PDA

View Full Version : Kentucky-only bourbons?



OneCubeOnly
04-14-2004, 19:58
From purusing the SB.com archives I've come up with a good list of recommended liquor stores...but I'd like some advice on which bourbons to search for on my upcoming Kentucky trip.

I know I'll definitely be looking for Ridgewood Reserve 1792, OFBB F'03, along with the obvious lucky rarities (like Stagg).

Do you guys have any other recommendations for bourbons unique to Kentucky or that have limited distribution?

Paradox
04-14-2004, 20:12
You may want to give a look around for Jefferson's (http://home.si.rr.com/paradox7/1792JeffersonsThedfordOFBSpring.JPG). (I am not sure if it has made its way out of KY though) It sells for about $30 and is not too bad. Also, Kentucky Pride 10yo (http://home.si.rr.com/paradox7/8.JPG) is not that bad for a decent price. (It is the bottle to the left of the JB White) W/o grabbing the bottle, I think even though it is labeled as 10 years old, most bottles are more like 12 yo. Sorry I couldn't be of more help right now Gary but I hope that's something else to consider... Whatever you grab I'm sure you will enjoy! http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/toast.gif

BSS
04-14-2004, 21:07
You might have some trouble finding Stagg at any stores. Its been a while since I've seen any around.

My best advice is to just look around and if you see something you can't get where you live buy it.

cowdery
04-14-2004, 23:05
When in Kentucky, I never pass up the opportunity to buy some Very Old Barton, usually the bottled-in-bond. Ridgewood is from the same distillery.

You might also want to pick up a couple of Heaven Hill branded products, especially the ten-year-old.

Otherwise the advice "buy anything you can't find at home" is sound.

angelshare
04-15-2004, 03:58
More vicarious joy and envy here!

Our 2 cents would be that we don't recall ever coming back from KY without a Van Winkle product of some kind. If it's not available in DC or MD, ORVW 10 year is one of our favorites. Unfortunately, our most recent trip was three years ago, so we're relying on hazy memories regarding what's out there.

Also, FYI, in case you've missed it, I have seen Jefferson's in our local VA state store for about $30. I know you prefer to shop in MD and didn't know if it was available there or not.

Have fun!! http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/toast.gif

mike1
04-15-2004, 05:16
I'd go for buffalo trace,four roses,and dowling bib,

OneCubeOnly
04-15-2004, 05:28
Thanks for all the responses! That's pretty much my gameplan--I'm planning on picking up ones I'm sure I can't get at home. I just didn't want to pass up a gem I hadn't thought of. You guys have given me some more to look for!

http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/toast.gif

TNbourbon
04-15-2004, 15:10
Jefferson's has been in Tennessee (at around $23-$25) since last fall. I bought four bottles all with "Batch # 1, Bottle # --", numbered under 100 (the lowest was Bottle #44). I've also purchased one with a non-collectible number, currently on shelves, but haven't opened it yet.

Paradox
04-15-2004, 17:45
So it has made its way out of KY, that's good! http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/toast.gif Give it a try Tim, considering you have that many bottles now, it's a decent bourbon.

angelshare
04-15-2004, 17:46
Out of curiosity, are there numbers under which all bottlings are considered collectible, or are you referring specifically to this Jefferson bottling? I note that ours is Batch #2, bottle 1694. Sounds pretty "high number." It is also about 150ml short, which reduces collectibility, or so we hear! http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/lol.gif

dhooch
04-15-2004, 17:53
You might have some trouble finding Stagg at any stores. Its been a while since I've seen any around.



Yeh, I know! I talked to the manager (or one of the managers) at the Party Source in Bellvue, KY, across the Ohio River from Cincinnati and he said that he is expecting Stagg in the Fall. http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/yum.gif

He also said that he would limit Stagg purchases to one or two per customer because someone bought 18 bottles last time they had it. You know who you are! http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/hot.gif He thinks some of them went on eBay. http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/hot.gif

How about leaving a little for some of us! http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/soapbox.gif

That's one of the reasons Stagg has been difficult to get.

