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View Full Version : Am I the only one who likes Pikesville?



humchan2k
11-15-2010, 16:31
Don't see it mentioned very often here....and for $12/bottle, which is by FAR the cheapest booze I can get here in LA that's not dirty bathwater, I think it's fabolous...anyone agree? I think it's FAR better than Overholt or Jim Beam Rye, as it's really just a younger version of Rittenhouse 100...correct? I had heard that the only diff between that and Rittenhouse BiB is the aging......but what do I know, I'm a newbie.

What say you, Bourbon Nation? I am out of my mind, or is Pikesville pretty decent juice for the $? I really love using it for manhattans or my fave drink of the moment, Rye N Stormy. :)

Cheers,

B~

sku
11-15-2010, 16:39
Absolutely agree. It's one of the best bangs for your buck in American whiskey. Of course, at 80 proof, it's also lower abv than Rittenhouse, but still good stuff, and great for rye cocktails.

http://recenteats.blogspot.com/2009/09/whiskey-wednesday-budget-booze-take.html

humchan2k
11-15-2010, 16:59
*e-high five*

A sage of wisdom about booze agrees....so I'm not out of my mind, sa-weet. ;)

sku
11-15-2010, 17:03
Sage? Well, thanks for that, but far from it. I'm just another smartass with a blog (though I do, of course, know where to find those BTACs in LA).

SMOWK
11-15-2010, 17:20
Agreed! The low proof and light nature of the whiskey makes RittBIB a step above. I've only recently acquired a bottle of Pikesville, and I will buy another.

CorvallisCracker
11-15-2010, 17:21
Never had Pikesville, but a semi-local store started carrying it not long ago.

Say you lived in some Mythical Land(1) where prices were set not by market forces but by Wizards(2) who base them on Secret Lore. In this place WT rye is priced at $22.95 and Rittenhouse BiB and Pikesville both at $21.45. Would the Pikesville still be worth buying?

(BTW, I like WT Rye)


1. Oregon
2. The OLCC

SMOWK
11-15-2010, 17:23
Say you lived in some Mythical Land(1) where prices were set not by market forces but by Wizards(2) who base them on Secret Lore. In this place WT rye is priced at $22.95 and Rittenhouse BiB and Pikesville both at $21.45. Would the Pikesville still be worth buying?

No. RittBIB would win every time. I would buy the WTRye, but not as often as the RittBIB. I found out recently that WTRye was better than WTRRRye.

humchan2k
11-15-2010, 17:28
the OLCC are Grand Visars of idiocy....

Yeah, if Pikesville is $21 and Rittenhouse is too, you gotta go with Rittenhouse. Hell, for me, unless I step to buy some High West Rendezvous Rye for $50, you can't beat Rittenhouse. I think Rittenhouse is better than baby Saz, I think it's the best rye you can get for under $50.....

That said, if you go somewhere not evil like OR, Pikesville is good. :)

imbibehour
11-15-2010, 18:44
I am seriously trying to score some for a tasting...

me want!

White Dog
11-16-2010, 08:54
Wow, do I love this thread.

RittBIB and WTRye continuously battle for my soul. They are quite distinct from one another, so my preference will vary from day to day, but I agree that these two Ryes are the best under $40. (Baby Saz and WTRRRye pale in comparison.)

Humchan2k, feel lucky that you have access to both Pikesville and RittBIB, as both have left the shelves of Wisconsin months ago, and no one knows when they will return. I do like Pikesville as an 80 proofer, and I also enjoy Ritt80 whenever I can find it, as I did yesterday in a dusty, sleepy liquor store for $11.49. I feel that both are way better than Overholt and JBRye. Not to be a Beam hater, but Fortune Brands makes crappy straight Rye, IMHO. (If you want any type of rye flavor from them, drink OGD114.)

A plea to all producers: The world needs some 8 to 12yr Ryes at around 100proof. Rye drinkers beg you. And for goodness sake, please stop tanking your old Rye!

PAspirit1
11-16-2010, 17:50
I just bought a bottle and I like it. I'm not sure how it stacks up against other 80 or around 80 proofers. I think the only two bottles under a 100 proof I've had in a long time are Bulleit and EWSB.

sku
11-16-2010, 18:27
A plea to all producers: The world needs some 8 to 12yr Ryes at around 100proof. Rye drinkers beg you.

