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jburlowski
06-01-2006, 16:39
Tonight I struggled with a new bottle of Basil Hayden (one of my favorite summer pours). Since I last purchased some, it now seems to be packaged with some sort of alien, unpenetrabled foil wrapping. Repeated jabs, swipes, samurai lunges with a paring knife were necessary to gain entrance. Do the distillers not want me to actually consume their product?

My other ongoing irritant is ETL SB. A wonderful bourbon and an incredible value. It is one of my all time favorites and usually number one or two in my recommendations to others but....when I pull the tab on the wax covering it invariably comes off in my hand... leaving the nectar beyond reach. Why oh why is BT doing this to me? Do they not test their packaging in the real world?

Seriously, other than the odd broken cork (which happens to everyone now and then), what is your major bourbon packaging 'pain in the ass'?

scopenut
06-01-2006, 16:55
I'm not sure this qualifies, but I noticed recently that my bottle of Eagle Rare SB 10 is over an inch taller than my other tall bottles, making it difficult to store it in an enclosed 2 shelf cabinet.

Not exactly hand-wringing, I know, but a pain nonetheless.

Kevin

jburlowski
06-01-2006, 17:01
I'm not sure this qualifies, but I noticed recently that my bottle of Eagle Rare SB 10 is over an inch taller than my other tall bottles, making it difficult to store it in an enclosed 2 shelf cabinet.

Not exactly hand-wringing, I know, but a pain nonetheless.

Kevin

I've got to believe that retailers feel the same way about Old Forester BB --- beautiful bottle but it doesn't seems to fit anywhere...

contrarian
06-01-2006, 17:06
That big honkin' Booker's crate obscures a nice presentation and is a pound of trash I wish I didn't have to pay Binny's to send to me.

The silver lining is Binny's picks some great barrels of Booker's.

elkdoggydog
06-01-2006, 17:10
I think the Sazerac Jr. is an ugly bottle- the neck is just way too long. It doesn't help that my bottle tastes like spinach.

macon
06-01-2006, 17:12
I agree about the Eagle Rare. It is in one of those very tall, vodka like bottles, that does not fit in my liquor cabinet.

Nebraska
06-01-2006, 17:17
lol...I'm still laughing at the image of bottled spinach.:lol:

macon
06-01-2006, 17:22
So that is what Popeye was up to.

wadewood
06-01-2006, 17:31
My other ongoing irritant is ETL SB. A wonderful bourbon and an incredible value. It is one of my all time favorites and usually number one or two in my recommendations to others but....when I pull the tab on the wax covering it invariably comes off in my hand... leaving the nectar beyond reach. Why oh why is BT doing this to me? Do they not test their packaging in the real world?

Yes and they listened. You will find that new ETL bottles (change was around ? 9 months ago) have ditched the gold wax and now just a foil wrap.

ThomasH
06-01-2006, 20:00
The ETL bottles with the foil are also a treat to open. I just use a knife to cut a slot between the cork top and bottle on most of the cork top brands. My all time biggest nightmare was with a 1.75L of Knob Creek. I had to use channellocks to get the wax off of the neck!

Thomas

CrispyCritter
06-01-2006, 21:05
Unobtanium-doped wax is my pet peeve, but recent wax-topped bottles haven't been too much trouble to open. Maybe I've been lucky...

Nebraska
06-01-2006, 22:46
This is an easy one for me. White plastic bags.

When I buy a bottle of bourbon, I want the son of a gun in a brown paper bag. Traditional, nondescript, brown paper bag.

scopenut
06-02-2006, 07:21
That big honkin' Booker's crate obscures a nice presentation and is a pound of trash I wish I didn't have to pay Binny's to send to me.


Yes, forgot about that one. After you get the first one, and get over the novelty of it, how many more do you need? Anyone found a good use for them?

Kevin

NorCalBoozer
06-02-2006, 09:45
Anyone found a good use for them?

Kevin

I would think they would make great kindling if you busted them up. If they just packaged them with a ligher or matches you've got yourself one hell of a fire starter kit.

bluesbassdad
06-02-2006, 10:00
Second question first; click here (http://www.straightbourbon.com/ubbthreads/showthread.php?p=10100&highlight=bird+house#post10100).

I suppose your first question still applies, however.

Yours truly,
Dave Morefield

scopenut
06-02-2006, 10:54
Seems that using a Booker's box for a birdhouse wouldn't attract blue birds, but rather swallows.....

Kevin

elkdoggydog
06-02-2006, 12:24
Seems that using a Booker's box for a birdhouse wouldn't attract blue birds, but rather swallows.....

