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  1. #1
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    New to bourbon and have a question about buying barrels

    Hello! I supposed I've already introduced myself, but I had a question about barrels. So I know the price of a single barrel varies based on how much is in it and which distillery you're buying from, but does anyone know what the wholesale price of barrels is? Like how much would it cost per barrel if you were to buy 1000 or 10,000 barrels. I'm just curious because I see all these "small batch" "craft" bottlings around $40-60 a bottle and always wonder just how much I'm paying for selections of Heaven Hill's finest or LDI juice.

  2. #2
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    Re: New to bourbon and have a question about buying barrels

    If your question is whether the brand you're considering is sourced (small batch is a meaningless term) just tell us the brand/provider and we will post what we think/know/conjecture about it.
    We're Bourbon Geeks, it's who we are, it's what we do.

  3. #3
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    Re: New to bourbon and have a question about buying barrels

    Quote Originally Posted by squire View Post
    If your question is whether the brand you're considering is sourced (small batch is a meaningless term) just tell us the brand/provider and we will post what we think/know/conjecture about it.
    I'm just wondering how much Heaven Hill actually sells to other people and how much their barrels wholesale for. Uncommon question I know, but it's the one I've got. Anyone have any ideas?

  4. #4
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    Re: New to bourbon and have a question about buying barrels

    To the best of my knowledge Heaven Hill does not release that information. As for the NDPs, if they won't even disclose their source I seriously doubt they will tell us how much they paid.
    We're Bourbon Geeks, it's who we are, it's what we do.

  5. #5
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    Re: New to bourbon and have a question about buying barrels

    Yeah I know they don't release it, but just wondering if anyone had any speculation. I suspect that anyone who might even have an idea likely wouldn't be able to disclose.

    HH is just so interesting to me because they have so many brands that they own and so many others that they sell to. I wonder how much of their stuff is sold to other labels. The bulk of the stuff they release is pretty lower end as well. EW, JTS, HH gold, white and BIB, etc. There's just so much volume and so much of it is just mystery juice that gets dumped into bottles all over the place. And then there's OF and Larceny and their wheated stuff. Anyway, just thinking out loud. is there a list of the "craft distillers" that we know/suspect they source?

  6. #6
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    Re: New to bourbon and have a question about buying barrels

    Heaven Hill is a fascinating company with a long history as a bulk supplier but I'm not aware of any such list. In the present climate MGP is the primary bulk producer which is a business they are actively pursuing, even to the extent of creating a number of new mash bills just for that market. I'm particularly intrigued by the 51% corn/49% barley version which should be ready in about three more years.
    We're Bourbon Geeks, it's who we are, it's what we do.

  7. #7
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    Re: New to bourbon and have a question about buying barrels

    Quote Originally Posted by amnesiac View Post
    is there a list of the "craft distillers" that we know/suspect they source?
    Part II...http://recenteats.blogspot.com/p/the...n-whiskey.html

  8. #8
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    Re: New to bourbon and have a question about buying barrels

    Heaven Hill and LDI also do contract distilling I believe which is different because the NDP buys the whiskey off the stills and then pays rent to age it.
    Bourbon only requires a glass.

  9. #9
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    Re: New to bourbon and have a question about buying barrels

    That was a business model adopted by Heaven Hill in the mid 1930s (as did Stitzel-Weller and others) which was to sell the new whisky then charge to warehouse and eventually bottle it when it reached the customer's specifications.

    MGP on the other hand distills bulk spirits (GNS as well as Bourbon/Rye) for the trade. Heaven Hill, Barton and others buy GNS from MGP to produce their generic vodka brands. I can't state it as fact but believe just about all cheap vodka labels (and some costly Micro brands) use GNS made by MGP.
    We're Bourbon Geeks, it's who we are, it's what we do.

  10. #10
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    Re: New to bourbon and have a question about buying barrels

    Amnesiac, I think there are actually multiple questions here. If you look at the Whiskey Tree thread in General Bourbon Forum, you can find some sources of NDPs. Also, there are other threads about barrel purchases, but this is about buying a single specially selected barrel by a retailer. That's going to be a premium barrel in many cases. But the simple answer about pseudo-craft NDPs, either they must spend a lot on packaging and or mark the price up on bulk whiskey quite a bit, like 300% - 400% (based on my best guestimation and the current price of EW black label).

 

 

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