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fussychicken
12-14-2007, 01:29
While I appreciate guys like KBD helping bring rare whiskeys to the market, they sure make things confusing as hell with their, what seems like, infinite number of labels. Thankfully many of you guys and gals have already done the hard research. In trying to figure it all out, I rummaged through all the posts and made the following decoder ring that I thought would be helpful:


All of the old (13+) rye on the market comes from 3 maybe 4 sources:
Bernheim DSP1 Rye that was destined for COK at the time. Distilled in the 1981-1985 time range.
Medley Rye that was destined for ???. Distilled in the ???-1985 time range.
Heaven Hill Rye that was destined for their products, but they had some leftovers that got old. Distilled in ~1984.
The wild card is did BT (at the time AA) make rye? (Julian hints so here: http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/showthread.php?p=4053&highlight=rye#post4053) Nevertheless, all other research tends to point to this being incorrect. OR maybe BT just simply did a good job of keeping things quiet as to the source of Saz 18. Ken Weber if you are out there and are allowed to say, we would of course love to know.This then leads to the matching game:
Michter's 10 year old Rye: ~19 year old Bernheim DSP1 Rye
BMH 18: 18 year old Bernheim DSP1 Rye
BHM 23: 23 year old Bernheim DSP1 Rye
The old Willett Ryes : ~22 year old Bernheim DSP1 Rye
LeNell's Red Hook Rye: ~22 year old Bernheim DSP1 Rye
The old "The Classic Cask" Ryes: Bernheim DSP1 Rye
The 21 + 23 Hirsch ryes: Bernheim DSP1 Rye
"Vintage Rye" Series: Bernheim DSP1 Rye
A-E Van Winkle Rye: Medley Rye
F+ Van Winkle Rye: Mix of Medley and Bernheim DSP1 Rye
Hirsch 13 year Rye: Same as VWFRR rumored to be Medley Rye
Sazerac 18 year old rye: ??? Probably ~18+ year old Bernheim DSP1 Rye. However could have also been rye made at BT for COK (http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/showthread.php?p=4053&highlight=rye#post4053)
Rittenhouse Rye 21 + 23 yr: Made by DSP31By far and away the majority of the old ryes on the market today are from the old Bernheim DSP1 stocks. Generally speaking it appears that the quality of the barrels range from just average to wildly excellent. Does anyone know how many barrels KBD was able to procure of this rye?

Please comment with corrections for any of my mistakes! Also, am I missing anything?

cowdery
12-14-2007, 18:05
I don't know if you're right about the Michter's. I just had a glass of it not an hour ago and it sure doesn't taste 19-years-old. Sure is good, though. You know me, I usually don't pay much attention to NDP products, but that Michter's 10-year-old is right tasty.

fussychicken
12-15-2007, 16:44
I don't know if you're right about the Michter's. I just had a glass of it not an hour ago and it sure doesn't taste 19-years-old. Sure is good, though. You know me, I usually don't pay much attention to NDP products, but that Michter's 10-year-old is right tasty.

I haven't tasted it myself. I was just going off of what was said by Tim and Dave in this post: http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/showthread.php?t=6334

Maybe its time I get some of this!

cowdery
12-16-2007, 03:12
After writing that post and thinking about it a little bit more, the Michter's definitely resembles the Van Winkle. Whether that means it's Medley or COK, I don't know. I do know the Van Winkle is still, generally, less expensive than the Michter's.

fussychicken
12-17-2007, 06:09
Here is an even better source: http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/showpost.php?p=33879&postcount=12