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T Comp
12-10-2011, 13:50
Shanken News Daily reported on December 8 about a 12% first half growth in sales for Brown-Forman. We know that Beam has also reported having a great sales year led by Jim Beam and Makers. I found interesting this reference to Nielsen data and quote from the Brown-Forman CEO as contained in the Shanken news piece.


"Brown-Forman chairman and CEO Paul Varga noted that Nielsen data in the 12 months through November 12 showed U.S. spirits growth by dollar sales accelerating at 3.4% from 1.8% a year ago. More importantly for Brown-Forman, the whiskey category rose 5.4% over the past 12 months, outpacing the spirits market by two full percentage points. 'This is a real shift versus what we’ve seen over the past 10 or 20 years,' Varga said, referring to the rise of vodka at brown spirits’ expense over that time period."
Is it a real shift happening or is it the CEO just being a CEO?

jburlowski
12-10-2011, 15:20
Clearly, bourbon is on a growth trajectory... production was up some 18% in the last year. It's gaining, but its got a long way to go (unfortunately) to catch vodka.

Some here might be surprised to learn that Sazerac / BT , for example, gets more of its sales from vodka than from bourbon (or any other spirit).

DeanSheen
12-10-2011, 19:09
Some here might be surprised to learn that Sazerac / BT , for example, gets more of its sales from vodka than from bourbon (or any other spirit).

By volume? (vs. income)

jburlowski
12-11-2011, 07:04
I was told this by a BT person and I believe he meant both (volume & dollars).

ethangsmith
12-11-2011, 14:13
I don't, and probably never will, understand the whole vodka thing. What is the great attraction to some gut-rot, flavorless, foul-smelling liquid? I know people like it for its neutral mixing properties, but isn't the whole point of a mixed drink to combine different flavors to make something wonderful- not just mixing a bunch of fruit juices and liquors with paint stripper? Living in PA, it's so frustrating walking into our government liquor stores and seeing an entire wall of vodka next to our 3 or 4 little shelves of bourbon. Plus, everyone that I know around here that is a vodka drinker is nuts. I don't think that helps my image of the product either.

dmarkle
12-11-2011, 15:55
I don't, and probably never will, understand the whole vodka thing.

The attraction is that you don't have to age it, so producing it is cheap and immediate. And you can mix it with anything to booze up everything from Coca-Cola to Kool-Aid, and that will always be popular.

I frankly doubt anything aged will ever sell in the same volumes as vodka, internationally. It's probably a different story in Scotland, though... ;-)

ethangsmith
12-11-2011, 16:31
True. If you're a twenty-something and looking to just get smashed and "be cool" at a party, then vodka is probably your thing. I'm 28 and pretty much the only person my age I know of that drinks only American whiskies. I tried some vodka once and it instantly made me nauseous. The smell and industrial alcohol flavor are horrendous. A wise man once told me-

Never drink an alcohol that has not been distilled, and never drink a distilled alcohol that isn't aged. Only the combination of distillation and aging remove impurities and make a product that won't rot your insides.

I'd tend to believe this information too. Just look at Parker Beam, Elmer T. Lee, Jimmy Russell, and Dick Stoll (Master Distiller of the famous Michter's in Pennsylvania). They're all up in years and are in very good health for their age. Must be something in that bourbon and rye........

ratcheer
12-11-2011, 20:45
And you can mix it with anything to booze up everything from Coca-Cola to Kool-Aid, and that will always be popular.

... It's probably a different story in Scotland, though.

But, did you know that in Scotland the most popular way they consume scotch is mixed with lemonade? !!!

It is not exactly the same thing we call lemonade though, it is something carbonated. But, it's not like Sprite, either.

Tim

Beer&Bourbon
12-11-2011, 21:13
But, did you know that in Scotland the most popular way they consume scotch is mixed with lemonade? !!!

It is not exactly the same thing we call lemonade though, it is something carbonated. But, it's not like Sprite, either.

Tim

I've not been, but I was under the impression that it is something like 7up/ sprite. Is it more like the limonata from San Pelligrino, then? (If you're not familiar, it's a sparkling bitter lemon juice drink.) Regardless I don't understand the desire to put scotch into it.

luther.r
12-11-2011, 21:57
never drink a distilled alcohol that isn't aged. Only the combination of distillation and aging remove impurities and make a product that won't rot your insides.


There are some blanco tequilas that are outstanding. I've had some great un-aged grappas in Italy too. I agree that vodka tastes terrible though.

trumpstylz
12-12-2011, 03:00
But, did you know that in Scotland the most popular way they consume scotch is mixed with lemonade? !!!