Van Winkle is pretty close to that.

White Dog
11-16-2010, 19:15
Van Winkle is pretty close to that.

I love VWFRR, but a portion of that is actually a tanked 19yr. Plus, it's highly allocated. We need some variety in the world of Rye. It's either young stuff like Turkey and Ritt, or the glorious old Medley stuff that puts me in the poor house. And yes, I do love Handy. But compared to Bourbon, Rye lovers are left with very few options. Oh well.

sku
11-16-2010, 19:56
I love VWFRR, but a portion of that is actually a tanked 19yr. Plus, it's highly allocated. We need some variety in the world of Rye. It's either young stuff like Turkey and Ritt, or the glorious old Medley stuff that puts me in the poor house. And yes, I do love Handy. But compared to Bourbon, Rye lovers are left with very few options. Oh well.

As a rye fan, I definitely hear you. All of the new LDI ryes add some profiles to the mix though, as well as some of the micro and other newer ryes out there.

spy247
11-19-2010, 00:34
I love Pikesville its a great Rye. Its a cut above Overholt and Jim Beam Rye. It makes a great Manhattan.

However I do prefer the Rit BIB over Pikesville. Its cost approx $10 more here in Australia and its a jump in quality. That said I always keep a bottle of Pikesville in the cupboard.

sailor22
11-19-2010, 08:39
I love VWFRR, but a portion of that is actually a tanked 19yr. Plus, it's highly allocated. We need some variety in the world of Rye. It's either young stuff like Turkey and Ritt, or the glorious old Medley stuff that puts me in the poor house. And yes, I do love Handy. But compared to Bourbon, Rye lovers are left with very few options. Oh well.

Lots of great Rye around.

I'm a big fan of Pikesville also, but hardly ever drink it as a sipper. It makes such good Manhattans and there are better sippers. Lots of good Rye available but Pikesville seems the best value as the Ritt I have bought havent been very good. Some samples sent by friends have been much better.

Because of it's short supply It might be a crime of some sort to use Van Winkle Rye in a Manhattan (although it makes a great one:rolleyes: ).

JMHO but I think the High West Ryes are all really good with the Rendezvous making some knock out Manhattans and the 16 and 21 making delightful sippers. Also look for a new version from them that is a vatting of a two yr and 16yr that is different and really good, and probably at a good price point. I think their Rye new make is going to be bottled soon as a clear Rye also and it's tasty and a good mixer.

Baby Saz is really good juice, the Saz 18 is a classic world class whiskey and I loves me some Handy on the right night.

The Vintage 21 and 23 are from the same stocks as BMH and I believe the Rtitt 21 and older ryes - plenty of good drinking in those bottles if your taste runs to Rye with more wood.

Overholt Rye makes a decent Manhattan as does Beam and Turkey - the Turkey is complex enough to be a sipper as is Russles Reserve Rye. Beam's Ri is a tasty pour if you can get past the bottle and marketing.

I'm hearing Fleichman's Rye is a huge bargain although I haven't tasted any yet. Seems like I heard it came from the same source as Pikesville but I don't know for sure.

I'm sure I forgot a few but it seems to me there is some good Rye to choose from.

nivto
11-19-2010, 09:29
Steve - what was the name of that Rye that I tried at your place the other night. I'm pretty sure you said it was (or close to) a 100% Rye mash bill. I really enjoyed that pour but I can't for the life of me remember what it was.

sailor22
11-19-2010, 15:32
Pretty sure you are talking about the Old Portrero Hotelings. And I forgot to mention the three Old Ports. Since all the Old Ports are 100% Rye mash they have really helped me understand exactly what tastes in a whiskey are contributed by the Rye.

dgonano
11-20-2010, 17:42
Well I still have some Pikesville Maryland Straight Rye...really good stuff. As for the current version, it is just HH rye (distilled at B-F?). The 3 yr old is Pikesville, the 4 to 6 yr is Rittenhouse. Makes a good Sazerac and Manhattan.

