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SSBourbon1
11-04-2003, 17:49
I was hunting around on the internet today and found that there is an ancient age 10 year and the newer (I would guess) ancient age 10 star. Is the 10 star still a 10 year bourbon?

tommy
11-04-2003, 18:14
I think that Ancient Ancient Age is the only ten-year-old in that lineup.

Tommy

Paradox
11-04-2003, 18:19
I did a search (http://www.straightbourbon.com/ubbthreads/search.php?Cat=) because I remember Ken Weber of Buffalo Trace talking about this a while back. In this post (http://www.straightbourbon.com/ubbthreads/showthreaded.php?Cat=&Board=General&Number=11706&F orum=All_Forums&Words=10%20star&Match=Entire%20Phr ase&Searchpage=0&Limit=25&Old=allposts&Main=11031& Search=true#Post11706), he talks about the Ancient Age lineup.

SSBourbon1
11-05-2003, 04:03
I always seem to forget that there is an extra Ancient in the name (AAA). The info was very helpful. The internet site that I Saw the AAA 10 year was in Europe somewhere, they actually had both and that was what confused me. The posting you listed cleared up my confusion. It is probably something (confusion that is) until the last of the AAA 10 year is really gone.

OneCubeOnly
11-05-2003, 09:29
I had no idea the AAA 10yo was so rare! Heck, in most state ABC stores I've visited, AAA is either on the bottom shelf or at BEST mid-shelf. It doesn't appear to be a big seller either. It's really a shame, because at $9.90/750ml it's a tremendous value.

OneCubeOnly
11-10-2003, 16:02
I did a search (http://www.straightbourbon.com/ubbthreads/search.php?Cat=) because I remember Ken Weber of Buffalo Trace talking about this a while back. In this post (http://www.straightbourbon.com/ubbthreads/showthreaded.php?Cat=&Board=General&Number=11706&F orum=All_Forums&Words=10%20star&Match=Entire%20Phr ase&Searchpage=0&Limit=25&Old=allposts&Main=11031& Search=true#Post11706), he talks about the Ancient Age lineup.



How do you guys interpret Ken's language in that post? He makes it clear that AAA 10yo is in short supply, but would that mean that the ONGOING supply can only support two states, or that the REMAINING supply can only stock two states with what's left? (I guess what I'm getting at is should I be BUNKERING the stuff?) The shelves seem to be very well stocked. http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif

SSBourbon1
11-10-2003, 18:09
I guess that was what I was trying to get at when I said it was so rare. I too see a lot of it at the ABC's and have yet to by/try the AAA but would also like to know if it is going to fade away and when.

TNbourbon
11-10-2003, 19:33
In the for-whatever-it's-worth department, AAA 10yo is almost non-existent today in Middle Tennessee, unless -- like I was lucky enough to do recently -- you happen across an old stock in an older liquor store. The AAA 10 star, however, is readily available. (Aside: the distributor of Ancient Age for the liquor store where I work part-time says the 10yo is no longer available here for new purchase.)
Since Tennessee is generally on the 'well-stocked' list -- we usually have at least some of even the rarest productions -- my guess is that means the 10yo inventory is getting pretty thin.

cowdery
11-10-2003, 20:20
I think he's saying they pulled it out of everywhere except Kentucky and Virginia because on an ongoing basis they can only support those two states. That doesn't mean they won't discontinue it someday, but it's safe for the present.

In any given year there is only so much ten year old product in the pipeline. How much of it you can sell as a relatively low margin product like AAA depends on how much of it you need for higher margin products, either right now as 10-year-olds, or later as older products. Have they probably changed that allocation formula as their sales of older products has grown? Of course. That's the only sense in which they are "running out."

Ken is a little too diplomatic to say it, but the people who decided to call the replacement product 10 Star chose it to trick you. They hoped you wouldn't notice that it no longer said "aged 10 years." Wild Turkey did the same thing when they dropped the age statement off their flagship brand. They replaced it with the words "No. 8 Brand." Those words disappeared in a subsequent label redesign. The Jack Daniel's label still says "Old No. 7 Brand," which may be there for the same reason, I don't know for sure.

I believe it ultimately is self-defeating to try to trick consumers into buying your product. You can't build long term loyalty on a lie.

Paradox
11-11-2003, 04:10
I think he's saying they pulled it out of everywhere except Kentucky and Virginia because on an ongoing basis they can only support those two states.



That's the way I take it as well Chuck. And you are so on the money when you say "You can't build long term loyalty on a lie." There is one brand in particular that I still sometimes buy but not very often at all because of very unprofessional practices. But there are certain distilleries, because of their personal attention to their consumers, that really deserve to be commended for their actions. It is these distilleries I find myself always buying my bourbon from.

Paradox
11-11-2003, 04:13
Wow, in VA it is a totally different story. Whenever I make a trip to VA, the ABC stores I goto (3 different ones) have AAA stacked 2-3 shelves high and about 5 feet wide! All different sizes etc...

OneCubeOnly
11-11-2003, 06:01
There is one brand in particular that I still sometimes buy but not very often at all because of very unprofessional practices.



Aww, c'mon Mark...don't be so cryptic with us! http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

kitzg
11-11-2003, 07:41
Chuck, I totally agree with you on ethical grounds. Unfortunately there are, indeed, many consumers who do not pay much attention to terminology and will fall for such a trap. And there will always be less than ethical business folks (just as there are less then ethical doctors, etc.) who will decide to play into the consumers' ignorance.

kitzg
11-11-2003, 07:44
Seems to be plenty at this time and there is a good following in Kentucky. It is the standard drink for master distillery Gary Gayheart at BT. I believe Ken meant their overall supply will support the two primary states where it is a reasonable seller.

cowdery
11-11-2003, 13:29
I think that's the point, which is that in KY and VA the product has a following and does a real business, and didn't in other states. Saying it's a supply issue is true as far as it goes, as I explained in my other post.

What you describe is similar to Very Old Barton in Kentucky, where it's a major brand equivalent in shelf space to Jim Beam or Jack Daniel's.

Marvin
11-11-2003, 16:33
Chuck,

I couldn't agree with you more!! That is absolutely the truth!! I applaude you http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/bowdown.gif http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/bowdown.gif http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/bowdown.gif. The things they try to do makes me want to http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/puke.gif http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/puke.gif and http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/banghead.gif http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/banghead.gif. What a statement, Chuck!!!

Cheers,
Marvin

TNbourbon
11-11-2003, 19:42
Am glad to hear this now that I've 'discovered' it for myself. I get to Kentucky 2-3 times a year, so I guess I'll look for a 1.75L next trip. I don't think I'd want it nightly, but I like it well enough to keep it on hand.