TNbourbon
04-15-2004, 18:27
It's subjective, and somewhat speculative at this early date with a new item (Jefferson's), but the ideally collectible bottle would be "Batch #1, Bottle #1" -- which would be, of course, the first bottle to be labeled and cased (impossible, though, to say that it was the first actually bottled). So, the low number at this point is just a bragging right, but could someday be valued above its contents' value. If not, since I paid retail (actually, I got the storeowner's courtesy discount, too, of 10%), I've still got a bottle of bourbon.
A parallel is the automobile license plates in Rhode Island, which are numbered consecutively and indicative of a sort of social pecking order -- e.g., I think the governer is entitled to plate #1. Low license plate numbers are bequeathed (or, at least, the attempt has been made) in wills.
The bottle I bought for drinking is somewhere in the 100s of the first batch, so I probably wouldn't 'collect' a Batch #2 bottle unless I was attempting to keep a full series (one from each batch -- hey, that's a thought!). As I said earlier, it's purely speculative -- just for the fun of it, so to speak -- at this point.

BSS
04-15-2004, 19:13
To me, the only significant bottle numbers to have would be either the 1st or the last. In my opinion anything inbetween has no significance # wise.

robbyvirus
04-15-2004, 21:10
I don't really like the "Kentucky Pride" myself, but I do like "Kentucky Vintage", which I've only seen in Kentucky. Also "Pure Kentucky" is pretty tasty too.

boone
04-17-2004, 07:50
Gary,

The "Welcome Mat" is out and ready for your arrival http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Ya never know...I might have that "special rare find" bottling http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif

Looking forward to your visit http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

See ya soon http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif Bettye Jo http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

OneCubeOnly
04-17-2004, 13:14
Thanks Bettye Jo!!

I'm really looking forward to your custom tour of Heaven Hill! I'll post a trip report for SB.com upon my return! http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

-Gary

TNbourbon
04-17-2004, 20:32
Having just returned last week from one of Bettye Jo's personal tours, I can assure you you will be informed and entertained. Bettye Jo is a great asset both for Heaven Hill and SB.com. But, y'all knew that already.

robbyvirus
04-18-2004, 00:58
My wife and I too have been the fortunate recipient of one of Bettye Jo's personal tours of Heaven Hill, and I can say it's been one of the most fun and memorable experiences we've had! Bettye Jo is a remarkable person and a wonderful host, and definitely deserves her award as "Bourbonian of the Year"!!

OneCubeOnly
04-25-2004, 03:16
1 bottle Four Roses Yellow Label (see my comments in "Tasting")
1 bottle Very Old Barton BIB (thanks for the suggestion on this one!)
4 bottles Ridgewood Reserve 1792 (tasted this in KY then decided to load up the bunker with it)
2 bottles OFBB F'03 (it took several exploratory missions to find this one!)
1 bottle OFBB '02 (I was surprised to find so much of this still on the shelves!--basically adding to my bunker supply on this one)

No Stagg to be found anywhere--but I pretty much expected that. The only real rarity I stumbled on was a bottle of Weller 19, but I passed on it because it was $99.00. Even though I have a fondness for old wheaters, I didn't feel like trading three bottles of 1792 on a gamble.

bobbyc
04-25-2004, 06:16
4 bottles Ridgewood Reserve 1792 (tasted this in KY then decided to load up the bunker with it)




Good move there. After the judgement on Friday , I slipped out and picked up a couple. The ruling said they had 60 days in Ky to sell all that was shipped before the lawsuit was filed . The report last nite to us at the Sampler, was that all of it had been snapped up and some folks are willing to part with a $100 Dollars to get one!

dgonano
04-25-2004, 06:36
Well I hope my good SB.com comrades have a bottle saved for me. I had hoped to pick up one in september.

Paradox
04-25-2004, 08:43
Just got back from Fla and they had Ridgewood Reserve there (The lady said they just got it in about a month ago) but it was selling for $39.99 a bottle.

TNbourbon
04-25-2004, 10:31
Unless I'm misreading reports of the federal judge's order regarding Ridgewood Reserve, it is only Kentucky which has 60 days to remove pre-suit bottles. Elsewhere, it is to be removed from shelves immediately. Now, how efficient or practical 'immediately' is in reality I don't know -- but if I were Barton and under a federal court order, I'd do what I needed to do soonest.

OneCubeOnly
04-25-2004, 10:31
Mark--I forgot to mention...I looked for your suggestion of Kentucky Pride 10yo and came up empty! However, my liquor shopping was limited to the Bowling Green area, as the times of day when I hit Lexington (I wanted to check out the Liquor Barn) they were closed.

Another one I had wanted to get was Weller 12yo...that was also completely missing from the stores I checked.

