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SeaninSD
01-16-2012, 11:05
New guy question for you, I keep reading about the "SB blend" of OWA and WL 12 and wondered why / how it works? Meaning, why is the sum better than the parts? I've only ever had OWA as WL 12 seems hard to find around here, so I haven't tried the SB blend, but hopefully will soon. If the WL 12 is the "better" bourbon, compared to the OWA, why mix them at a 1 to 1 ratio? Not doubting the results, just curious how / why it works and what you like about it. Thanks!

luther.r
01-16-2012, 11:16
New guy question for you, I keep reading about the "SB blend" of OWA and WL 12 and wondered why / how it works? Meaning, why is the sum better than the parts? I've only ever had OWA as WL 12 seems hard to find around here, so I haven't tried the SB blend, but hopefully will soon. If the WL 12 is the "better" bourbon, compared to the OWA, why mix them at a 1 to 1 ratio? Not doubting the results, just curious how / why it works and what you like about it. Thanks!

Because the OWA is higher proof, which many of us prefer. If they offered a 107 proof 12-year I think most people would like it best of the current Wellers. By mixing the 90 proof 12-year and the 107 proof ~7 year, you get something that's a little more aged than the OWA and a little higher proof than the 12.

Gillman
01-16-2012, 11:19
Each, being the same bourbon but at different levels of aging and proof, will have an intentionally different palate, a "profile". I'd argue that Weller 12 is not better, but different.

Blending the two, or what is technically "mingling" (both are bourbons from the same house and no neutral spirits or other things are added), will produce a third palate that pleases many. Also, the proof will alter to that of the average of the two, upwards of 100 proof. Some people like a bourbon stronger than 90 but less strong than 107.

Distilleries blend (mingle) bourbons all the time, i.e., mix bourbons of different ages to get a profile deemed suitable for the public taste. We can do it too, it's not an arcane science but more the idea to balance characteristics or arrange them in a certain way to get a result that is liked. While 1:1 seems popular, indeed to the point of being dubbed the "SB" approach for this mingling, many other options are available. You can mix them in different proportions, introduce 90 proof W.L. Weller Special Reserve in the picture and/or the BTAC William Larue Weller, or indeed rye-recipe bourbons from Buffalo Trace or even other distilleries.

It's good to start, for those inclined, in a simple way and then develop it from there.

Gary

Gillman
01-16-2012, 13:12
Another good mingling of the two would be to add just enough Weller 12 to OWA to bring the latter's proof to 100, a nice round number, but also, you are "seasoning" the younger bourbon with some older. The younger element dominates but is leavened by the gravitas of age. A May-to-December marriage.

Gary

cowdery
01-16-2012, 14:29
For the sake of the newbie, I should mention that Mr. Gillman is our leading authority on such matters, to the point where a subtle blend of two or more bourbons is known as "a gillman," and the process of making them is, of course, "gillmanizing."

jcg9779
01-16-2012, 14:39
For the sake of the newbie, I should mention that Mr. Gillman is our leading authority on such matters, to the point where a subtle blend of two or more bourbons is known as "a gillman," and the process of making them is, of course, "gillmanizing."

Mr. Gillman served a gillman after showing the art of gillmanizing.

Gillman
01-16-2012, 16:35
Thanks gents, and of course the question was perfectly legitimate and indeed understandable. Mixing the hard liquors in your bar, outside the cocktails context, is not something encountered every day.

I did try to give a short explanation though of why I think it's justified to do this. (That said, I know many bourbon veterans who shy away from it, and that's fine of course).

I've always felt, honestly without false modesty although I appreciate the nod, that no name, my own or any other, should be attached to the practice. It's so intuitive and logical that nothing of the sort is warranted.

Gary

P.S. I'm mixing threads this time (sorry), but can't help but note that that was a great line you got off about bitters when they taste bad, Chuck: one of your best. :)

SeaninSD
01-16-2012, 19:56
Thanks for all the replies and the information. I do understand the reason for the blend / mingle now. And with my day off today, I was able to find some WL 12 so I'll be trying the SB blend soon.

Old Lamplighter
01-16-2012, 21:15
If you get a chance or if Weller 12 is hard to find in the future, give a WSR & OWA mingling a try as well. I tried it prior to 12 & OWA. Not quite the depth but every bit as good.

cowdery
01-16-2012, 22:45
The idea to combine W12 and OWA is brilliant and actually very much like what the distilleries do.

jcg9779
01-16-2012, 23:22
Thanks for all the replies and the information. I do understand the reason for the blend / mingle now. And with my day off today, I was able to find some WL 12 so I'll be trying the SB blend soon.

The "SB Blend" also vaguely refers to trying to find a close match to Weller Centennial. Weller Centennial was a 10 year, 100 proof bourbon and by blending Weller 12 with OWA at a 1:1 ratio you get a bourbon that is almost 9 years and 98.5 proof. Not quite the same but fairly close.

fishnbowljoe
01-16-2012, 23:39
If you get a chance or if Weller 12 is hard to find in the future, give a WSR & OWA mingling a try as well. I tried it prior to 12 & OWA. Not quite the depth but every bit as good.

I like the Weller 12 the way it is. My vatting is OWA and Weller SR too. The one I most recently did was of two private bottlings. Kahn's OWA and Everett's Weller SR. Delicious. :yum:

SeaninSD
01-18-2012, 20:17
I tried the SB Blend for the first time tonight. First I tried the OWA and WL 12 separately and then tried the blend; I do like the blend better than the two parts as it seems smoother, less bite, and has more wood flavor. I like the blend and may blend up a full bottle.

greens
01-19-2012, 00:09
What was the blend ratio on this again? 1/3rd OWA and 2/3rds Weller 12 or half and half of each? I can't recall.