SMOWK
11-20-2010, 19:14
Well I still have some Pikesville Maryland Straight Rye...really good stuff. As for the current version, it is just HH rye (distilled at B-F?). The 3 yr old is Pikesville, the 4 to 6 yr is Rittenhouse. Makes a good Sazerac and Manhattan.

My girlfriend's father says he used to drink a lot of that stuff. And it was excellent.

ethangsmith
11-21-2010, 09:02
I would think Rittenhouse and Pikesville have different mashbills. If you go back in history a few short decades, Rittenhouse was made by Continental Distilling in Philadelphia as a higher-end Pennsylvania-style rye. Pikesville was made by Standard Distillers (I think?) outside Baltimore and was a higher-end Maryland-style rye. While both are now made by Heaven Hill, Maryland-style and Pennsylvania-style ryes often varied from one another in mashbill and flavor.

Yesterday I went down to Baltimore to a liquor store and while I was there (Maybe a half-hour), at least 4 bottles of Pikesville flew off the shelf. I was amazed at the pace at which it seems to be sold down there. The bottle I had of Pikesville wasn't too impressive, but I think I'd have to go back and try it again because at the time I was really into the milder, sweeter wheated bourbons. I LOVE Rittenhouse BIB. Next time I'm down in Baltimore I may pick up another bottle of Pikesville. I just wish it was 4-6yo and 86 proof!

dgonano
11-22-2010, 07:33
Pikesville was 4yr Rye in the early to mid 2000's. Some SB members may still have a bottle as I handed out a few at"04 KBF". A few year's ago it was changed to a 3yr and was more widely distributed. I doubt if the mashbill is different from Rittenhouse.

doubleblank
11-22-2010, 07:45
I still have my bottle Dave and it's unopened. I'm not a big fan of rye, but will open it to see how it compares to Ritt.

Was it really in '04? Boy, time flies.

Randy

dgonano
11-22-2010, 08:06
Randy, I think it was the same year you brought the Van Blankle. But it could have been '05. Anyway it would have a different taste profile than the "Ritt".
It is a good mixer.

JeffRenner
11-29-2010, 08:32
I'm hearing Fleichman's Rye is a huge bargain although I haven't tasted any yet. Seems like I heard it came from the same source as Pikesville but I don't know for sure.

I loved Fleishmann's rye and used to get a handle of it every time I went up to visit family in Wisconsin (the only place I ever saw it), but then about five years ago or so, it went from four to three years old and wasn't as good, and then shortly after, it disappeared. I don't think it's produced anymore.

It was light and full of rye, and I liked it on the rocks as a light before-dinner drink. (Aperitif seems like too fancy a word for it.)

jburlowski
11-29-2010, 15:52
I loved Fleishmann's rye and used to get a handle of it every time I went up to visit family in Wisconsin (the only place I ever saw it), but then about five years ago or so, it went from four to three years old and wasn't as good, and then shortly after, it disappeared. I don't think it's produced anymore.

It was light and full of rye, and I liked it on the rocks as a light before-dinner drink. (Aperitif seems like too fancy a word for it.)

It's still produced by Barton (Tom Moore). Jay at the Party Source is going to try to see if he can stock it.

White Dog
11-29-2010, 19:28
It's still produced by Barton (Tom Moore). Jay at the Party Source is going to try to see if he can stock it.

He better hurry up before it's all turned into Baby Saz.

JeffRenner
11-30-2010, 06:46
I loved Fleishmann's rye

So that searches can find this thread, I'm going to spell it correctly:

Fleischmann's rye.

Means flesh-man, or meat-man, no doubt a meat vendor.

foxflyer5
02-20-2011, 15:43
i just came across the Pikesville the other day. i had never seen it before and was curious, so i grabbed a bottle. not bad at all. i wanted to learn more and found a nice little write up here:

http://www.ellenjaye.com/majestic.htm

cowdery
02-20-2011, 17:29
Pikesville is a good rye. It's the same juice as Rittenhouse. It's just not widely available.

BourbonJoe
02-20-2011, 17:41
It's the same juice as Rittenhouse. It's just not widely available.