Paradox
04-25-2004, 11:33
Hey, at least you gave a look for it. It's a toss up bourbon, you may have liked it or you may have not liked it as you saw from what people said about it... But the the one I wish they did have for your sake, and wallet!, was Weller 12 yo. It is a great bourbon at a great price, flat out. No wonder it was gone, right?! http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/lol.gif

dgonano
04-25-2004, 13:10
Gary,

I am currently enjoying a recently opened bottle of Weller 12. It is available in Maryland. Not likely at Montgomery County stores but elsewhere in the state. I bought one at Cranberry Liquors in Carroll County.

OneCubeOnly
04-25-2004, 13:24
Gary,

I am currently enjoying a recently opened bottle of Weller 12. It is available in Maryland. Not likely at Montgomery County stores but elsewhere in the state. I bought one at Cranberry Liquors in Carroll County.



Wow! Thanks for the heads-up! I'll have to make a trip there sometime soon.
http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/toast.gif

TNbourbon
04-25-2004, 13:40
I did see the Weller 12 a few places in KY on my trip 2 weeks ago, but I, too, was surprised I didn't see it everywhere. I didn't bother to pick any up because it is available (though only in 1.75L, which lasts me a heck of a long time, since I drinkly both lightly and severally) here in TN.

angelshare
04-25-2004, 18:35
Envy aside, glad you had a good trip! Hope you enjoy the VOB BIB. We think that VOB bottlings are some of the greatest bourbon bargains ever. Looks like you made a good choice on the Ridgewood Reserve stock-up.

Welcome home! http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/toast.gif

Gillman
04-26-2004, 04:06
I picked up a bottle of Ridgewood Reserve at Toddy's. Guthrie was nice to sell me one at the regular $29.95 sticker price. His counter phone was ringing as I was making the purchase early two days ago from people who want to snap them up.

I had an excellent time at the Sampler and it was great to see and chat with Cliff, Dane, Randy B. and spouse, Ed and Patty (thanks again for the lift to the Sampler), Chuck as always (thanks for the lift back!), Bobby, Bettye Jo (and thanks for those great pics), John Ed and father (those stills from Michters wowed me, it was a privilege to see them), Craig Beam, Marvin, Brenda, Jeff, and sorry if I left anyone out. Many fine whiskeys were essayed and Randy's BMH was particularly good. Of the ones at the Sampler I liked Russell's Reserve and Elijah Craig 18 year old the best but they were all good. I was reminded how traditional and well-balanced is Very Old Barton's on this trip. The taste of the current Van Winkle rye more than pleased, it seems more concentrated and complex than the earlier bottlings.

I tried Woodford Reserve at the airport bar at Louisville, the bar fitted out to look like a barrel warehouse (they did a nice job). I thought the whiskey was particularly good: silky, perfumed, complex. It seemed deeper and richer than the one we get in Canada. I wonder if Brown Forman keep the best of it for Kentucky. http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif Maybe the newest bottlings are getting more pot still whiskey from Woodford Reserve (the former L&G facility) than previous bottlings.

Interesting how the industry seems to be going ever more in the direction of premium bottlings.

In sum, an excellent time was had by all, me not least.

Gary

dhooch
04-26-2004, 17:00
Interesting how the industry seems to be going ever more in the direction of premium bottlings.




... and the bourbon drinkers. I know I have been leaning towards the premiums over the lower priced bourbons. I don't go for all the premium bourbons, but many of them. Besides taste, the tie-breaking attribute is price. As others have mentioned, why buy a 96 scored bourbon for $100 when you can get $35 bourbons that score in the range of 92-94? That's almost three bottles to one.

If I were Independently wealthy, however, ...

gr8erdane
04-26-2004, 21:13
I somewhat agree with you, but I have come to question the ratings systems employed. As we all know, ratings are subjective according to what the taster likes. And I beg the question: How many bourbons have you seen rated less than 80? In my short tenure as a student of the drink, I can't recall one. To me that basically turns into a scale of 1-20 and a couple of points can be a major jump compared to a scale of 1-100. Add to that the probability that the 100 dollar bottle is probable produced in a limited quantity and you may find that you get more enjoyment out of the few pours of a 100 dollar bottle than you do out of the many you get from 3 35 dollar ones. But of course that is IMHO.