Kevin
Bah dum CHING!
Nicely played.

DrinkyBanjo
06-02-2006, 19:30
One thing I've always been curious about is the Van Winkle Lot B packaging. I think it looks very cheap and is a poor representation of the whiskey contained within. I don't get this, especially since all of Julian's other products have such classy packaging.

gothbat
06-02-2006, 21:13
This is an easy one for me. White plastic bags.

When I buy a bottle of bourbon, I want the son of a gun in a brown paper bag. Traditional, nondescript, brown paper bag.
Lots of stuff I can agree with in this thread. I prefer the brown paper bag but I donít mind the white paper too much. Speaking of paper, when I was in Amsterdam the guy at the liquor store perfectly wrapped my bottle of Jim Beam Black in a sheet of printed tissue paper in like 2 seconds. I think I like that better than a paper bag, brown or white. What I really donít like is what this one store does, they have these bags that are about 14Ē left to right and separated into two pockets with a loop handle in the middle of the top. (Sorry, Iím not that good at describing things like this) Anyway, when you carry the bag the two pockets swing and the bottles clang together. Iím glad that store doesnít have any good whiskey on itís shelves that I want.

As for the Bookers box, I like it. I have this habit of never spending coins I get as change after I buy something, accumulating it, rolling it, and then stacking them in a pyramid. After about 25 rolls of quarters get in the pyramid the sides can no longer support themselves and layers start to roll away (Off the shelf and onto the floor, often breaking the paper roll.), thatís when the Bookers box comes into play, itís the perfect width to hold them and it can hold (Iím guessing) about 52 rolls.


One thing I've always been curious about is the Van Winkle Lot B packaging. I think it looks very cheap and is a poor representation of the whiskey contained within. I don't get this, especially since all of Julian's other products have such classy packaging.
Itís not fancy but I donít mind it. I have thought about this myself though. My reasoning is that itís the ďSpecialĒ reserve and thus not like all the other Van Winkle varieties so they made this bottle stand out from all of the other VW bourbons you can get at the store.


My gripe is simple though and is pretty much the same as a lot of other peoples, the George T Stagg bottle is too tall, it looks really nice but it does not fit on any of my shelves. However as much as I would like my Staggs to be with my Van Winkles and my Turkeyís I think Iíd be disappointed if they changed that nice, stately bottle.

nor02lei
06-03-2006, 08:59
I don’t like anything with natural cork with make me dislike almost all American straight whiskey packaging in the premium class. I have to live with that. I like watts inside though! (I got the same problem with single malt)

Leif

cas
06-03-2006, 09:50
[QUOTE=scopenut]Seems that using a Booker's box for a birdhouse wouldn't attract blue birds, but rather swallows.....

After seeing the original post a couple years ago I made a similar birdhouse. The birds have not been impressed....
But this spring some wasps built a nest in it.
Craig

cowdery
06-03-2006, 15:44
I donít like anything with natural cork with make me dislike almost all American straight whiskey packaging in the premium class. I have to live with that. I like watts inside though! (I got the same problem with single malt)

Leif

I agree completely. Let me go on record as saying I will gladly buy premium bourbons that have screw caps. Maybe we can start a movement.

No More Corks!!!

Edward_call_me_Ed
06-03-2006, 16:58
You know, I have never had any problem with the gold wax on the ETL bottles and I have opened quite a few of them. Pull on the tab and it opens right up. I have more trouble with ordinary shrink wrap.
Ed

Gillman
06-03-2006, 17:29
I found a bottle of Booker's a little fiddly to open. I couldn't find the way to take off the rawhide strip until I saw you just unhook it on one end. Then I had to tug the plastic sleeve open to get it out of the grooves, it was sticking in there a bit. Once the bottle was free I discarded the plastic and box - I never keep packaging (or canisters for malt whisky, just superfluous in my view).

Now the whiskey. :) Good but very "Beam": very big rye hit, lots of liquorice. Nice and silky though, even at the high proof. In fact I like it at high proof, the extra barrel quality and ethanol complement the Beam character. The label states an age of 8 years, 5 months. There is a code that starts with 95 so maybe it was dumped in 2003. There was a lingering smell of fresh pine and plastic on the wax part of the bottle neck, I had to wash it well to get it off. Fortunately the whiskey itself was pristine.

In sum it reminded me of Baker's.

Gary

OscarV
06-03-2006, 18:08
it reminded me of Baker's.

