Welcome to the Straightbourbon.com Forums.
Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast
Results 11 to 20 of 21
  1. #11
    Bourbonian of the Year 2011
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    Toronto, Canada
    Posts
    8,979

    Re: Old Rip Van Winkle 15 yr 107 proof *THE TRUTH*

    Maybe it was tanked after 10-12 years of age. My recent tastings of the 10 (107 or the lower proof version) suggest a whiskey about that age.

    Gary

  2. #12
    Enthusiast
    Join Date
    Nov 1999
    Location
    Chicago
    Posts
    413

    Re: Old Rip Van Winkle 15 yr 107 proof *THE TRUTH*

    I don't know if anything in Van Winkle bottles now is actually Buffalo Trace wheated bourbon, which you can sample today in the Weller line, but eventually the Stitzel-Weller stock will be gone and it will all be from BT.

    How long has BT been making wheated bourbon? If they started with their agreement with Julian, well...that was in 2002. None of that will show up in a Van Winkle bottling until at least 2012, if his youngest expression is ten years old. My guess is that there will be a phase where wheated Bernheim bourbon will be used during the transition period between Stitz and Buffalo Trace, if in fact some Bernheim is not being used already in the current 10YO ORVW.


    Michael Shoshani
    Chicago

  3. #13
    Bourbonian of the Year 2002 and Guru
    Join Date
    Sep 1999
    Location
    Chicago
    Posts
    12,375

    Re: Old Rip Van Winkle 15 yr 107 proof *THE TRUTH*

    They have made wheated bourbon on and off for a long time. They made some under contract for United Distillers in the late '80s and early '90s.

  4. #14
    Enthusiast
    Join Date
    Nov 1999
    Location
    Chicago
    Posts
    413

    Re: Old Rip Van Winkle 15 yr 107 proof *THE TRUTH*

    Interesting; that aspect of Buffalo Trace's production doesn't get mention in the Regan or Murray books.

    Trade secrets and all that notwithstanding, I wonder how close BT can get to the Old Fitz profile. The Old Rip website has a few extracts from Sally Van Winkle Campbell's book But Always Fine Bourbon, and without disclosing the small grain content she says that Pappy's Old Fitz mashbill was 70% corn. According to Regan & Regan, the Bernheim wheated mashbill was 75% corn, so somewhere down the line it seems there has been a change. Undoubtedly Julian knows what his grandfather's mashbill was, but then there would be several other factors: the water (Pappy was proud of the six wells on the Stitzel Weller property, BT uses Kentucky River water); the aging process (BT may or may not have access to the old ironclad Stitzel Weller warehouses), and the distillation and barrelling proof, which was always a bit lower at Stitz.

    For what it's worth, the bottle of 10YO 107 proof ORVW that I bought last week at Binny's (No 72377 , first bottle I've had for a good long time) tastes the same as I remember my last bottle; full of caramel and with a tad more complexity than its less expensive sibling Old Commonwealth. (I used to consider Old Commonwealth to be one of the best buys for the money, but can't find it now. I'm thinking that either it's been discontinued with the Buffalo Trace deal, or perhaps the brand itself belonged to the late Joe Congiusti and died with him.)

    I always figured that Pappy brought the idea of wheated bourbon with him from Weller, but according the the book extract on Julian's site it was A. Ph. Stitzel who brought it to Pappy when the two distilleries merged. I really have to get a copy of that book; I didn't buy it five years ago when it was $25 because I didn't have the spare cash. Now it's over $40 and I still don't have the spare cash. I'll wait five more years until it hits $60, and then I'll buy it.

    By the way, it's nice to be back after a hiatus of several years; nice to see familiar faces and nice to see that, despite the obvious upgrades in the software, my old login still works!