pepcycle
04-27-2004, 06:58
I think its time we standardized our rating system. The "pants away" system fell by the wayside. We need to set up a Gage R&R using a middle of the road whiskey as a benchmark and giving it a score of 50. Then rank everything else in comparison to that. We'd need to leave room at either end for a really lousy or unexpectedly excellent bourbon that isn't around yet. The consensus on this site is that Weller 12 is decent all around bourbon. Let's set that as 50 and then rank everything else around it. Nothing says we have to agree. I can rank Ridgeburg Special as a 90 and you can rank it as a ten, but the mean and range of the results would eventually give a pretty good rank to the bourbon.
We could pick a few bourbons at a time and set up voting matrix.
Any takers?

jeff
04-27-2004, 07:57
I'm game, but if we use Weller 12yo as middle of the road, most of my ratings will fall in the bottom half of the field. I would humbley suggest maybe BT, EC12, AAA 10yo or EW 7yo as our benchmarks. Thoughts?

OneCubeOnly
04-27-2004, 09:24
I would humbley suggest maybe BT, EC12, AAA 10yo or EW 7yo as our benchmarks. Thoughts?



Sounds great, but I predict no matter which one(s) you choose as the middle-of-the-road benchmark, there will always be those who object because it's their personal favorite. I for example consider BT to be better than a good 80% of other bourbons I've tried...so can it be a "50" for me? That'd be tough. I love the concept though!

pepcycle
04-27-2004, 09:39
Since its all relative, It really doesn't matter. We just have to make the benchmark bourbon something with sufficient room above and below that will allow all other bourbons to have enough room to spread out. (We don't want 30 bourbons with a 99)
If we think of 50 as good, on a terrible, bad, OK, Good, better, really good, excellent scale, we should be OK.
Time for an executive decision.
The benchmark needs to be middle shelf, reasonably price, and taste "good".
OK, the question goes out.
What bourbon is Average??? I think the Ancient Ancient Age and EW 7 are excellent candidates.
Jeff, Can you do that vote thing. Let's get 10 or so nominations and then put to the forum for a vote.
Ed

jeff
04-27-2004, 09:51
Good idea. I'll put together a poll this evening. If you have a nomination please post now and I'll compile them into the poll.

brendaj
04-27-2004, 10:46
Hey Guys,
I really think we could split the poll into wheat and rye. They are different enough to warrant individual middle-of-the-roaders. Say, Weller 12 or AAA 10yr. for the wheat, and EW 7yr. for the rye side.
Just a thought...

pepcycle
04-27-2004, 11:07
Brenda,
I was thinking about having a profile to accompany the bourbon rating with several "scores".
I think a Wheat to rye scale would be a good one.
I would like a sweet scale, fruit scale, wood scale, tannin
scale, proof scale and then comments on "other flavors" like tobacco, grass, vitamins etc. Bar graph kinda stuff.
I'll make one in Excel and attach it.
I think overall score should be overall score with no breakdowns.
Ed

pepcycle
04-27-2004, 11:34
First try on Rock Hill Farms. I just took a poke at the rankings.
Ed

TNbourbon
04-27-2004, 14:35
The benchmark needs to be middle shelf, reasonably price, and taste "good".


I'd suggest Jim Beam White label 7yo. After all, it is the 'default' brand -- in terms of sales, anyway. And, I don't think anybody here really hates JB White -- it's just ordinary, and isn't that kinda the definition of "middle-of-the-road".

SteveZZZ
04-27-2004, 14:40
If this is going to be effective, the benchmark has to be nationally available. There's no Buffalo Trace or AAA that I can find out here, so I'd be unable to use or relate to that scale. JB White 7 would work. While I confess to never having had it, it is readily available and affordable, and I can grab some at any time.

Steve

SteveZZZ
04-27-2004, 14:40
If this is going to be effective, the benchmark has to be nationally available. There's no Buffalo Trace or AAA that I can find out here, so I'd be unable to use or relate to that scale. JB White would work. While I confess to never having had it, it is readily available and affordable, and I can grab some at any time.

Steve

gr8erdane
04-27-2004, 23:09
Oh my goodness, look at what I started. The problem with any rating system is objectivity and agreement on the criteria to judge on. I say we take all the Miss USA contestants, put a different bottle of bourbon in front of each of them and a small glass. Have each take one ounce drinks of the bottle in front of them every five minutes. I'll stand in front of them, and the ones that find me attractive first are the highest rated and on down. This is imperative: they must keep drinking until they all find me attractive. http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/skep.gif