Is that possible with one being produced by Heaven Hill and the other by Tom Moore??
Joe :usflag:

squire
02-20-2011, 17:44
My only experience with Pikesville was some years ago when I picked up a bottle in Florida. It was 50% alcohol with no age statement but may have been BIB, 15 years ago is too long to remember. What I do recall though was a balanced whisky with a rich, full flavor.

cowdery
02-20-2011, 18:00
Is that possible with one being produced by Heaven Hill and the other by Tom Moore??
Joe :usflag:

What makes you think Pikesville is a Tom Moore product? It has long been produced by Heaven Hill. Tom Moore's rye is Flieschmann's.

imbibehour
02-21-2011, 13:52
Having had some... I dug it.. good value down here around these parts ;)

barturtle
02-21-2011, 14:01
Pikesville is a good rye. It's the same juice as Rittenhouse. It's just not widely available.

And it's not available as a bond. You'd hear more people talking about it if there was a 100 proofer available.

squire
02-21-2011, 16:49
Tim this was 15 years ago. I'm sure the proof was 100 but cannot swear the label said Bond although that is my memory, such as it is.

barturtle
02-21-2011, 20:33
Tim this was 15 years ago. I'm sure the proof was 100 but cannot swear the label said Bond although that is my memory, such as it is.

It'd have to be at least that long, or old stock, as in Regan's 1995 work it was 80 proof.

and it's Timothy or Barturtle.

squire
02-21-2011, 21:10
Could have been 17 years now that I think about it, which I haven't in years.

Josh
02-22-2011, 19:33
It'd have to be at least that long, or old stock, as in Regan's 1995 work it was 80 proof.

and it's Timothy or Barturtle.

Or Grand Pooh-Bear.

squire
02-22-2011, 19:52
My bad, Timothy has mentioned that to me before and I certainly meant no offense. It's just my memory is as short as my attent...attn... ah, what was I talking about, one of you kids go get my cane.

Josh
06-01-2011, 12:18
Pikesville is a good rye. It's the same juice as Rittenhouse. It's just not widely available.

I posed this question in a roundabout way in the Bulleit thread, but I'll pose it explicitly here:

Chuck has stated in a Rittenhouse thread that Ritt will be B-F distillate (presumably dsp 354) until 2013. What about Pikesville? Since it's younger, could it already be HH/Bernheim?

cowdery
06-01-2011, 15:39
I believe that was based on learning that DSP-KY-1 took over rye production in June of 2009, so best case scenario, the first 4-year-old from there will come of age in June, 2013. The first three-year from there will come of age in June of 2012.

How soon it will get to stores is another question.

The distillers all have to report how much whiskey they have aging, by age, although they don't have to break it out by type since it all taxes the same. That data used to be compiled and made public, though it no longer is. I assume the un-compiled reports are considered matters of public record. Any research eager beaver want to take that on? I made a few calls to the KY Dept. of Revenue a few years ago but didn't get very far.

Which is a long way of saying, I wish we knew how much of which type each distillery puts down each year. I know all of Heaven Hill's ryes are on allocation, and assume that's true industry-wide, but that's hard information to get.

fussychicken
06-01-2011, 23:24
I believe that was based on learning that DSP-KY-1 took over rye production in June of 2009, so best case scenario, the first 4-year-old from there will come of age in June, 2013. The first three-year from there will come of age in June of 2012.

At the Heaven Hill Whiskey tasting I went to last weekend (thanks HH & K&L!) I asked the HH sales rep this exact question about when the BIB will go DSP-1. She sent a message off "to her guy back in Kentucky" and she told me in "about 2 years." I know, not a very robust source or answer, but correlates with your info Chuck.

Not all was lost though as I did get a chance to taste the Parker's 27 and Rittenhouse 25. Never thought I would agree with you guys on the Parker's but it was surprisingly not too woody! Or was that the 8 other HH samples we had preceding it clouding my taste buds?

p_elliott
06-02-2011, 09:10
I believe that was based on learning that DSP-KY-1 took over rye production in June of 2009, so best case scenario, the first 4-year-old from there will come of age in June, 2013. The first three-year from there will come of age in June of 2012.

How soon it will get to stores is another question.