Gary[/quote]

I have not had the Booker's. But now I am looking forward to it.
I have been through a bottle of Baker's. I really liked it.
Baker's neat reminded me of some of Buf Trce's stuff. On the rocks, it got fat, like Beam on steroids.
So I will now have to move the Booker's up on the rotation. The two being similar doesn't suprise me, after all Booker and Baker are cousins.

Oscar

Edward_call_me_Ed
06-03-2006, 19:38
I vote for an international ban on corks. The association of corks with high quality spirits and wines is a false one. It came about because at one time it was the best that was available, but that is no longer true. The only effect that cork can have on the contents of the bottle is a negative one. I want screw caps, plastic or steel, forget those crappy aluminum ones.
Ed

ProofPositive
06-03-2006, 22:42
I'm not sure this qualifies, but I noticed recently that my bottle of Eagle Rare SB 10 is over an inch taller than my other tall bottles, making it difficult to store it in an enclosed 2 shelf cabinet.

Not exactly hand-wringing, I know, but a pain nonetheless.

Kevin

You think that is tough, then try the 1.75L size bottle of same.

ProofPositive
06-03-2006, 22:50
My all time biggest nightmare was with a 1.75L of Knob Creek. I had to use channellocks to get the wax off of the neck!

Thomas

I'll second that one and extend it to other sizes of KC as well.....have had a bit of trouble with all of them. Nothing else though has give me any trouble and if the KC had been too big of a headache, I would not still be buying it!

Hedmans Brorsa
06-04-2006, 02:08
Leif, Chuck and Ed,

Iīd be more than willing to join a global movement against corks.

Letīs hear it for the plastic/steel screw cap!

BourbonJoe
06-04-2006, 04:22
I'll vote for the screw cap over cork.
Joe :usflag:

ratcheer
06-04-2006, 05:00
it reminded me of Baker's.

Gary
I have not had the Booker's. But now I am looking forward to it.
I have been through a bottle of Baker's. I really liked it.
Baker's neat reminded me of some of Buf Trce's stuff. On the rocks, it got fat, like Beam on steroids.
So I will now have to move the Booker's up on the rotation. The two being similar doesn't suprise me, after all Booker and Baker are cousins.

Oscar

Odd. I thoroughly enjoy Booker's but I don't really care for Baker's. To me, Baker's has a dry, astringent quality that is very offputting (is that a word?), while Booker's has a thicker, sweeter profile.

Tim

Edward_call_me_Ed
06-04-2006, 06:10
Odd. I thoroughly enjoy Booker's but I don't really care for Baker's. To me, Baker's has a dry, astringent quality that is very offputting (is that a word?), while Booker's has a thicker, sweeter profile.

Tim

What Tim said.
Ed

nor02lei
06-04-2006, 10:25
I vote for an international ban on corks. The association of corks with high quality spirits and wines is a false one. It came about because at one time it was the best that was available, but that is no longer true. The only effect that cork can have on the contents of the bottle is a negative one. I want screw caps, plastic or steel, forget those crappy aluminum ones.
Ed

Well Ed here were all the reasons why I dislike cork and prefer plastic or steel screw caps.

Leif

bluesbassdad
06-04-2006, 11:31
After the switch will movie tough-guys still remove the closure with their teeth? :slappin:

Come to think of it, such a scene would fit nicely into a Mel Brooks movie, say something on the order of "Blazing Saddles".

Yours truly,
Dave Morefield

brian12069
06-04-2006, 16:14
That big honkin' Booker's crate obscures a nice presentation and is a pound of trash I wish I didn't have to pay Binny's to send to me.

The silver lining is Binny's picks some great barrels of Booker's.
I always thought that was kind of neat, the way Booker's came in that box. Looks nice on the shelf.

brian12069
06-04-2006, 16:23
Odd. I thoroughly enjoy Booker's but I don't really care for Baker's. To me, Baker's has a dry, astringent quality that is very offputting (is that a word?), while Booker's has a thicker, sweeter profile.

Tim
I have to agree in that Booker's and Baker's taste completely different to me. I happen to enjoy both though!

smokinjoe
06-04-2006, 17:15
The screw caps don't leak. They pour better. They don't foul what's inside. They travel better...But they don't beat that sound when you pull the cork out...thumbp! Like Pavlov's dog, I salivate when I hear it. It makes opening the bottle an event. For that reason alone, I vote cork!

JOE

elkdoggydog
06-05-2006, 15:07
Out here in wine country, some wineries are switching to screw-tops. I'm told this is due to a cork shortage. Others use a plastic stopper with a thin cork veneer.
I vote for the screw-on caps as well, regardless of the shortage. It makes no difference to the whiskey, and it makes my life just a touch easier.