    Michael Shoshani
    Chicago

  5. #15
    Enthusiast
    Join Date
    Oct 1999
    Location
    Louisville, KY
    Posts
    265

    Re: Old Rip Van Winkle 15 yr 107 proof *THE TRUTH*

    My Dad monkeyed around with different mashbill percentages towards the end of our ownership at SWD. I've got sample bottles from the late 60's with all different kinds of grain percentages on the labels.70% corn was the norm though at SWD. And to the best of my knowledge, BT didn't start making Weller until fall 1998. So there will be about 6 years of Bernheim whiskey we will have to go through until we get to the BT wheated formula, which is the same as we used at Stitzel. Mike, I believe that bottle of 10-year Old Rip would have the Bernheim bourbon in there. I'm glad you liked it. It is diffferent. The Old Commonwealth is unfortunately all gone. We did not continue that label when I joined BT, even though I still own it. I offered it to Joe C. years ago at Sam's. He sold most of it here in the US. He just wanted a different label at a lower price so he could put his sticker on it. That whiskey was the same as my regular ORVW. It was great!
    By the way, we've added a chapter to the "Pappy" book. It's available through the BT gift shop. And yes, it's $40.00.
    Julian

  6. #16
    Enthusiast
    Join Date
    Nov 1999
    Location
    Chicago
    Posts
    413

    Re: Old Rip Van Winkle 15 yr 107 proof *THE TRUTH*

    Julian wrote:

    My Dad monkeyed around with different mashbill percentages towards the end of our ownership at SWD. I've got sample bottles from the late 60's with all different kinds of grain percentages on the labels.70% corn was the norm though at SWD.
    I unearthed an article that quotes you giving Pappy's (and your) specifications for corn and wheat, leaving the reader to guess the barley malt content. The proportions quoted are very similar to the specs Pappy helped T. W. Samuels set up for Makers, but are quite different from the published Bernheim specs of 75% corn, 20% wheat, and 5% barley malt.

    Then again, in my short Google searches for wheated bourbon, not everything has been clear or accurate. I found one site, cocktailtimes.com , that referred to the illustrious and colorful proprietor of the Stitzel-Weller Distillery as "P<font color="red">u</font>ppy" Van Winkle!

  7. #17
    Enthusiast
    Join Date
    Oct 1999
    Location
    Louisville, KY
    Posts
    265

    Re: Old Rip Van Winkle 15 yr 107 proof *THE TRUTH*

    Yeah, that girl, Yuri, is Japanese that writes all the cocktails.com info, so I'm not surprised at the spelling. Maybe "Puppy" is Japanese for "Pappy"!

  8. #18
    Bourbonian of the Year 2002 and Guru
    Join Date
    Sep 1999
    Location
    Chicago
    Posts
    12,375

    Re: Old Rip Van Winkle 15 yr 107 proof *THE TRUTH*

    Hi Hi Pappy Puppy Yum Yum.

  9. #19
    Advanced Taster
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Location
    Upstate New York
    Posts
    128

    Re: Old Rip Van Winkle 15 yr 107 proof *THE TRUTH*

    The ONLY thing I can say Julian, is keep up the great job.
    We've enjoyed every bottle of Van Winkle thats been opened.
    esp. the 20YO.....

  10. #20
    Moderator and Bourbonian Of The Year 2014
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    Brisbane Australia
    Posts
    2,672

    Re: Old Rip Van Winkle 15 yr 107 proof *THE TRUTH*

    The ONLY thing I can say Julian, is keep up the great job.
    We've enjoyed every bottle of Van Winkle thats been opened.
    esp. the 20YO.....
    Ditto!
    I've tried the 13yo Rye &amp; 10yo Bourbon...and both are real treats
    The 15yo is on my 'to order' list next time I get a shippment from the US

 

 

Similar Threads

  1. Old Rip Van Winkle 10 year 107 Proof?
    By Geo in forum General Bourbon Discussion
    Replies: 21
    Last Post: 05-15-2005, 21:32
  2. Old Rip Van Winkle 10 yr, 107 proof -- comments?
    By bandit in forum General Bourbon Discussion
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 11-15-2003, 14:55

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Back to top