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bourbonv
09-06-2004, 07:42
After some discussion with the power to be, there have been some rules to this contest. The first and most important is that you only get one shot at answering the questions. The contest will last for one week and the person to find the right answers first will win the bottle. If nobody gets them all right, then the person with the most right answers will win. In case of a tie, then the person who posted first will win. Now, Let the game begin!

1) Who or what was "Miss Dixie"?

2) Brown-Forman did not build the Early Times Distillery in Shiveley. What was it before they bought it and what year did they buy it?

3) W.L. Weller and Bro. was founded in 1849. What was the name of the brother?

4)Who was I W Bernheim's brother-in-law?

5) There were three large brands of Tennessee whisky before prohibition with Cascade and Old No.7 being two of the brands - who was the third distiller and what was his brand?

6) Evan Williams was a distiller in Louisville in the late 18th and early 19th centuries - how many stills did he own and what were their capacity?

7)What year did Ancient Age first appear in the market?

8) Who was the brother in James Thompson and Bro.?

9) What was the "Old Blue House"?

10) "She was bred in old Kentucky" was a slogan for what whiskey?

Have fun. I will post the answers after we have a winner. You have until next Monday night to get your answers together.

Mike Veach

TNbourbon
09-06-2004, 18:25
Oh, alright, I'll serve as cannon fodder. There are three for which I can find nothing substantive, so I'll guess and let others find the correct answers. Apparently, the answers are in resources I don't have available.

1. Miss Dixie was the 1892 Kentucky Oaks winner, depicted on several early W.L. Weller whiskey labels (i.e., Kentucky Oaks Whiskey Blend).
2. The Old Kentucky Distillery started producing for B-F in 1940, so I assume that's when it was purchased by B-F.
3. Charles Weller
4. Don't know this one. Bernheim's wife's maiden name was Uri. Harper (of I.W. Harper fame) was a horseman aquaintance. Palmer was a family friend/investor.
5. Deep Springs. XXXX Kelly Co. (See bottle (http://www.minivodkaguy.com/Pre-Pro1.html))
6. I can only find a reference to the original one at 5th & something while he was a Louisville councilman. Let me guess 10 gallons.
7. 1936, as a 'bourbon-style' whiskey. A true bourbon after WWII.
8. Frank. (This is simply a guess, since Frank was a founder of Glenmore)
9. a McKenna whiskey: "Henry Bosquet's Old Blue House" (see bottle (http://www.sweeney-emporium.com/Whiskey%20&%20Saloon/12537.htm))
10. Green River Whiskey.

If anyone finds help here and wins, please remember that I'm one of the forum's Rebel Yell fans. http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

tdelling
09-06-2004, 22:32
For giving it a stab as the first attempt, I give you
a big straightbourbon "Huzzah!". I especially liked your
URL reference for Old Blue House (which I also turned up
after a little googling).

I did stumble upon
http://antiques-internet.com/colorado/cvcfineart/dynapage/IP106.htm
for #10. (I guess by posting the url, I muddy the waters for future
attempts to try at the prize, since interpretation of that object
conflicts with your answer...)

Tim Dellinger

bourbonv
09-07-2004, 07:21
Tim,
By My count you have 6 completely right and two that you are on the right track with, but not quite there.
Mike Veach

angelshare
09-07-2004, 16:05
Just to clarify, are we supposed to post our answers here? If so, is the presumption that we are on our honor not to get clues from previous answers posted here (seems reasonable - we all seem pretty trustworthy! http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif)?

Or is the disadvantage to posting quickly the possibility that your answers might be used by future participants who only have to do minimal rearch to confirm?

bluesbassdad
09-07-2004, 16:47
Trustworty, you say? Since I don't know the answer to a single question, I briefly considered posting made-up answers to see how many free-riders I could attract. http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

However, now that the quizmaster has set the precedent of posting the score for each entrant, I'm glad I didn't expend the creativity such an endeavor would have required.

Yours truly,
Dave Morefield

angelshare
09-07-2004, 20:06
Hmm...after actually reading the questions, the point is moot for me! I guess my question still stands for those who are still playing...if anyone challenges Tim! http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif

I'll be a spectator on this one.

TNbourbon
09-07-2004, 21:32
If so, is the presumption that we are on our honor not to get clues from previous answers posted here (seems reasonable - we all seem pretty trustworthy! http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif)?