It is not exactly the same thing we call lemonade though, it is something carbonated. But, it's not like Sprite, either.

Tim

In Britain a lot of the guys said they mixed scotch with coke.

Brisko
12-12-2011, 08:08
In Britain a lot of the guys said they mixed scotch with coke.

Remember they eat haggis, too.:skep:


I don't mind decent vodka occasionally. It mixes well with clear sodas, I think, and can be really refreshing that way, or with fruit juices. Or just on ice. Also if I'm going to be in a long drinking session with friends, vodka is a lot kinder the next day than other cheap spirits, and a lot kinder to my midsection than beer. It can also be a nice accompaniment to a meal with a lot of strong flavors-- not overpowering or fighting with everything else.

That said I haven't had a drink of vodka in over a year.:cool:

ratcheer
12-12-2011, 08:32
I've not been, but I was under the impression that it is something like 7up/ sprite. Is it more like the limonata from San Pelligrino, then? (If you're not familiar, it's a sparkling bitter lemon juice drink.) Regardless I don't understand the desire to put scotch into it.

Yes, I am familiar with the San Pellegrino, in fact I have two cases of it now. But no, I am not exactly sure what they use in Scotland, but I have read about it in several places. I don't understand why they do it, either, except that most people seem to prefer to cut their liquors into something less overpowering. It is only a minority (people like us) who insist on discerning the full-strength flavor nuances.

I was at a Christmas party this past weekend where a large, fairly expensive bottle of bourbon was open on the table. I was the only person I saw drink it on the rocks. Everyone else mixed it with Coke or Sprite. :rolleyes:

Tim

StraightNoChaser
12-12-2011, 13:35
Actually it's going to be the reverse soon. I keep seeing all these bottles of transparent liquor out there mislabeled as "whiskey" and not vodka

Josh
12-12-2011, 13:50
Remember they eat haggis, too.:skep:

You ever had haggis? It's not as bad as it looks or sounds.

AaronWF
12-12-2011, 13:57
Hangar One is a great vodka. It's distilled by St. George Spirits from wheat and viognier grapes. If I recall correctly, it has a clean, sweet creaminess that keeps it engaging throughout the sip, and I enjoy it straight.

Er, I should say enjoyed; the last bottle I bought has been sitting untouched and half-empty for over a year and a half. Because, like they say, once you go brown...

Once you go brown, forever down
Once you go brown, all else brings a frown
Once you go brown, wood gets the crown

StraightNoChaser
12-12-2011, 14:06
I went to the SGS distillery in Alameda years ago before I ever got into whiskey... it was a fun time, they are really proud of their products and I consider them to be "craft" at least at the very minimum definition.

Brisko
12-12-2011, 15:05
You ever had haggis? It's not as bad as it looks or sounds.

Actually, no. I think I'll take your word for it :grin:

ratcheer
12-13-2011, 06:25
You can see about haggis on this page:

http://www.aquiziam.com/ten-strange-british-foods.html

Tim

White Dog
12-13-2011, 19:30
Hangar One is a great vodka. It's distilled by St. George Spirits from wheat and viognier grapes. If I recall correctly, it has a clean, sweet creaminess that keeps it engaging throughout the sip, and I enjoy it straight.

Er, I should say enjoyed; the last bottle I bought has been sitting untouched and half-empty for over a year and a half. Because, like they say, once you go brown...

Once you go brown, forever down
Once you go brown, all else brings a frown
Once you go brown, wood gets the crown

Actually, it's rectified by Hangar, or should I say St. George. They start with GNS, so I would not say that they actually "distill" their vodka. They do distill the Viognier and blend it with their rectified GNS.

Josh
12-13-2011, 19:57
What a waste of Viognier!

wripvanwrinkle
12-13-2011, 19:57
You ever had haggis? It's not as bad as it looks or sounds.

I now mistrust you like I mistrust a Japanese customer who offered me the eye of a raw fish (whose meat we were collectively picking off the bones) as he said "It is a great honor!"

ILLfarmboy
12-13-2011, 21:19
I now mistrust you like I mistrust a Japanese customer who offered me the eye of a raw fish (whose meat we were collectively picking off the bones) as he said "It is a great honor!"

I take it you're not a fan of that show show Bizzare Foods.

My Dad tells the story about his uncle and Granddad butchering a steer when "an old Swedish woman", some shirt tail relation of ours, held a glass under its throat as it bled out. She drank it down like it was the best thing ever. Never tryed it, myself. I like carpaccio, though.