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wripvanwrinkle
02-12-2011, 13:37
While at the liquor store today, I spotted an unfamiliar bottle. “Breckenridge Bourbon Whiskey”, from the Breckenridge Distillery from (you might have guessed it) Breckenridge, Colorado. My mind was momentarily set a fire with dreams of tasting a new local distillate. But then my eyes saw the “2 year” statement and disappointment started to set in. Is it possible that this whiskey could have slipped my radar for so long?

I passed, preferring to do a little research before pulling the trigger. After visiting their website, the producer is clear that the whiskey was sourced:

http://www.breckenridgedistillery.com/home/breckenridge-vodka/ (http://www.breckenridgedistillery.com/home/breckenridge-vodka/)

I’m a supporter of our local micro-distilleries. I enjoy the opportunity of tasting something that is both distinctive and unique. We have distillers like Peach Street that offer a superb 2 year old Bourbon (a fantastic dram mind you, that I gleefully present to all of my out of town whiskey loving friends with the pride of a high school football fan gloating over the next soon to be home town hero.)

I really appreciate those producers that sell sourced or mingled whiskey.

But I suppose that today I picked a side of the fence regarding the whole “selling someone else’s product while mine is aging issue.” Small distillers please don’t mix the two approaches.

I suppose that I have started to feel duplicity within the approach.

I understand that you might need some funding, but why build your reputation on something that was not yours? You are targeting the local consumer, who is going to buy the product with home town pride. In doing so you are diluting purchases from those local distillers who are making what bears their name.

Producers, please continue to sell excellent sourced whiskey. Small distillers, if you choose to do so then please don’t include your distillery’s name within the product’s name.

For now though, I am going to wait a couple of years as their own whiskey continues to age. I eagerly await the results.

[edit: fixed format]

barturtle
02-12-2011, 13:48
In the future please hit the "remove formatting button" looks like an "A" crossed out, so people can actually read your post regardless of what forun style (color style) they are using. black on charcoal in not fun to read.

Josh
02-13-2011, 13:46
But I suppose that today I picked a side of the fence regarding the whole “selling someone else’s product while mine is aging issue.” Small distillers please don’t mix the two approaches.

I suppose that I have started to feel duplicity within the approach.

I understand that you might need some funding, but why build your reputation on something that was not yours? You are targeting the local consumer, who is going to buy the product with home town pride. In doing so you are diluting purchases from those local distillers who are making what bears their name.

Producers, please continue to sell excellent sourced whiskey. Small distillers, if you choose to do so then please don’t include your distillery’s name within the product’s name.

For now though, I am going to wait a couple of years as their own whiskey continues to age. I eagerly await the results.

[edit: fixed format]

Formatting issues aside, well put.:bowdown:

sailor22
02-13-2011, 14:03
I really don't care where it comes from as long as it is disclosed as sourced. If it tastes good I'm an appreciative purchaser.

wripvanwrinkle
02-15-2011, 20:26
In general Sailor, I agree with you. I will continue to buy the current expression of Whistle Pig as long as it exists. I enjoy Heaven Hill, regardless of whose name is on the label. Heck, I don't even take issue with Templeton...as I think that they have little intent to bottle anything of their own. I certainly could care less if a big distillery blends in another big distilleries ouput, as long as their profile remains the same.

But to me, part of appeal of a small distillery is the promise of something unique.

Futhermore, I feel that there is something of a bait and switch going on. What will the small distilery who chooses this route ultimately do, release a batch of follow up whiskey called "My Home Town Distillery Bourbon (But This Time Actually Distilled By Me!)".

squire
02-16-2011, 16:21
I'm waiting for a producer to come out with a good vatting.

wripvanwrinkle
02-16-2011, 17:31
Not a bourbon, but I would say that the recent releases of VWFRR13 are a pretty fine vatting. Again, not bourbon...but Compass Box has never done me wrong either.

squire
02-16-2011, 18:57
I was thinking of a vatting of whiskys produced by different distilleries creating more complexity than the product of a single distilery.

squire
02-16-2011, 18:58
And I wouldn't mind if the vatting included ryes.

cowdery
02-16-2011, 19:05
That's essentially what the yellow/beige label Four Roses is, a vatting of ten or more different bourbons ("more" because they sometimes use one of the 10 recipes at two different ages). Their single barrel, small batch and limited edition iterations get all the attention but the basic Four Roses is a superb whiskey.

squire
02-16-2011, 19:15
Yes, exactly Chuck, along the Four Roses pattern but with richer, bolder complementary flavors showing age, complexity and finesse.

