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Isoflex
06-15-2008, 01:49
This may have already been discussed but a search didn't turn up anything. What on Earth has been done to Rebel Yell?? I don't know what the product looks like in your area but in mine (Arkansas) it is a pale golden yell(ow). It used to be a medium mahogany color and was a cheaper bourbon I enjoyed. Now, well I don't want to try it. It just doesn't look like bourbon. Perhaps they charred the barrels with a bic lighter??

Any info is appreciated.

ratcheer
06-15-2008, 06:21
I don't know. I haven't had Rebel Yell in many years, since it was a 90-proof Stitzel-Weller product (that was in the 60's and early 70's). Lately, I believe it had been distributed by David Sherman Co. of Missouri, but I think I heard that they went out of business. I'm not sure though.

Check to see if there is a DSP number on the bottle or label, then someone could tell you more.

Tim

mozilla
06-15-2008, 06:48
RY is still made by the same people that bring you other wheated products like Old Fitz, Berheim and some VanWinkle products. HH has been selling wheated bourbon to DSC for many years. DSC changed their name to Luxcor a few years back, still the same outfit. When HH sells its wheated bourbon....who do you think gets first pick? I would guess Julian....next would be Old Fitz.....last but not least is RY. So, if Julian takes the best of the product and the second best goes to HH....where do you imagine the worst and youngest goes? ....what if any aging Luxcor does with the bourbon once they recieve it, I don't know?

It is a little weak, isn't it?

Isoflex
06-15-2008, 09:55
Perhaps the ones I've had (I started my bourbon journey only about 4 years ago) were dusty bottles but that is unlikely with a cheaper bourbon I would think. The new stuff is just the weirdest looking product I've ever seen called bourbon. It has the color of a weak Canadian, like the Crown Royal product in the attached image (only a little lighter perhaps). Simply strange....

mozilla
06-15-2008, 11:17
Well, unlike the CR you pictured, RY has no coloring or flavoring. So, you can be assured it is 100% KSBW. The color of RY tells you that it is on the young side. Does the label give an indication of the age? I contacted RY a while back and they responded that it was a six year old product. I would believe that if it were stated on the label, otherwise, I would imagine that it is somewhat younger on average.

RY should be similar to Fitz Prime....have you given FP a try? Maybe, it would suit your pallet better than RY?

TNbourbon
06-15-2008, 11:31
...When HH sells its wheated bourbon....who do you think gets first pick? I would guess Julian...

I suspect the only Bernheim wheated bourbon Julian uses was distilled when that facility, brethren to Buffalo Trace at that time, was operated by United Distillers, also the then-owner of Stitzel-Weller/Old Fitzgerald Distillery and associated brands.
Heaven Hill didn't have a wheated bourbon until it purchased the Old Fitzgerald brands along with Bernheim Distillery in 1999. Its wheated disitllate would be too young for any of Julian's bottlings until next year, at the earliest. I'm unaware that it distills any more than needed for the Old Fitz brands and Rebel Yell, known to be bottled from HH whiskey.
Has Julian stated anywhere that I'm unaware of that he buys whiskey from HH?

mozilla
06-15-2008, 11:41
Well, if Julian wanted some bourbon that UD produced....wouldn't HH be the owner and ager of the stocks that went with the brands Old Fitz, Cabin Still and Rebel Yell.

Since, as you state, HH didn't previously produce a wheat recipe, they would have naturally bought enough stock to fill those labels until their juice got online. This is what I believe Julian has been using for some of his labels.

My assumption lies in that...Julian would be interested in purchasing any SW descended bourbon that met his strict taste profiles. This could lead him to UD now Diageo, HH or BT. All of which should have some stock of wheated bourbon. Also, don't forget that Seagrams owned a number of barrels of SW bourbon.

TNbourbon
06-15-2008, 11:50
Well, if Julian wanted some bourbon that UD produced....wouldn't HH be the owner and ager of the stocks that went with the brands Old Fitz, Cabin Still and Rebel Yell.

Since, as you state, HH didn't previously produce a wheat recipe, they would have naturally bought enough stock to fill those labels until their juice got online. This is what I believe Julian has been using for some of his labels.

My assumption lies in that...Julian would be interested in purchasing any SW descended bourbon that met his strict taste profiles. This could lead him to UD now Diageo, HH or BT. All of which should have some stock of wheated bourbon. Also, don't forget that Seagrams owned a number of barrels of SW bourbon.

Buffalo Trace and Bernheim both were producing wheated bourbon BEFORE the latter's ownership change in 1999. That's what Julian's been using in his younger bourbons.
I'd think if HH bought stocks for the Old Fitz brand, it used it for the Old Fitz brand.
Julian's brands are now essentially owned by Buffalo Trace. Since BT has its own supply of wheated bourbon, I suspect it wouldn't often purchase someone else's for its brands.

mozilla
06-15-2008, 12:16
I suspect it wouldn't often purchase someone else's for its brands.

Well Tim, that's were I think your wrong. Bourbon switched hands more than anyone of us know.

Other than that....I think that we have been saying the same thing.

cowdery
06-15-2008, 22:57
I suspect the only Bernheim wheated bourbon Julian uses was distilled when that facility, brethren to Buffalo Trace at that time, was operated by United Distillers, also the then-owner of Stitzel-Weller/Old Fitzgerald Distillery and associated brands.

Stitzel-Weller and Buffalo Trace were last "brethren" in 1983, when Schenley sold the Frankfort distillery to Ferdie A. Falk and Robert C. Baranaskas. When Diageo sold its wheated bourbon brands in 1999 it sold enough whiskey to support those brands, which included both wheated bourbon made at Stitzel-Weller (until 1992) and wheated bourbon made at New Bernheim (after 1992).

Van Winkle joined forces with Buffalo Trace to get access to its wheated bourbon stocks, including wheated bourbon made at Buffalo Trace. You are correct that Buffalo Trace and Van Winkle probably do not have access to wheated bourbon made at New Bernheim since Heaven Hill's takeover.

Rebel Yell is a product of Luxco, which has an ongoing relationship with Heaven Hill, probably contractual, to supply whiskey, but they probably have to take what Heaven Hill gives them and supplies are tight.