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  1. #21
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    Re: Michters -- more questions than answers

    I figured that would be tha case, I just haven't run across any of them yet. I guess the LB is still getting older stock.

  2. #22
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    Re: Michters -- more questions than answers

    Good point, I forgot that. Julian may have felt the Michter's ten year old rye, even if he didn't arrange it at the beginning of its life, was a Michter's-style pre-1919 rye because it had a high rye content whereas his other ryes have just over 51% rye content. (Before 1933, rye content in rye whiskey was at about the 80% level).

    I'd think Commonwealth or Stitzel-Weller (sold in '72) are unlikely sources, too far back. Maybe it is from HH, there are resemblances to its Pikesville Rye I would say. I think I'd know for the companion Michter's Straight Bourbon because most HH-ers have a characteristic, wood-derived "camphor" taste (good word used by a poster recently talking about HH), but I haven't tried that Michter's Straight Bourbon. It sounds like the current group of Michter's-label products are connected somehow to Mr. Kulsveen. In Scotland, a merchant bottling under his own brand will very often indicate the source distillery. Sometimes they do not. For example, a well-known "budget" single malt, McClelland's, does not state its origin except to say Islay or Speyside. You are relying on the reputation of the bottler, the goodwill built up in the name. But in most cases the bottlers state (sometimes against the wish of the distilleries) the distillery of origin. This reflects the different history of bottling in Scotland where selling off casks of malt aged in a merchant's (not the distiller's) warehouse was a way to get rid of stock left over from selling different malt whiskies to the blending industry (which later became owned by the distillers themselves). This gave rise to interesting legal questions for some distillers who felt it is not right to sell, say, a "Macallan" if not aged and supervised by The Macallan's itself. (Most however seem not to mind or have given up the point). In the U.S., merchants' (brokers or other kinds of agents) bottling developed differently where there wasn't any question of selling different straight whiskies to a blending industry, at least not methodically. Chuck has given some aspects for the sale of bulk whiskey (a way originally to raise capital against the issue of warehouse receipts) and the practice subsists with HH.

    A striking fact, looking back to Europe for a moment, is that until 1968 Jameson's whiskey was not sold under the Jameson name by the Jameson distillery (now part of Pernod Ricard). It was sold to merchants who bottled it under their own names.

    Cy




  3. #23
    Bourbonian of the Year 2002 and Guru
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    Re: Michters -- more questions than answers

    Julian Van Winkle's bottling operation is (was?) in Lawrenceburg. He bottled that batch but now that he's a Buffalo Trace, they apparently have switched to KBD Ltd.

  4. #24
    Bourbonian of the Year 2002 and Guru
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    Re: Michters -- more questions than answers

    </font><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr />
    Is it because they really want us to believe that all of these boutique bourbons actually come from their own deep-in-the-holler distillery?

    [/QUOTE]

    Yes, that's exactly what it is. They count on the fact that the "educated" consumers are a small minority.

  5. #25
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    Re: Michters -- more questions than answers

    That's right but they underestimate the whiskey knowledge of many of us. A clerk told me at Sherry Lehman's in New York, when I laid out for the Hirsch 16, that when people buy expensive scotch generally it is to find something made in someone's birth year or similar. He said when people buy any decent bourbon, they know exactly what it is and what they are looking for. The industry should twig to this fact - as long as they don't keep increasing the prices.

    Cy

  6. #26
    Bourbonian of the Year 2002 and Guru
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    Re: Michters -- more questions than answers

    Big companies move very slowly and the booze business moves slower than most, but I think there are hopeful signs that at least some decision-makers in the industry are beginning to understand and respond to the enthusiast market (i.e., us).

  7. #27
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    Re: Michters -- more questions than answers

    Chuck I think the time has come that the ditillers stand up and take notice. Buffalo Trace did and now they have World's Best Whiskey Award in their back pocket and are sold out.The current bottling of Michter's is a sham! It's not Michter's famous Pennsylvania Pot-Stilled whiskey at all!!!!! Why should anyone pay hommage to this? Whatever the whiskey in the bottle may be - it might be good, and then again it might not - Why honor it????? - Linn

  8. #28
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    Re: Michters -- more questions than answers

    Here's the Michter's story as I know it:

    The brand is owned by a distributor/importer in NYC by the name of Chatham Imports.
    I first bottled some rye and bourbon for them in September of 2000. They actually purchased some whiskey from United Distillers and the barrels were shipped to me in Lawrenceburg. I think both the rye and bourbon were 10-years old. I only bottled the whiskey for them. None of that whiskey was mine.I bottled a few more cases of bourbon in April of 2002. That was the last I did for them. Thought the rye was better than the bourbon at the time. I think both were distilled at UD's Bernheim plant here in Louisville.
    They wanted me to continue bottling the brand for them, but as you all know, I closed down my bottling operation in Lawrenceburg last July. So I told Chatham to call Evan K. He is now scheduled to bottle their Michter's label. I tasted the whiskey recently and it tastes alot like HH to me, but I'm not sure. About the only distillerys selling bulk whiskey these days are HH &amp; UD.
    Chatham is now using a new round bottle, but I don't think they have bottled any yet in Bardstown.
    I hope that explains a few things about this mysterious "whiskey business".

    PS. I think I saw in one of Chuck's posts in this Michter's thread that I had bottled all my stocks of Stitzel-Weller bourbon, and I should be now using Buffalo Trace's stock. I actually had SW make whiskey for me as far back as 1982, up til 1992, so I'll be using that distilation under my label for quite sometime. I'll be using BT whiskey for the first time perhaps next year for my 10-year old.
    Julian

  9. #29
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    Re: Michters -- more questions than answers

    Julian,

    Thanks for the scoop.
    Omar


  10. #30
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    Re: Michters -- more questions than answers

    Julian,

    Thanks as well, that clears up alot.

 

 

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