling that--in a perfect world--it would be possible for whiskey collectors to trade and deal the same way collectors of everything from baseball cards to fine art do.
I'm going with them as criminals especially considering the prices I see being asked for bottles that aren't particularly dusty or rare. However I too wish there was a legitimate way to trade and counter the continuing arcane liquor laws, controls and taxes that many states impose.
ErichPryde
02-21-2010, 18:45
Chuck, if I had a bottle of Very Old Fitzgerald, would you buy it from me for ten dollars?
Chuck, if I had a bottle of Very Old Fitzgerald, would you buy it from me for ten dollars?
You apparently misunderstood me, because I never said I wouldn't buy something through that or any other illegal channel. That has nothing whatsoever to do with how I regard it.
Also, Very Old I could take or leave, and Very Very Old I'd be suspicious of as in too-good-to-be-true, so weak analogy all the way around.
ErichPryde
02-21-2010, 23:03
You apparently misunderstood me, because I never said I wouldn't buy something through that or any other illegal channel. That has nothing whatsoever to do with how I regard it.
Also, Very Old I could take or leave, and Very Very Old I'd be suspicious of as in too-good-to-be-true, so weak analogy all the way around.
I misunderstood you because of this thread (http://www.bourbonenthusiast.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=5556) on bourbonenthusiast, in which you said this:
One reason I feel comfortable talking about this is because I'm not a collector and don't do any of the illegal things. I'm also a lawyer and fairly high-visibility in this business. If I got caught breaking liquor laws I would, in addition to the other penalties, probably be disbarred.
I wasn't trying to give an analogy- I was just asking you, where is your line?
I'm not trying to pick a fight here... I just don't understand where you stand on this issue, exactly. I would buy a bottle on ebay for the right price, although I haven't done anything besides bid as of yet.
Confining laws need to be challenged, it's unfortunate that in order to do that, someone's life has to be jacked up first. Some parts of the laws regarding liquor are too confining, and some are too lax. I personally believe that selling liquor on ebay should not be illegal. I don't think shipping alcohol should be against the law (as it is in some states). I understand that shipping incredibly high proof spirits can be considered dangerous and would understand why some things would not be allowed. Also, if Mr. Hoffa calls me from the store and asks if I want him to pick anything up, and I pay him back for it, I don't think that should be illegal either.
As a general rule, I have no interest in buying anything on eBay, of an alcoholic nature or otherwise. The example you gave was intended to pose a "too good to resist" opportunity, and while I can't say for sure what I would do in such a situation, I can't say I wouldn't take the bait.
I'm comfortable with ambiguity in my life. I've never said that I've never broken the laws of which we speak, which is as much as I'm going to say about that.
You seem to be saying that the only way to challenge unjust laws is to break them, and while I respect civil disobedience in some circumstances, I think we should obey even the laws with which we disagree unless there is a morally compelling reason to defy them. Civil disobedience principles also require that you defy them openly and with a willingness to take the punishment.
I'm also not presenting myself as the perfect exemplar of my own principles.
In a lot of these discussions, I seem to be criticized for merely stating the facts, what the law is, as if we'd be better off if we didn't know, or something.
I like to think ignorance IS an excuse. At least that's what I tell the lady.
ErichPryde
02-22-2010, 15:42
Chuck, my original "ten dollars" post was not meant as a criticism or an attack. I understand that you were simply trying to state the facts. I don't think that civil disobedience is the only way to challenge laws. The laws we are talking about however are, in some cases, outdated and inane. If it was a serious crime to ship alcohol across state lines, someone would prosecute.
I posed my ten dollars question because I remembered reading you say that you didn't break those laws, and I wanted to know where you stood. I think I can safely say that most of us walk a line of ambiguity and hypocrisy at times, and I'm content with that for myself as well.
I feel that some aspects of the liquor laws are completely pointless, and I don't see a point in following some of them. If I bought 300 dollars worth of whiskey for somebody and he pays me back and both parties are 21 or older, absolutely no one is getting hurt. The government taxed the distillery for the whiskey, and then also got to tax the consumer for the purchase. They made their money.
I guess the response I could see someone coming up with to what I said here is "so where do you draw the line if you choose to follow some laws and not others?" I'm not drawing any lines. I am not going to get into an argument about whether or not I will choose to follow traffic laws, sexual acts laws, or jaywalking laws. The laws under discussion are stupid, are not enforced, and I don't intend to openly defy or challenge any of them. If someone else wants to be a hero or a martyr or both, they can feel free.
I think we should obey even the laws with which we disagree unless there is a morally compelling reason to defy them.
I disagree. I could think of several examples of laws outside of the current discussion that should be defied on principle, and not because of moral reasons.
I'm also not presenting myself as the perfect exemplar of my own principles.
Good. I don't expect anyone to be. I know I'm not.