I can be bribed.http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/yum.gif Of course, that's presuming I even know which six I got right.



Or is the disadvantage to posting quickly the possibility that your answers might be used by future participants who only have to do minimal rearch to confirm?



Hence the 'cannon fodder' reference.http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/stickpoke.gif

bourbonv
09-08-2004, 07:24
I am hoping that other people will play. I would hate to see Tim win by default as the only one that answers the questions. These answers can all be found in refrence books, websites and other public sources so I expected the contestants to do a little research. The questions are not impossible.
Mike Veach

angelshare
09-09-2004, 05:35
Okay, Mike, I'll succumb to peer pressure. Heck, if it weren't for peer pressure, I may never have tasted bourbon! http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif



1) Who or what was "Miss Dixie"?

Although I can't say my research confirmed it, it turned up a lot of similar horse references. I'll go with Tim's answer. To quote: " Miss Dixie was the 1892 Kentucky Oaks winner, depicted on several early W.L. Weller whiskey labels (i.e., Kentucky Oaks Whiskey Blend)."



2) Brown-Forman did not build the Early Times Distillery in Shiveley. What was it before they bought it and what year did they buy it?



I'm going to dispute Tim and say 1923. The way the question is phrased, this must be incorrect, but I thought it was the Early Times Distillery and that it was bought by B-F which had a license to produce medicinal whiskey at the time. By the way, is it Shiveley or Shively?



3) W.L. Weller and Bro. was founded in 1849. What was the name of the brother?

Charles.



4)Who was I W Bernheim's brother-in-law?

My research turned up the same info as Tim, but no definitive answer. How about "the guy who married his sister?" http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif



5) There were three large brands of Tennessee whisky before prohibition with Cascade and Old No.7 being two of the brands - who was the third distiller and what was his brand?



I'm going to randomly diverge from Tim and guess White Oak Tennessee Whiskey made by ER Betterton.



6) Evan Williams was a distiller in Louisville in the late 18th and early 19th centuries - how many stills did he own and what were their capacity?

I'm pretty sure there was only one known distillery, but I don't know how many stills were in it. I saw one reference to "stills" plural in the context of "distillery" singular. Anything beyond this is just a wild guess. How about ten stills at 10 gallons each?



7)What year did Ancient Age first appear in the market?

I found that the distillery opened in 1933, but Tim sounds pretty confident that the brand didn't show up until 1936, which makes sense. I'll say 1936.



8) Who was the brother in James Thompson and Bro.?

I'll say that the "brother" was Frank, but that Frank was not his real brother. I'll say Frank was actually his son.



9) What was the "Old Blue House"?

I felt like I was onto something that I couldn't quite get. I found the following: "In East Paris on the road going towards Millersburg and Maysville was an old frame building called the "Blue House" used by Mr. Ellerbeck as a brewery in 1805, says McCann in his recollections of Paris of that date. (Keller & McCann's "Sketches of Paris," 1876.)" I'll therefore say it was an early 19th century brewery...that later became a distillery???



10) "She was bred in old Kentucky" was a slogan for what whiskey?

Based on my research, I think Tim nailed this one. Green River Whiskey.

Thanks for the fodder, Tim! http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/stickpoke.gif And thanks for the "pressure," Mike. As I'm sure you would agree, there was more fun in the looking than in the finding, which was probably your point! http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/toast.gif

bourbonv
09-09-2004, 07:15
I am glad you enjoyed looking for the answers. You, however did not do quite as well as Tim. You have two that are right and four that are on the right track, but not right. You are right - I put an extra "e" in Shively, which is pretty bad since I live just south of Shively and did not catch that typo when I checked the post. I will give you an extra point for that, but you are still behind Tim.
Mike Veach

angelshare
09-09-2004, 11:26
Wow - with Tim's fodder, I actually did worse. Send me to remedial bourbon class! http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif

I still learned a lot - just not the answers to the questions, apparently!

JDKnaebel
09-12-2004, 18:36
Ok. Here is my shot at the answers.

1) Who or what was "Miss Dixie"? The only reference that I could find was to the 1892 Kentucky Oaks winner, depicted on several early W.L. Weller whiskey labels.