The distillers all have to report how much whiskey they have aging, by age, although they don't have to break it out by type since it all taxes the same. That data used to be compiled and made public, though it no longer is. I assume the un-compiled reports are considered matters of public record. Any research eager beaver want to take that on? I made a few calls to the KY Dept. of Revenue a few years ago but didn't get very far.

Which is a long way of saying, I wish we knew how much of which type each distillery puts down each year. I know all of Heaven Hill's ryes are on allocation, and assume that's true industry-wide, but that's hard information to get.


Chuck

Won't there be a transitional period for a while, while BF continues to bottle up the rye they have left and HH starts bottling their rye?

Paul

AaronWF
06-02-2011, 10:18
What is the significance of the Ritt rye moving to a different distiller as far as what to expect in regards to quality going forward? I know we all love the B-F stuff; are there reasons to expect a quality downgrade or price hike when they start selling the HH juice?

Josh
06-02-2011, 10:34
What is the significance of the Ritt rye moving to a different distiller as far as what to expect in regards to quality going forward? I know we all love the B-F stuff; are there reasons to expect a quality downgrade or price hike when they start selling the HH juice?

That's the million $ question! Only time will tell.

cowdery
06-03-2011, 10:40
Chuck

Won't there be a transitional period for a while, while BF continues to bottle up the rye they have left and HH starts bottling their rye?

Paul

BF has never bottled anything. BF distilled it and immediately passed it off to HH, which barreled it and aged it in their warehouses. So the maturation won't change at all, just the distillate.

As for a transition, the BIB can't be mixed. It has to be all from the same DSP and the same season. And the DSP will be on the back label, so you'll know which you've gotten. Obviously they'll be mixed together on the shelf for some period as the old stuff moves through the pipeline.

For the 40% abv version, they can and probably will mix DSP-1 and DSP-354 juice together.

cowdery
06-03-2011, 10:43
What is the significance of the Ritt rye moving to a different distiller as far as what to expect in regards to quality going forward? I know we all love the B-F stuff; are there reasons to expect a quality downgrade or price hike when they start selling the HH juice?

The DSP-31 rye was fine. It's not like HH doesn't know how to make rye. I think it will be good. Whether it's exactly the same may be a different matter.

White Dog
06-03-2011, 11:43
This conversation leaves me wondering something else.

What will be the future of DSP-354's Rye production? Will they keep distilling Rye? If so, what would come of it?

As B-F is not the most dynamic Whiskey operation, IMHO, I don't expect them to come out with their own Rye label, although that would be a smart move on their part. Maybe they could sell Rye to another bottler?

Thoughts?:skep:

Rughi
06-03-2011, 12:58
...Maybe they could sell Rye to another bottler

Maybe they already are. :grin:

(No I don't have any inside info on that, but who knows what juice lurks in the heart of vats?))

Roger

cowdery
06-03-2011, 16:08
I know they are very proud of that rye, very proud (rightfully) of their contribution to its success. BF certainly doesn't create brands like a HH or BT does, but it wouldn't surprise me if, since they were making it anyway, they put down a few barrels of their own.

Their policy is that they will do contract distilling for the other majors but they aren't interested in making and aging whiskey for the spot market.

This fall's Masters Collection will be a rye, so that might be an indicator that they're considering it.

White Dog
06-06-2011, 11:28
I know they are very proud of that rye, very proud (rightfully) of their contribution to its success. BF certainly doesn't create brands like a HH or BT does, but it wouldn't surprise me if, since they were making it anyway, they put down a few barrels of their own.

Their policy is that they will do contract distilling for the other majors but they aren't interested in making and aging whiskey for the spot market.

This fall's Masters Collection will be a rye, so that might be an indicator that they're considering it.

That's a Masters Collection that I may actually buy. Chuck, do you know anything else about it? Age in particular?

cowdery
06-06-2011, 13:27
It's in the range of eight years. It's 100% rye, using both malted and unmalted rye grain. They used two different barrel entry proofs and also aged it in both new and used barrels. I'm not sure which combination they'll actually launch this fall, but I think it will be the used barrels one.

schlep
09-19-2011, 12:09
Sounds like a new rendition of Lot No. 40.