OscarV
06-06-2006, 12:48
Odd. I thoroughly enjoy Booker's but I don't really care for Baker's. To me, Baker's has a dry, astringent quality that is very offputting (is that a word?), while Booker's has a thicker, sweeter profile.

Tim
Some say Baker's and Booker's are different and some say they are not.
Like I said I do like Baker's, but haven't tried the Booker's yet.
Well this on-going research may be tough but I am up to it.(LOL)

Hey Tim,... here's a shout out from a 'Bama native.
I am originally from Cullman, my family is in the LaconMnt./Vinemont/Hartselle area.

Oscar

MattB
06-07-2006, 04:58
Out here in wine country, some wineries are switching to screw-tops. I'm told this is due to a cork shortage. Others use a plastic stopper with a thin cork veneer.
I vote for the screw-on caps as well, regardless of the shortage. It makes no difference to the whiskey, and it makes my life just a touch easier.

While cork is getting harder to find, my understanding is that the change to screw-tops has had to do with cork spoilage--I've read in a few wine snob magazines that the percentage of bottles "corked" is not insignificant. (Chances are most people on this board have had a bad bottle, whether they recognized it or not.) But while a number of quality wineries have started switching over, it will probably be a while before you open a bottle of Mouton in the same way you open your Mountain Dew Code Red. Cork may be inferior, but it adds a festive and ceremonial element. (I assume this is why many bourbons come with wax and the like--to make it seem like a sacred or special occasion.)

Has anyone here experienced a bourbon that was fouled b/c of cork issues? I know that folks can respond very differently to the same bourbon--just read some of the older posts on something like EC 12--but I wonder if a few of these negative experiences have had something to do with bad corks.

JeffRenner
06-07-2006, 06:54
Has anyone here experienced a bourbon that was fouled b/c of cork issues? I know that folks can respond very differently to the same bourbon--just read some of the older posts on something like EC 12--but I wonder if a few of these negative experiences have had something to do with bad corks.

There have been some posts on this. Here (http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/showthread.php?t=3242) is one thread on the subject.

As was mentioned in these earlier posts, the bad flavor comes from 2,4,6 trichloroanisol (http://www.aromadictionary.com/articles/corktaint_article.html) (TCA) that comes from a fungus in the cork.

I posted a photo (http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/showpost.php?p=50925&postcount=16) of a bad EC12 cork six months back or so.

Jeff

tachyonshuggy
06-07-2006, 07:01
Switching gears a bit, let me nominate Knob Creek 1.75 (I think I piped up about this in another thread). It's basically a huge, unwieldy glass brick. No handle. Crazy fluid dynamics going on when you pour (most 1.75 bottles have the bulk of their liquid at the bottom, but the KC 1.75 has it, well, wherever it thinks it needs to be at the time). I would not trust the bottle to a person under 120 pounds :)

Edward_call_me_Ed
06-07-2006, 08:12
While cork is getting harder to find, my understanding is that the change to screw-tops has had to do with cork spoilage--I've read in a few wine snob magazines that the percentage of bottles "corked" is not insignificant. (Chances are most people on this board have had a bad bottle, whether they recognized it or not.) But while a number of quality wineries have started switching over, it will probably be a while before you open a bottle of Mouton in the same way you open your Mountain Dew Code Red. Cork may be inferior, but it adds a festive and ceremonial element. (I assume this is why many bourbons come with wax and the like--to make it seem like a sacred or special occasion.)

Has anyone here experienced a bourbon that was fouled b/c of cork issues? I know that folks can respond very differently to the same bourbon--just read some of the older posts on something like EC 12--but I wonder if a few of these negative experiences have had something to do with bad corks.

Some people just don't like EC 12.

That said, I have had corked whisky. The first bottle of Highland Park 12 that I bought was horrible. Definitely corked. I took it back and they replaced it. The second bottle was worlds better. Not as good as bourbon, mind you...

Sadly, the first Blanton's Straight From the Barrel I have had seemed to be corked. It wasn't as bad as the Highland Park, but clearly noticeable. It spoiled an excellent bourbon. I could taste the goodness behind the cork, but the cork kept intruding. I suppose it could have been a musty barrel, but I don't believe a musty barrel could have made it into a Blanton's bottle.