2) Brown-Forman did not build the Early Times Distillery in Shively. What was it before they bought it and what year did they buy it? It was the Old Kentucky Distillery and it was purchased in 1940.

3) W.L. Weller and Bro. was founded in 1849. What was the name of the brother? Charles D. Weller

4)Who was I W Bernheim's brother-in-law? N.W. Uri

5) There were three large brands of Tennessee whisky before prohibition with Cascade and Old No.7 being two of the brands - who was the third distiller and what was his brand? Charles Nelson was the distiller and it was bottled under the Greenbrier label. The distillery was located in Robertson County.

6) Evan Williams was a distiller in Louisville in the late 18th and early 19th centuries - how many stills did he own and what were their capacity? He owned three stills. They had a capacity of 141, 130 and 93 gallons.

7)What year did Ancient Age first appear in the market? In 1936 as a whiskey. After WWII (1946) as a bourbon.

8) Who was the brother in James Thompson and Bro.? Frank Thompson

9) What was the "Old Blue House"? The only reference I could find was to a McKenna whiskey jug. Henry Bosquete's Old Blue House.

10) "She was bred in old Kentucky" was a slogan for what whiskey? Green River Wiskey


JD

bourbonv
09-13-2004, 07:30
Good Job JD,
Not quite perfect with 3 answers that are close, but not quite there. Still you have taken the lead from Tim. If nobody does any better by this evening when I get home and post the answers I will award you the bottle.

So the challenge is out - find the complete correct answers before 7:00 and win the bourbon.

Mike Veach

bourbonv
09-13-2004, 16:46
The answers to the trivia questions are as follows:

Question 1: "Miss Dixie" was the winner of the Kentucky Oaks and the bourbon connection is that she was owned by James E Pepper. I thought this would be an easy one since a simple search of SB.com would reveal the answer. I posted this information for Omar's post on bourbon and horse racing.

Question 2: It was the "Old Kentucky Distillery" and was bought by Brown-Forman in 1940. That is the same year they acquired Labrot and Graham. The book "Nothing Better On the Market", Brown-Forman's company history would give you that answer and I would think a call to the distillery might do that as well.

Question 3: Charles Dawkins Weller was W. L. Weller's brother and he was robbed and murdered in Clarksville, Tennessee on July 4 1863 while collecting money owed to the company. Most Weller histories I have seen discuss this event.

Question 4: N. (Nathan) M. Uri was I W Bernheim's Brother in law and he was partners with Bernheim for a short time before heading out on his own. Red Top Rye was his leading brand. I believe the Regans discuss this in the Book of Bourbon.

Question 5: The other major Tennessee whisky before prohibition was Greenbiar made by Charles Nelson. There are a lot of jugs and advertisements for this brand and I thought a quick search of ebay might bring this fact forth otherwise a look at preprohibition trade magazines or trade marks. A call to the Getz Museum might have yielded an answer. This was what I considered the toughest question.

Question 6: Evan Williams had 3 stills with capacities of 141, 130 and 93 gallons. Another tough question unless you called the Bernheim Distillery - they have a copy of one of his early licenses on display at the distillery. A call to the Filson could have earned you the same information since we have the original.

Question 7: According to the May 1936 issue of Fortune Magazine Ancient Age was first sold that year using a "Bourbon type" whiskey distilled and aged in Canada. I believe the Regans discuss this as well in the Ancient Age history section of the Book of Bourbon.

Question 8: James Thompson started in the industry with his cousin George Garvin Brown when the firm was called Brown-Thompson. He sold out his share to Forman in 1889 and went into business with his brother Francis P Thompson, who just came to America from Ireland. Francis died in the year 1891. Col. Frank Thompson was named for his uncle and later came to run the family business. This can be found in several of the Glenmore published histories of the company.

Question 9: The "Old Blue House" was the building that the Henry McKenna distillery bought as their sales offices in Louisville in 1881. Their jugs often list that fact as well as the History of the company in the Nelson County Standard.

Question 10: Green River was one of the most advertised whiskeys in the U.S. before prohibition. There slogans were "The Whiskey without a headache" and "She was bred in Old Kentucky". The later slogan also became part of a Three Stooges routine "She was bred in Old Kentucky but she's just a crumb down here".

I hope you enjoyed the trivia even though we only had three people try to answer the questions. JD is the winner and I will get him the bottle of Rebel Yell. I will see if I can come up with a consolation prize for the other two brave souls, Tim and Dave.