In a lot of these discussions, I seem to be criticized for merely stating the facts, what the law is, as if we'd be better off if we didn't know, or something.
Again, I was not trying to attack or criticize you. It was nice to have an honest conversation about the subject.
Though I wasn't sure on the first post, I know you were not attacking or criticizing. I appreciate the thoughtful discussion.
Of course breaking the law with regards to purchasing alcohol had more dire consequences at another time in our history. http://www.slate.com/id/2245188/?wpisrc=eDialog
It seems that some of you think there should be a litmus test to see if folks are worthy of selling bottles, regardless of the legality. You'll need to figure out how long something must be kept before it is sold, how much is reasonable profit (if any is allowed in Utopia), and of course, the most important issue. Is the seller a bourbon drinker or just a collector and should he or she be allowed to sell.
Special Reserve
02-23-2010, 03:04
It seems to me that some that rail against eBay also are ardent supporters of seemingly unregulated capitalism. Go figure!
On another note, last year I did buy that $10 bottle of OF BIB from about 1982. Found in an old party store in midtown Detroit. It's called good luck.
doubleblank
02-23-2010, 08:57
I resemble the last remark. I'm no fan of ebay and am an ardent capitalist. Chuck's point is that buying and selling alcohol on ebay is in violation of numerous laws. Many here have complained about the arcane liquor distribution system and laws we have here in the US (I'm one of them). So write your congressman, your senator, govenor, et al and try to get the laws changed. Then let capitalism run free. But in the meantime, ebayers are breaking the law. BTW, I did write my legislators when the "wine shipping" issue was being heard in Texas.
I've never sold anything on ebay (not just alcohol, but anything). My problem with ebay is that they are allowing several parties on their site to essentially run a liquor store there. Many are selling things currently available on most shelves. Ebay isn't interested in enforcing its own policies here. The ebayers are selling without a license, I suspect. And I'm sure they are verifying that no sales go to minors.:skep: We have a number of board members who are in the legitimate alcohol retail trade.....and the laws add costs and place restrictions on activities that prevent them from doing what the ebayers are doing.
Randy
nor02lei
02-23-2010, 13:50
It is nice to hear that Sweden isn’t the only country in the world with a lot of idiotic laws concerning alcohol. To our defence we can at least claim that the “common” people consider breaking most (but not all) of these laws are not a crime at all, but rather positive “rebel” behaviour.
Leif
Back to the topic.....Did a list ever come from any of these posters?
sailor22
02-23-2010, 17:05
I asked - was told he was working on it - and then didn't hear anything.
wadewood
02-24-2010, 05:27
I'm a proud capitalist pig and have sold many items on ebay. I did sell one alcohol item; a bottle of Tanquery Mallaca Gin (a long discontinued item).
Yes, I put all the ebay fine print in my auction including statement including "The value of the item is in the collectible container, not its contents." The buyer of my item complained and filed a chargeback against me because about 1/4 oz had leaked out during shipping. I thought no problem - I sold item for the container, not the contents so ebay will enforce there own policy? Wrong!
It proves even ebay does not believe in it's own alcohol policy.
ErichPryde
02-24-2010, 23:21
If some of the fluid leaked out during shipping, you sent him a damaged product. The seal was broken, and therefore the collectible value of the item went down, right? That's probably how ebay looked at it.
craigthom
02-25-2010, 02:06
Most of the hostility to eBay has to do with people who quickly scoop up limited editions like the BTAC and immediately post them on eBay at ridiculous prices.
To expand on this, the ONLY reason they are successful doing this is because it's illegal. If the distillers or liquor stores could legitimately sell their products by mail to anyone, there would be no market for these ebay sellers.
ErichPryde
02-25-2010, 09:43
To expand on this, the ONLY reason they are successful doing this is because it's illegal. If the distillers or liquor stores could legitimately sell their products by mail to anyone, there would be no market for these ebay sellers.
I don't know about that. look at the number of retailers that are willing to ship- you can find things like GTS online for decent prices. I think the ebay sellers work because after everything is said and done and those kind of whiskies are gone from most everywhere, that bottle for exorbitant prices will still be waiting for someone on ebay.
To expand on this, the ONLY reason they are successful doing this is because it's illegal. If the distillers or liquor stores could legitimately sell their products by mail to anyone, there would be no market for these ebay sellers.
That's a GREAT point.
I don't know about that. look at the number of retailers that are willing to ship- you can find things like GTS online for decent prices. I think the ebay sellers work because after everything is said and done and those kind of whiskies are gone from most everywhere, that bottle for exorbitant prices will still be waiting for someone on ebay.
A lot of places are willing to ship, but most are no longer able to ship, legally.
From what I understand, this is all fallout from Granholm vs. Heald (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granholm_v._Heald).
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