I like the regular Four Roses profile but the flavor is a bit light for my tastes.

cowdery
02-16-2011, 22:39
Yes, exactly Chuck, along the Four Roses pattern but with richer, bolder complementary flavors showing age, complexity and finesse.

I like the regular Four Roses profile but the flavor is a bit light for my tastes.

Don't you wish they'd do the same product but at 100 proof?

wripvanwrinkle
02-17-2011, 07:25
So I thought of an anaglogy. Let's pretend:

I normally buy my produce from the local Meglo Mart grocery store. I am a big fan of corn, and just can't get enough. The Meglo Mart normally buys their corn from Brazil. It is in fact really good corn.

Eating corn becomes fasionable in my community. My friends and I get together, and talk about its nuances. This community grows. Yes, I have become a corn geek.

The local farmers catch wind of this trend, and start planting their own corn. Due to organic techniques, effects of the micro-climate, and a little home-spun marketing, the farmers of my community can produce a corn that differs in some subtle way from the mass imported product from Brazil. Mmmm, cinanamon!

Over time, more and more small farmers spring up. Each produces a unique and interesting product. Flimsy ply-wood road side stands go up in front of American Gothic farm houses. Large red barns hide the modest fertile fields behind. The better farmers get good reputations, and my corn loving friends know all of their names.

And then one day I drive down the rode and see a new farm that I have never noticed before. Out by the curb is a new face selling his locally grown product. Corn takes a little while to grow, so I am surprised that I have never heard about it. I go home, find is website, only to learn that he is selling Brazilian Corn while his corn continues to grow.

Should I feel hustled?

And yes, from the perspective of Colorado...Indiana/Kentucky might as well be Brazil. ;-)

Josh
02-17-2011, 08:01
So I thought of an anaglogy. Let's pretend:

And yes, from the perspective of Colorado...Indiana/Kentucky might as well be Brazil. ;-)

There is a Brazil, Indiana. It's the former Home of popcorn tycoon Orville Reddenbacher, and 1980s two-hit wonder Henry Lee Summer and birthplace of Jimmy Hoffa.

sailor22
02-17-2011, 09:13
Would Parkers Heritage #3 qualify as a vatting ? Given the diversity of HH products and aging locations it would seem fair to call it a vatting. Or am I missing something.

squire
02-17-2011, 15:41
I wish they would Chuck, I would certainly buy it though for the proof rather than expecting a big change. In comparison I like the FR Small Batch just as is at 45%.

cowdery
02-17-2011, 15:56
Would Parkers Heritage #3 qualify as a vatting ? Given the diversity of HH products and aging locations it would seem fair to call it a vatting. Or am I missing something.

"Vatting" has never really been part of the American whiskey landscape so there are no real guidelines. By law, a combination of two different kinds of whiskey is a blended whiskey, even if it is all whiskey and contains no GNS. I have argued that this is unfortunate, but it is the law. A vatting, then, as distinguished from a blend, would be a mixture of whiskeys all of the same type but different because of where or when they were made, or even because of recipe differences that don't alter their type. If it's all bourbon and made in one state then it's straight bourbon, even though the components can be as different as any set of bourbons you can name. You can, for instance, vat a wheater and a rye-recipe and it's still straight bourbon. You can vat a 4-year-old with a 20-year old (like the Parker's), etc.

squire
02-17-2011, 15:57
sailor I think of vatting as a combination of whiskys sourced from different distilleries. A whole being greater than the sum of its parts sort of thing.

Presuming the same mashbill and yeast a melding of whiskys made at the same distillery is a combination of the same liquor and is a single product much like a Scottish single malt.

Four Roses is an exception due to it's production of different whiskys under the same roof and blending them together. A vatting, certainly, and apparently a successful one.

sailor22
02-17-2011, 17:42
Presuming the same mashbill and yeast

This is what I was referring to when I mentioned HH's diversity. Seems that have at least two mash bills and I would presume several yeast options.

squire
02-17-2011, 17:57
At least four I should think, Wheat whisky, Rye whisky and Bourbon made with wheat or rye.

cowdery
02-18-2011, 15:52
Based on a visit to the cooler where Heaven Hill keeps their yeast I would say they use one yeast for everything. I also assume they're running two bourbons (rye/wheat), a rye, a wheat, and a corn. I also know they have recently experimented with malt whiskey, so that's six mash bills.

squire
02-18-2011, 17:00
Forgot about the corn, the malt sounds interesting. An experiment you say?

cowdery
02-18-2011, 22:26
Forgot about the corn, the malt sounds interesting. An experiment you say?

When I tasted it with Parker and Craig Beam, and a table full of writers a few years ago it was pretty young and no one was very impressed. I haven't heard it mentioned since. It was the year of the first Parker's release, whenever that was. It was maybe two, three years old then.