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  1. #21
    Bourbonian of the Year 2002 and Guru
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    Sep 1999
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    Chicago
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    Re: Pending patent for speeding up spirit aging

    I'm not saying don't try. Always keep reaching for the stars, baby. I'm just saying don't expect me to wet myself until you've got something to show.

  2. #22
    Advanced Taster
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    May 2010
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    Leopold Bros. Distillery
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    107

    Re: Pending patent for speeding up spirit aging

    Quote Originally Posted by Joshua View Post
    Just because it can be done faster, doesn't mean it's going to be the same quality. I can't think of a "faster way" that is better in production of much of anything.
    Recall that all major US whiskey distillers switched from pot distillation to continuously operating column stills. It's exponentially faster, and exponentially cheaper. Do you think that quality suffered?

    I'm with Mr. Cowdery. Manipulating pressure, temperature, oxygen, and movement are nothing new in the world of aged spirits. I've read many papers on the subject that were authored well over a hundred years ago. This is nothing new.

  3. #23
    Enthusiast
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    Apr 2009
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    Austin, TX
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    280

    Re: Pending patent for speeding up spirit aging

    I'm not taking money into the equation, that creates a whole new can of worms... and I was primarily referring to aging, the long haul. Arguably, some people the feel the quality DID suffer. Of course, with things of this nature 'quality' can be fairly subjective.

    I was stating that with all crafted things, you can only 'cheat' so much... such as the comment about microwaving steak. I have no doubt in my mind that you can age a spirit faster using technology, however I'm fully convinced it's not going to be the exact same result as using traditional means. I don't believe you can achieve the same result. however with taste and 'quality' being subjective, some folks may prefer the alternate result.

    You stated the manipulation of pressure, temp, oxygen, and movement are nothing new... which is true, no doubt. However it looks like most of the experiments with aging tricks have been unsuccessful. This, makes me skeptical, although with anything new I am interested and willing to give it an open minded taste.
    "So long as the presence of death lurks with anyone who goes through the simple act of swallowing, I will make mine whiskey"

  4. #24
    Bourbonian of the Year 2002 and Guru
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    Sep 1999
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    Re: Pending patent for speeding up spirit aging

    Semantically speaking, you cannot "age a spirit faster using technology." You can simulate some of the effects of aging but that's not aging or "faster aging," it's pressurizing or infusing or whatever it is. Only aging is aging. Even heat cycling, which is pretty well accepted, only affects absorption. It doesn't affect a lot of the other things that happen.

    The semantic point isn't the point, of course, but it's a metaphor.

    I really wonder about the due diligence of the people who are giving these grants and to what extent the whole thing isn't just about playing the system. Like the guys who sell the "making money" systems who don't tell you that the only way they've found to make money is by selling phony making money systems to suckers like you.

  5. #25
    Connoisseur
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    Jul 2009
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    Arlington, TX
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    746

    Re: Pending patent for speeding up spirit aging

    Quote Originally Posted by jburlowski View Post
    As in: age = wisdom.
    Gads, I am SOOOO wise, then
    Mark Edwards - Proof of Sanity Forged Upon Request

  6. #26
    Connoisseur
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    Jul 2009
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    Arlington, TX
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    746

    Re: Pending patent for speeding up spirit aging

    Quote Originally Posted by pepcycle View Post
    The only way to the New World is to sail from Europe to the West Indies.
    Anybody who thinks there's a better way risks unknown consequences.
    They obviously never tried simply drilling through the center of the earth. Lazy bums.
    Mark Edwards - Proof of Sanity Forged Upon Request

  7. #27
    Connoisseur
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    Jul 2009
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    Arlington, TX
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    746

    Re: Pending patent for speeding up spirit aging

    Quote Originally Posted by CorvallisCracker View Post
    Some ways might be better, and some not. Can you say "Hindenberg"?
    I'm just waiting for some clueless marketeer to sell a Hindenberg brand quick cooker.
    Mark Edwards - Proof of Sanity Forged Upon Request

  8. #28
    Enthusiast
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    Jul 2010
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    Minneapolis, MN
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    Re: Pending patent for speeding up spirit aging

    Quote Originally Posted by Gillman View Post
    Well, there have been innovations in the past that worked, notably cycling.
    I think you're comparing apples to oranges. Technological advances have some merit in artisan endeavors such as distilling and fermenting. Development of new yeast strains to play up some organolpetic character in a wine, utilizing jacketed stainless steel fermenters to control fermentation temperatures, etc. are all welcome additions to the trade. These advancements are supportive of - not circumventive to - product quality.

    It's just when someone claims to be able to circumvent established methodologies and still achieve identical qualitative results that I raise a skeptical eyebrow.
    Mat Garretson
    HIGH WEST DISTILLERY

  9. #29
    Trippah and Admin
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    Feb 2008
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    Northeast Ahia
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    4,736

    Re: Pending patent for speeding up spirit aging

    Quote Originally Posted by mrviognier View Post

    It's just when someone claims to be able to circumvent established methodologies and still achieve identical qualitative results that I raise a skeptical eyebrow.
    He's a whiskey alchemist.
    My name is Joel Goodson. I deal in human fulfillment.
    I grossed over eight thousand dollars in one night. Time of your life, huh kid?

  10. #30
    Bourbonian of the Year 2011
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    Sep 2002
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    Toronto, Canada
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    9,086

    Re: Pending patent for speeding up spirit aging

    The history of whiskey is one of innovation, but it doesn't occur in a straight line. From wild to mixed strain to pure culture yeasts, from flat boats to grocers' shops to built warehouses, from the latter to artificially heated and cooled warehouses to accelerate the number of cycles (movement of whiskey into and from the barrel).... I am not sure where process improvement starts and breakthrough commences. Cycling is said to save considerable natural aging time, so quick aging seems to me on a kind of continuum...

    Slow oxidation seems the main challenge, but I don't see why one day that cannot be emulated. So many scientific breakthroughs have occurred in other fields that were thought impossible at the outset.

    Gary

 

 

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