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  1. #11
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    Re: Corn Based Beer?

    Many people mistakenly believe the word "liquor" refers only to spirits. It actually refers to all alcoholic beverages, hence the term "liquor store," a store specializing in alcoholic beverages.

  2. #12
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    Re: Corn Based Beer?

    Quote Originally Posted by cowdery View Post
    Many people mistakenly believe the word "liquor" refers only to spirits. It actually refers to all alcoholic beverages, hence the term "liquor store," a store specializing in alcoholic beverages.
    Gotta disagree there. Liquor, as defined by Websters and Dictionary.com is a distilled product and does not include fermented products such as beer & wine.

    'Malt liquor' is not distilled, and therefore is not technically a liquor.

    Here in Texas at least, we have liquor stores which, yes, do in fact do sell beer & wine but do so only because they're allowed to sell alcoholic beverages of such strength as whiskey, vodka, etc., and so may as well sell beer & wine while they're at it.

    We also have beer and wine only stores which, while specializing in alcoholic beverages, are not allowed to sell whiskey, vodka, etc. Beer & wine stores are distinctly different than liquor stores in the fact that they're open on Sundays, are open until midnight (as opposed to 9:00pm), and can only sell beer or wine (no whiskey, no vodka, etc). They are only allowed to sell alcoholic beverages up to a certain percentage (usually under 20%), and thus are not 'liquor stores'.

    And as for Schaefer, as I was drinking it in the late 80s to early 90s, it was most certainly marketed as corn beer, shamelessly so and right on the package, regardless the barley to corn mashbill ratio. Now, maybe back in the 30s and 40s it was the bomb, but in the 80s... not so much.
    Last edited by Grain Brain; 12-04-2010 at 23:58.
    Ben

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  3. #13
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    Re: Corn Based Beer?

    Quote Originally Posted by Grain Brain View Post
    Here in Texas
    ...off topic...

    On the label of Bud Ice it says "Beer. Ale In Texas".
    Is that because of the alcohol content which is above 5%?
    Is it a tax thing?
    ovh

  4. #14

    Re: Corn Based Beer?

    Quote Originally Posted by OscarV View Post
    ...off topic...

    On the label of Bud Ice it says "Beer. Ale In Texas".
    Is that because of the alcohol content which is above 5%?
    Is it a tax thing?
    Both.

    Anything over 4% abw (so, just about 5% abv) must be labeled "ale" or "malt liquor" in Texas, where the state excise tax is more for the above 4% abw beers.

    Texas ABC Definitions
    Texas Excise Tax Rates

  5. #15

    Re: Corn Based Beer?

    Quote Originally Posted by Grain Brain View Post

    And as for Schaefer, as I was drinking it in the late 80s to early 90s, it was most certainly marketed as corn beer, shamelessly so and right on the package, regardless the barley to corn mashbill ratio. Now, maybe back in the 30s and 40s it was the bomb, but in the 80s... not so much.
    I don't quite understand what you mean by a "corn beer" (to me, it implies a beer brewed without barley malt- which would be illegal in the US. Maybe it's just a semantic argument).

    Was Schaefer a standard US style light lager beer that used corn (rather than rice) as it's adjunct? Sure, and the company always admitted as such. "Schaefer and most other brewers use cereal corn that has been dry milled and screened to a specific particle size distribution." from The Story of Quality - All About Schaefer Beer. Unlike some brewers, who's labels sometimes simply said "other grains" (in some cases, because they switched their adjuncts depending on market conditions) Schaefer did list "milled corn" on the label, as well as "finest barley malt".

    They also often made slight digs at A-B's promotion of rice, such as "...you may even have hears the flat statement that rice is superior to all other starchy adjuncts. This story has persisted solely because one brewer has advertised that he has used only rice for years." IBID Certainly the F&M Schaefer Brewing Company was unusually proud of it's use of corn, even despite the fact that they did their own malting.

    The same book refers to this elsewhere:

    "We should stress that beer is a malt beverage, and that malt is an essential ingredient for brewing beer. No brewer could think of trying to do without it..."