There have been other times that I thought a bottle had been adversely effected by cork without actually being "corked." Never noticed anything of the sort with a screw cap.
Ed

Edward_call_me_Ed
06-07-2006, 08:15
Switching gears a bit, let me nominate Knob Creek 1.75 (I think I piped up about this in another thread). It's basically a huge, unwieldy glass brick. No handle. Crazy fluid dynamics going on when you pour (most 1.75 bottles have the bulk of their liquid at the bottom, but the KC 1.75 has it, well, wherever it thinks it needs to be at the time). I would not trust the bottle to a person under 120 pounds :)

Ah, the 1.75 liter bottles. Those are irritating due to their absence in this market. At least the absence of any big bottles containing something I would like to have at home...
Ed

tgriff
06-13-2006, 06:57
The only effect that cork can have on the contents of the bottle is a negative one.
Ed

After reading about much distaste for corks in this thread, I wonder if the use of synthetic corks would make a difference ? Would they be an improvement? Are bottlers using synthetic corks? The wine industry is using them quite frequently these days, presumably due to the shortage of natural cork.

DrinkyBanjo
06-13-2006, 07:43
Old Potrero uses synthetic corks but I don't know of any others. That being said I prefer the 'cork' to the twist off. Something about the sound...

jburlowski
06-13-2006, 17:20
The new Pritchard's Double Barreled Bourbon uses a large ( and IMHO ugly) plastic "cork".

Edward_call_me_Ed
06-13-2006, 22:34
After reading about much distaste for corks in this thread, I wonder if the use of synthetic corks would make a difference ? Would they be an improvement? Are bottlers using synthetic corks? The wine industry is using them quite frequently these days, presumably due to the shortage of natural cork.

Nikka, a Japanese company, uses plastic covered corks in some of their bottlings. Not quite the same, but not a bad compromise. They do pop fairly well, but they don't squeak first. They are a little harder to pull out. Oh, I had forgotten one, it had a very thin bit of plastic film on the bottom of the cork that kept the whisky from making actual contact with the cork. The sides of the cork were bare to the glass so there was a more natural feel, squeak and pop.

I still prefer screw caps.

Ed

Nebraska
06-14-2006, 16:53
I tried my first sip of Rock Hill Farms tonight. After taking a knife (three times) to the plastic holding the stopper down, I became very alarmed when I started to pull, I could tell something was a miss.

The thin ring of cork around the stopper was looking pretty nasty. The plastic on the stopper was shifting and my first thought was...what an incredibly stupid design for the inner part of the stopper.

Fortunately, the bourbon is not tainted...wonderful stuff. All is well in Nebraskaland.

bluesbassdad
06-14-2006, 23:25
Mark,

It could have been worse (http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/showthread.php?p=24544&highlight=glass+farms#post24544).

IIRC, my current bottle had a vertical, perforated strip in the clear plastic seal. It was easy to remove.

Yours truly,
Dave Morefield

tachyonshuggy
06-16-2006, 07:14
El Tesoro (tequila) seems to have moved to synthetic corks. I've already lost a good bottle of another brand's reposado to cork that had dried and flaked in the liquid, so I was eager to see how this one performed.

Essentially, it does the job. No "PHWONK" sound but it creates a tight seal that's easy to remove. I like knowing that it won't/can't flake in the bottle.

Regarding screw caps, I had just opened a Weller Antique 107 for the first time about six weeks ago. I replaced the cap and somehow managed to screw it on so tight that I ruined the cap completely. Not by stripping, but by screwing the top so hard that the top part separated from the sides. Never had that happen before or since.

CrispyCritter
06-17-2006, 19:00
The only time I ever came across a questionable cork was with a bottle of Port Ellen (an Islay Scotch from a long-defunct distillery). It was a Cadenheads 150th Anniversary bottle, that had been on a store shelf in (of all places!) Michigan. At 64.1% or thereabouts, it was the strongest whisky I had until I came across Stagg. The cork had a "crumbly" quality to it, and it would leave little bits in the neck of the bottle when opened. A bit of paper towel took care of those.

Very fortunately, the whisky inside the bottle was untainted - and it was magnificent. This was one bottling that absolutely needed a bit of water, though.

Nebraska
06-18-2006, 06:24
Dave,

Man what a scary looking bottle of RHF!

As for the second matter, upon further examination I have found the aforementioned perforations. This will make the next time much easier!

Big Chipper
07-11-2006, 04:53
What's with the waxed screw top on the Pure Kentucky XO bottles? I brought one home the other day and it didn't have the release stringy thing sticking out. I had to hack at it with a knife all the way around and once done I tried pulling on it to no avail. That's when I realized it was a screw top. I just don't understand the logic either. The cheapest in the KBD small batch lineup has a cork (Kentucky Vintage), so why does the next step up have a screw top...with wax?