Ejmharris
01-19-2012, 07:29
What was the blend ratio on this again? 1/3rd OWA and 2/3rds Weller 12 or half and half of each? I can't recall.

It is 1:1. So half of each. I plan to go get one of each soon to start experimenting a little with blending. I have each right now but I already enjoy both by themselves. I do have to put a splash of water in the OWA though.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

clingman71
01-19-2012, 13:14
What was the blend ratio on this again? 1/3rd OWA and 2/3rds Weller 12 or half and half of each? I can't recall.

It can be whatever ratio suits you. I've done 1:1 and enjoyed it. I have also blended a 1l W12 with a 750 OWA, enjoyed this as well. I also save the old bottles so that as I blend, I only fill the bottles to 2/3 or 3/4 full to air it a bit.

Flyfish
03-26-2012, 14:52
It is not exactly gillmanizing, but I like to have my Weller 12 YO and OWA side-by-side rather than mingled. Take sniff of this and then a sniff of that; a sip of this and then take a sip of that. A lot to like in both. I don't think you have to choose one or the other, compromise or "triangulate." Why not just have both and be done with it?

clingman71
03-26-2012, 15:46
It is not exactly gillmanizing, but I like to have my Weller 12 YO and OWA side-by-side rather than mingled. Take sniff of this and then a sniff of that; a sip of this and then take a sip of that. A lot to like in both. I don't think you have to choose one or the other, compromise or "triangulate." Why not just have both and be done with it?

There is magic and mojo that occurs after a month or two of being mingled in the bottle. If I were you, I'd mix up some SB blend and let it do its thing for awhile. Then have a three pour tasting of the OWA, W12, & SB blend. I'm not sure why I haven't done this myself.

dridge11
03-26-2012, 15:48
Doing a bourbon tasting next week, might have to try this gillman for the first time in our Weller flight.

wadewood
03-26-2012, 16:56
My vote is for blending the following:

1.75l of OWA - 107 proof
1.75l of Weller 12
.75l of WLW (above 129 proof)

smokinjoe
03-26-2012, 17:36
My vote is for blending the following:

1.75l of OWA - 107 proof
1.75l of Weller 12
.75l of WLW (above 129 proof)

In what? A 5 gallon Home Depot Orange Bucket?

Tico
03-26-2012, 18:51
In what? A 5 gallon Home Depot Orange Bucket?

And stir it up with a home depot paint stick :cool:

Clavius
03-26-2012, 18:57
In what? A 5 gallon Home Depot Orange Bucket?
Even better, a homebrewing "Ale Pail" with a spigot! :lol:

timd
03-26-2012, 22:23
In what? A 5 gallon Home Depot Orange Bucket?
Maybe a 5 liter barrel for a week or so? Could even top off with some water (heaven forbid!) or possibly a splash of straight Rye to add another layer of complexity.

I wouldn't leave it in the wood for too long - otherwise it could get funky with a small new barrel, but letting it sit for a few days wouldn't hurt - and could help the process - plus leave you with some great flavors on the wood for aging something else.

dridge11
04-04-2012, 21:26
Did the 1:1 blend tonight in a blind tasting, it was side by side with new Pappy 15 and it was tough to decide which we preferred. The SB blend is legit, I will be making more for sure. Will post a detailed tasting report tomorrow.

sailor22
04-05-2012, 07:05
And stir it up with a home depot paint stick :cool:

A charred paint stick please.:grin:

Take the ratios Wade mentioned and use volumes more to your liking, my guess is it will be a worthy batch.

CorvallisCracker
04-05-2012, 07:49
I've been doing the SB blend since coming to Oregon (end of 2006). Don't know if Centennial was already off the market yet, but fer sure you couldn't get it here (as for the 12, I'm pretty sure I bought the last ones sold in the state, five dusty bottles marked "OLCC discontinued" I found in Springfield).

I started combining the 12 and OWA to create what I call "Almost Centennial". Because I was dong this before joining SB.com (early 2008) I continue to use my own term.

clingman71
04-05-2012, 08:12
I've been doing the SB blend since coming to Oregon (end of 2006). Don't know if Centennial was already off the market yet, but fer sure you couldn't get it here (as for the 12, I'm pretty sure I bought the last ones sold in the state, five dusty bottles marked "OLCC discontinued" I found in Springfield).

I started combining the 12 and OWA to create what I call "Almost Centennial". Because I was dong this before joining SB.com (early 2008) I continue to use my own term.

Semantics, the point is that the combination is very good.

CorvallisCracker
04-05-2012, 09:14
BTW, I know of at least one person who combines PVW 15 and 20, a combination I plan to try the next time I have open a bottle of each.

soad
04-28-2012, 07:33
The "SB Blend" also vaguely refers to trying to find a close match to Weller Centennial. Weller Centennial was a 10 year, 100 proof bourbon and by blending Weller 12 with OWA at a 1:1 ratio you get a bourbon that is almost 9 years and 98.5 proof. Not quite the same but fairly close.

Has anyone tried to blend ORWV 10/107 with a Weller 12? That blend could produce a 100 proofer that would "legally" be a 10 year bourbon. Even closer to an "almost Centennial"

I will have to wait until November/December for a chance to get another bottle of the ORVW, I will report back when I do.

clingman71
04-28-2012, 08:52
Has anyone tried to blend ORWV 10/107 with a Weller 12? That blend could produce a 100 proofer that would "legally" be a 10 year bourbon. Even closer to an "almost Centennial"

I will have to wait until November/December for a chance to get another bottle of the ORVW, I will report back when I do.

Or ORVW 10/107 & lot B, 11 years old average (I understand 10 is the youngest) and 98.5 proof. Sort of a modern BT almost VVOF? Or lot B and PVW 15?