    After 1981, of course, Schaefer was simply an economy brand of Stroh Brewing Co. and I don't know how Stroh marketed Schaefer, and it's likely the adjunct rate, no doubt high to begin with near the end of it's independent life, was increased. It wasn't unusual, of course, for brewers to emphasis it's use of corn in advertising in the mid-West corn belt (Stroh expanded Schaefer's market to most of the US after they also bought Schlitz, and became a national brewer), just as A-B stresses it's use of rice from Arkansas and many brewers noted the locally grown barley in the upper Mid-West.


    Now owned by Pabst, and brewed by Miller, the current Schaefer Beer website mentions only 6-row barley malt but it is obviously an adjunct lager, probably brewed with corn syrup now, as is typical for most of the Miller-brewed adjunct beers.
    Last edited by jesskidden; 12-05-2010 at 05:58.

  6. #16
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    Re: Corn Based Beer?

    A lot of the "big" lagers here in Denmark is made on any cereal, including maize (corn)

    I know for sure Ceres lager is, not sure about our big brands (which includes Carlsberg and Tuborg, which is probably the better known brands)

    Ceres seems slightly rounder and sweeter, not sure the corn can be the cause of that. I reckon the hopping has effect as well

    Steffen

  7. #17
    Bourbonian of the Year 2002 and Guru
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    Re: Corn Based Beer?

    Although 'liquor' is commonly taken to mean 'distilled spirits,' The federal government refers to all alcoholic beverages as liquor and distinguishes the types of liquor as distilled spirits, malt beverages and wines.

  8. #18
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    Re: Corn Based Beer?

    Quote Originally Posted by cowdery View Post
    Although 'liquor' is commonly taken to mean 'distilled spirits,' The federal government refers to all alcoholic beverages as liquor and distinguishes the types of liquor as distilled spirits, malt beverages and wines.
    Not to mention oyster liquor, cocoa liquor, etc.

    When the word entered English it meant any liquid. I've even read medieval English books in which the blood of Christ was referred to as "licour".
    bibamus, moriendum est
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  9. #19
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    Re: Corn Based Beer?

    Quote Originally Posted by Josh View Post
    Not to mention oyster liquor, cocoa liquor, etc.

    When the word entered English it meant any liquid. I've even read medieval English books in which the blood of Christ was referred to as "licour".
    If dictionaries are starting to define it as 'distilled spirits,' that's a reflection of recent usage changes.

    Funny thing about language, if people use a word incorrectly often enough it becomes correct.

  10. #20
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    Re: Corn Based Beer?

    Quote Originally Posted by cowdery View Post
    Funny thing about language, if people use a word incorrectly often enough it becomes correct.
    Is that referring to me? It should refer to the Texas and federal governments instead.

    As a consumer, and a discerning one at that, I will stick with the technical, scientific terminology, and not improperly used legal jargon.

    As an example and as previously stated, in Texas our laws state that any beer over 5% abv be labeled either as malt liquor or ale, but you won't catch any self respecting beer snob worth a damn ever calling a double bock an ale. It's a lager, a scientific term which the legislature doesn't even acknowledge.

    The Texas legislature got the terminology they used in the law wrong, dead wrong. They took a scientific term and applied a new, conflicting usage to it. Technically, an ale is an ale regardless how much alcohol it contains, yet just because Texas states that an ale has to be over 5%, then it must be the proper usage of such terminology?

    Sorry, but I don't think so. Since when do people around here, all of you fellow discerning drinkers, every last one of you, adhere to legal definitions over scientific ones?

    As for liquor, so far as I can tell on the internet searches I've done, I can't even see where the federal govt. uses 'liquor' as a legal term at all. All I find in the legal documentation are references to 'alcohol', with the aforementioned distinctions of 'distilled spirits, wine and beer'.

    Fine, the legal, federal term 'liquor' may include beer and wine, and may simply be synonymous to the legal term that I did find, 'alcohol', but you'll be hard pressed to find an establishment calling itself a 'liquor store' that doesn't sell distilled spirits.

    Websters doesn't have it wrong, the lawmakers do.
    Ben

    Grain on the Brain

 

 

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