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Phischy
08-14-2007, 10:26
Having done a search all I find are when and what people have found. What I'm interested to know is when this was released. I know of three bottles I plan to pick up in a few weeks but just getting more info on it.

Thanks!

gblick
08-14-2007, 14:19
Having done a search all I find are when and what people have found. What I'm interested to know is when this was released. I know of three bottles I plan to pick up in a few weeks but just getting more info on it.

Thanks!I know where there are two VSOF 12yo, and awhile back I saw two IW Harper 15yo (all with the plain black neck wrapping with BHC logo on them) here in Houston. Did I read that you had a sister here that could buy it for you?

Phischy
08-14-2007, 16:08
Ok, cool! I'm only interested in the Harper though, I know where two bottles of VSOF sit.

So the listing for the BHC is:

I.W. Harper - 15yrs
VSOF - 12yrs Very Special Old Fitzgerald
George Dickel - 10yr
Old Charter Propriter's Reserve
W.L. Weller Centennial

Did all of these come from their respective distiller? Meaning the same label wasn't distilled at 2 different places thus having to really look at the bottles? From what I've seen they're rare enough.

cowdery
08-14-2007, 17:23
The Bourbon Heritage Collection was launched in 1992, or thereabouts, by United Distillers (UD). This was prior to the creation of Diageo. It was inspired by the success of a similar collection of "Classic Malts" that the company created. At that point, UD owned all of those brands and the distilleries that made them. Bernheim, where Harper and Charter were made, was at that time being completely rebuilt. Stitzel-Weller, home of Old Fitzgerald and W. L. Weller, was still operating but about to close. Dickel was Dickel, although it "went dark" at some point in the 90s.

In 1999, UD (by then a sub of Diageo) broke up the set by selling Fitzgerald (and the Bernheim distillery) to Heaven Hill, and Old Charter and Weller to Sazerac/Buffalo Trace. It retained Harper and Dickel but ultimately discontinued those BHC expressions. Both Heaven Hill and Buffalo Trace have continued the BHC expressions they inherited.

As for where these products have been produced, let's start with the easiest. Everything Dickel comes from Tullahoma.

For Harper and Charter, the oldest bottles probably came from old Bernheim, with later ones coming from Medley in Owensboro. Although they didn't make much bourbon in the early 90s due to the glut, what they made was made at the Owensboro distillery they inherited from Glenmore. It's also possible, though I can't verify it, that some rye-based bourbon was made at Stitzel during this period. It's also possible some was made by other distilleries on a contract basis. Hard to say for sure. Some could even be mixtures of whiskey from more than one distillery.

The wheaters, Fitz and Weller, were from Stitzel stock until that began to run out, after which they switched to stock from the new Bernheim. At some point, Weller Centennial probably switched from Bernheim stock to Buffalo Trace stock.

Looking at the bottles may not tell you much, as companies have a lot of flexibility as to what location they put on the label. It doesn't necessarily correspond to anything having to do with production. Since none of the BHC are bonds, they aren't required to say where they were produced.

Phischy
08-14-2007, 20:45
So the BHC's aren't as desirable or collectible as say, the BTAC? Very interesting and that explains the cash of not-dusty bottles I found at Bevmo today of Old charter and WL Weller Centenial.

Since I haven't bought any, there's really no way to tell the age of the bottle then. So you have no idea when it was bottled and what bourbon it may have inside.

Maybe I'll just skip this collection for the time being.

CrispyCritter
08-14-2007, 20:55
I guess it depends - if you're looking for old bottlings, BHC bottles would be a very nice find. On the other hand, if you're more into current offerings, BTAC would be worth tracking down, and likely easier to find (especially right after release time).

barturtle
08-14-2007, 23:09
So the BHC's aren't as desirable or collectible as say, the BTAC? Very interesting and that explains the cash of not-dusty bottles I found at Bevmo today of Old charter and WL Weller Centenial.

Since I haven't bought any, there's really no way to tell the age of the bottle then. So you have no idea when it was bottled and what bourbon it may have inside.

Maybe I'll just skip this collection for the time being.

I wouldn't skip these if I were you...they are all fine pours. Really fine if you happen across the older bottlings.

cowdery
08-14-2007, 23:56
Especially desirable, in my opinion and for drinking purposes, would be Stitzel-Weller Fitzgeralds or Wellers, of which there should be a fair amount out there. Someone else can probably give you a better idea of how to date them than I can off the top of my head. Bottle bottoms, maybe. Harpers and Dickels are legitimately rare, because they have been discontinued. Old Charters are from a different distillery than current Charters, so that's a reason to have them too. Timothy is right that they're all good, old ones as well as current production. They also tend to be a bit over-priced, but so is the BTAC. I'm not saying they're more desirable than the BTAC. All that matters is what's desirable to you. But don't be too quick to dismiss the BHC.

Hedmans Brorsa
08-15-2007, 03:38
Especially desirable, in my opinion and for drinking purposes, would be Stitzel-Weller Fitzgeralds

Ive had some old VSOF:s, presumably from Stitzel stock and they were outstanding.

ACDetroit
08-15-2007, 09:56
I found 3 of the 15yr. Gold Vein I.W. Harper bottles at lunch today. Has anyone had it? Is it worth a taste at $32 for a 750ml?

tango-papa
08-15-2007, 10:34
I found 3 of the 15yr. I.W. Harpers at lunch today. Has anyone had it? Is it worth a taste at $32 for a 750ml?

That's a fair price for that bottling - I found one some time back for $26, but that was obviously an old price. Have seen it (and passed) priced up to $45 per bottle. At $32, I would pick it up, especially if you're going for the complete BHC.

~tp

mozilla
08-15-2007, 11:52
IMO, for $28 the VSOF before the $32 Harper. I have both and enjoy them, but the Fitz is a better pour. Also the Fitz is 90 proof insted of 80.
Jeff Mo.

Phischy
08-15-2007, 12:05
Ok, good info. I'll have to go pick up the dusties of the VSOF and Weller...I'll have to read the label to determine where it came from. Also good to know about the Harper.

In the mean time they've just got to sit....damn hobby!