Mike Veach

brendaj
09-13-2004, 19:08
JD,
Wheew! I'm speechless...well done, well done.
You don't post much, but you live pretty close to Kentucky... Are you going to make it to the Bourbon Festival this year? Hope to meet you.
Ok, here's a question for either you, or Mike...
In #5 you mention

Charles Nelson was the distiller and it was bottled under the Greenbrier label...


Here's a photo Mike helped me shoot at the Getz, several years ago. (I sortof have an interest in the Greenbrier label.)
There must be a connection somehow. The distillery that bottled this whiskey was in Nelson County. Same label? Did the Greenbrier Distilling Company belong to Mr. Nelson? I know Double Springs came into the picture later. But, I'd love to hear the whole history.
Years ago, I had the chance to go thru the old Greenbrier Distillery, right before American Greetings built their plant on the property. I remember thinking their bottling plant was amazing, for the use of natural light.
Come on down for the Festival!
Bj

TNbourbon
09-13-2004, 20:16
Congrats JDhttp://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/toast.gif ,
I'm certainly not surprised somebody came up with the answers I didn't -- just that so few of these bourbon experts tried. I figure they were letting us neophytes have a chance. http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

JDKnaebel
09-13-2004, 20:17
Bj,

When doing research on the third major brand of Tennessee Whiskey prior to prohibition question, I found the following reference on the web:

The Robertson County distillery that grew to be the largest was located at Greenbrier. When it was started about 1867 by Charles Palmer of Springfield, its capacity was a modest five gallons a day. In 1870, Charles Nelson, a native of Mecklenburg, Germany, who had come to Nashville from Cincinnati, bought it to supply his wholesale grocery business in Nashville (at that time grocers sold whiskey). The whiskey was manufactured in Robertson County, but it was both bottled under the Greenbrier label and distributed from his Nashville warehouse on Second Avenue North. At its peak, the distillery employed a work force of fifteen to twenty-five men, including government inspectors and gaugers as well as the operators. By 1885 the Greenbrier Distillery manufactured 8,000 barrels of whiskey or a little less than 380,000 gallons a year, and paid annual taxes of over $341,000.

Hope this helps. You are right, I generally don't post much. Tend to sit back listen (or read) and say something every once and a while. That is till I know or meet more of the people. I am going to be at the Burbon Festival Thursday through Saturday. Hope to see you there as well.

JD http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/toast.gif

angelshare
09-13-2004, 21:10
Thanks for an enjoyable lesson (or ten)! I hope there is more trivia to come in the future!

Just out of curiosity regarding #2:


Question 2: It was the "Old Kentucky Distillery" and was bought by Brown-Forman in 1940. That is the same year they acquired Labrot and Graham. The book "Nothing Better On the Market", Brown-Forman's company history would give you that answer and I would think a call to the distillery might do that as well.



I think the Regan book made reference to ET being acquired by Brown-Forman after closure due to prohibition and that B-F had a license to sell medicinal whiskey. Here (http://www.earlytimes.com/heritage/story.asp) B-F makes reference to acquiring ET in 1923. What was it they acquired? The whiskey that had been made but could not be sold? A different distillery site? Both? I get the impression I missed a significant part of the B-F/ET history in my searching.

bourbonv
09-14-2004, 07:14
Brown-Fprman was one of the companies with a license to sell Medicinal Spirits during prohibition. In 1923 they acquired the remaining stocks and rights to the brand Early Times, but there was no distillery involved in the sale.
Mike Veach

tdelling
09-14-2004, 09:29
> Question 7: According to the May 1936 issue of Fortune Magazine Ancient Age
> was first sold that year using a "Bourbon type" whiskey distilled and aged in
> Canada. I believe the Regans discuss this as well in the Ancient Age history
> section of the Book of Bourbon.

As supporting information, the US Patent and Trademark Office lists
the Ancient Age logo as:
IC 033. US 049. G & S: WHISKEY. FIRST USE: 19360327. FIRST USE IN COMMERCE: 19360327
which, of course, means March 27th, 1936.

(www.uspto.gov)

The USPTO website is a nice way to dig up information about various
old whiskey brands, when they started, and who owns/owned them.

Plus, they give you a little graphic of the logo!

Tim Dellinger