Botch -- the scotch/bourbon crossover

[NorCalBoozer]

so there have been threads about which bourbons would "bridge" a scotch drinker over to bourbon and which scotch would be a good first try for a bourbon drinker...

now here is my wild idea.......has anyone actually thought about Gillmanizing a bourbon and scotch to create what I would have to call "botch"??????

I don't know if this would be a vile mixture or if it might be quite decent....knowing that scotch is aged in old bourbon barrels leds me to believe it could be decent

I have zero scotch knowledge so i would have no idea which scotch might be a good one to mix together. any recommendations????

I plan on trying it this weekend, probably going to use a WT or Beam product and some random scotch i pick up.

[nor02lei]

I think you have to take quit a lot more scotch than bourbon to get it in balance, since the bourbon is heavier in style.

Leif

[TNbourbon]

...now here is my wild idea.......has anyone actually thought about Gillmanizing a bourbon and scotch to create what I would have to call "botch"??????..

Well, as Gary would say, I think the idea is to wind up with something that's an improvement of both. In this case, seems like you'd only be improving one of them. So, why?
Oh, okay -- that was somewhat tongue-in-cheek. But, really, I would think you'd have to use a bottom-shelf bourbon and a rich, flavorful Scotch -- maybe, for example, Jim Beam white and The Dalmore 12 or Cigar Malt. I just can't see doing this with one of the nicer bourbons.

[Gillman]

Gentlemen, this has been discussed before, possibly before you both joined the board. Of course one can blend both, and here is why: barley malt is a component of bourbon or straight rye. Barley malt is 100% of a malt scotch whisky. In the 1960's, it was remarked (in writing, I have this) by an old-time practical distiller who had worked for Willett's that modern production methods were changing the taste of bourbon. One way this was being done was by reducing the amount of barley malt (relatively costly) in the mash.

Ergo, a way to return bourbon to a more traditional taste is add malt whisky to it. Use a non-peated example and one not sherried or too sherried. Say, Glenlivet or Balvenie. What is the difference between malt made into whisky on its tod in a Scots mash and malt made into whiskey as part of a multi-grain mash? None, it is still malt being turned into alcohol and fermented. Not only that, the Scots malt is subsequently aged (usually) in - bourbon barrels - which just brings it back to old Kentuck were further reason needed.

Try, say 4:1 bourbon to Glenlivet. It will be very good. Believe me, I've tried.

Gary

[NorCalBoozer]

why? because it's there!

Im gonna try it, it may taste like swill, but what the heck, i'll give it a go. I'm not a scotch guy so I'm not going to feel bad abusing some of it, i'm more worried about wasting some good bourbon, but a few ounces is worth the enjoyment of what this evil concoction might taste like. If it's bad, I can use it to start my BBQ on superbowl sunday.

my purpose? to see if maybe mixing bourbon and scotch is a better bridge than a "scotch-like bourbon" or a "bourbon-like scotch".

[NorCalBoozer]

thanks for the info. i guess i should have tried to seach on this, but your brief history is very informative.

ok so 4:1 Glenlivet, should I go with a high rye bourbon, then?

what bourbons/rye whiskeys would complement the scotch best? thank Gary!

[Gillman]

I would choose almost any bourbon, say Jim Beam Black Label or Evan Williams 7 year old - a commercial style that is well made but might have used more barley malt 50 years ago. Find a malt that is not too assertive in peat or sherry - Glenfiddich would work nicely. 4:1 might work but that might be too much barley malt: maybe 6:1 or 7:1 is best; trial and error should reveal an ideal proportion.

Gary

[TNbourbon]

Well, okay, I did it, just for the experience (it's tough being the Gillmanzer's Apprentice!) -- using some 1968 Jim Beam 86 proof 120-month-old, and my instinctual choice, The Dalmore 12yo (I first had the Glenfiddich in my hand, but opted to match identical proofs -- The Dalmore, too, is 86). The ratio is 4:1 Dalmore:Beam, as instructed.
At first taste, the Beam seemed to simply be lost among all that Scotch. But after a couple of minutes of 'marriage', the corn from the bourbon starts to assert itself a bit in the nose. Still, this seems more like a 'finished' Scotch -- say, in a second-use bourbon barrel -- than any kind of blend or vatting.
It's not bad, but -- like with the port- or madeira-wood finished Glenmorangies -- I think I enjoy the component parts separately more (The Dalmore is a consistent favorite among my handful of single malts).
While I don't feel like I've wasted the whiskies here, I don't think it'll become a habit, either.

[JeffRenner]

Well, okay, I did it ... The ratio is 4:1 Dalmore:Beam, as instructed.

Well, not quite "as instructed":

Try, say 4:1 bourbon to Glenlivet.

You've reversed them.

At first taste, the Beam seemed to simply be lost among all that Scotch.

Not too surprising.

Hope you'll try again with the proportions reversed. I'm planning to.

Jeff

[ratcheer]

"Kids, don't try this at home."



Tim