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  1. #31

    Re: NDP Contradictions/Hypocracy

    I only have problems with NDPs if they are trying to spin the product into something it is not... I hate that Templeton rye is incredibly misleading about the provenance of their whiskey along with many other micros that have aged NDP products that they try to spin off as their own by withholding information. I think the other big distinguishing factor with some NDPs is that they buy the whiskey young and age it in their own rickhouses.. Of all the new whiskeys I have tasted in the past 6 months, all the best ones have come out of Willetts rickhouses.

  2. #32
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    Re: NDP Contradictions/Hypocracy

    Quote Originally Posted by smknjoe View Post
    That's the kind of reasoning that I don't understand. So, they used to have or currently have an age statement. So what? You still don't know where it came from (which seems to be the number one reason why people don't like NDPs.)
    The number one thing I look for is consistency. I don't care if they call it Magic Moon Juice and claim it was aged on Pluto, as long as I can expect each bottle to fall within a reasonable flavor profile at the same quality level.

    Age statements and distillery information don't guarantee consistency and quality, but they give us a little more of a baseline of what we can expect. You mentioned BMH, Noahs Mill and Rowans/Rollins Creek. I tried all of these early in my bourbon journey, then years later I found I didn't like them nearly as much. It wasn't until I found places like this and started reading and researching, that I realized what happened them. They dropped the age statement, started using lower quality juice, and now they don't taste as good. This happens to mystery labels, and it happens to major brands from major distilleries. It happens to labels that drop the age statement, it happens to labels that keep the age statement. We can make better assumptions about why this happened with labels like OWA, but that doesn't change the fact OWA and Rowans Creek both taste worse than they used to.

    I definitely don't put any stock in the "don't buy XYZ, its the same as this stuff from Major Distiller over here". Being about the same age from the same distillery doesn't mean they taste the same. If KBD is only using the top 10% of barrels from each lot for a certain label, it is going to taste better than the HH equivalent that would have used the whole lot. It works the other way as well. If HH bottles the top 10% of a lot as PHC, it would taste better than if KBD bottled the whole lot as "Rollins Creek Select from Rob Parker".

    I don't care where it comes from, I just want anything that has the same label to taste the same. I'll do as much testing as I need to, I just get tired of trying to hit a moving target.
    "Unless it survived a tornado, weathered a snow storm in Scotland, and then spent a year on boat before returning home, I'm not really interested."

  3. #33
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    Re: NDP Contradictions/Hypocracy

    I understand your point Quantum but don't follow your reasoning. If an NDP used only 10% of a lot purchase for a certain brand how would that maintain a profile when the top 10% of the next lot has a completely different profile.

    The truth is when you depend on purchased sources to stay in business you have to bottle what you can get.
    We're Bourbon Geeks, it's who we are, it's what we do.

  4. #34
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    Re: NDP Contradictions/Hypocracy

    Interesting blog post on Willett.

    http://thebourbontruth.tumblr.com/po...elevator#notes

  5. #35
    Bourbonian Of The Year 2013 and Guru
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    Re: NDP Contradictions/Hypocracy

    Quote Originally Posted by mbroo5880i View Post
    Unfortunately, I can never get more than half way through one of this guy's blog posts. I'll lay most of the blame on my lack of attention, and day-dreaming, but man is he wordy. Can you tell me how it ends?
    JOE

    Wag more.
    Bark less.

    "Every bottle is its own learning experience." -- Sensei Ox-sama

  6. #36
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    Re: NDP Contradictions/Hypocracy

    Quote Originally Posted by smokinjoe View Post
    Unfortunately, I can never get more than half way through one of this guy's blog posts. I'll lay most of the blame on my lack of attention, and day-dreaming, but man is he wordy. Can you tell me how it ends?
    Wordy, horrible grammar and spelling, unchecked vitriol... I have a hard time reading his posts as well.
    Jim

  7. #37
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    Re: NDP Contradictions/Hypocracy

    Quote Originally Posted by HighInTheMtns View Post
    Wordy, horrible grammar and spelling, unchecked vitriol... I have a hard time reading his posts as well.
    I slaved through it, although my eyes glazed over at several points.

    Sounds like he drank the kook-aid pretty heavily. I found a number of his comments dubious - especially that Willett has been intentionally understating the age of their single barrels so that the "drop" in age will be less severe when they start releasing their own products.

    Other things I could pull from the article
    -Willett is now giving estimates of "mid year" to get the single barrel bottlings going again
    -They are dropping the wax and the natural cork and going to a foil/synthetic
    -They are ambitiously producing 6 different mash bills.

  8. #38
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    Re: NDP Contradictions/Hypocracy

    Unless they're making two different 13% rye bourbons, he only listed five recipes:


    • 20% Wheat
    • 13% Rye
    • 7% Rye

    Rye will be:

    • 51% Rye, 34% Corn and 15 Barley Malt
    • 74% Rye, 11% Corn and 15% Barely Malt


    Most of what they're distilling is the 13% mashbill. Regardless of whether it's five or six, I'm happy to see them experimenting and look forward to trying the results.
    -Brian-

    "A person is smart. People are dumb, panicky, dangerous animals and you know it."
    -Agent Kay

  9. #39
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    Re: NDP Contradictions/Hypocracy

    There will be six mash bills, or recipes: two Rye and four Bourbon. The current LDI/MGP Rye they use...
    Sixty precent of what they are making is bourbon: 72 percent corn, 13 percent Rye, 15%; Barley Malt recipe will be 2 to 1 over the others. There will be three other bourbons:


    • 20% Wheat
    • 13% Rye
    • 7% Rye

    Rye will be:

    • 51% Rye, 34% Corn and 15 Barley Malt
    • 74% Rye, 11% Corn and 15% Barely Malt

    4 bourbons, 2 Ryes. See bolded above.
    Last edited by nd2005; 01-27-2014 at 10:17.

  10. #40
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    Re: NDP Contradictions/Hypocracy

    Willett is the new Pappy, apparently. That was my biggest takeaway here.

 

 

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