My Memories of Kinsey Distilling

[dave ziegler]

Jeff All the Distilling in the Years I worked there was done in Phila at Dsp Pa-1 in Phila all year round. The Kinsey Dsp-pa-12 & 10 were not Run after early 1951. As for the Warehouses they had some heat and fans to move the air around year round but it was still cold for us working in there in winter as the materials used to build them Terracota and Cement and 2 foot thick walls sealings and floors. The Fans had a sort of Thermostate to kick them in and out to move the heated air around so the aging Whiskey would not be to cold or Hot. These design's were built into them in the early 1940's when Continental built them. When we worked some of them also had a thermostate that you could turn up to warm things up a little bit more when you worked in that building. You would hear the fans running off and on all the time and they too were explosion proof in design and wiring and switching.

If you look at some of my eariler pictures you can see the Air Vents and places where the Fans were on the outside walls. They the 13 regular ones and the Big Bottle house Building U Had no windows at all. The Warehouse O Being also the offices of the Government Men had some windows and a different set up but the upstairs floors had the same fan set up and heat elements and No windows.

All Heat traveled to the Warehouses by way of an in air on uprights asbestos covered Hot Steam line and it went from all the way out front at the boiler rooms to the very back to the Water Intake room were they pumped water out of the river for fire fighting, That room had hot water pipe elements in it to, and even heat traveled up to the roof of Building Q to the Fire safety Room if you look at my Pictures there you will see a heat element there on the wall too!

Sadly the system of heat traveling in Pipes on up rights is part of the reason it cost so much to run the place. Plus today it is a no,no to have pipes covered with asbestos. Also the type of Elevators in the warehouses were made to load Barrels on the cradels and there was no way to put anything Else on the top floors except to lift it by Chain hoist through the big doors in the walls on the upper floors.
Dave Z
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It Seems All The Nicest People Drink Old Hickory
America's Most Magnificent Bourbon
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[dave ziegler]

Last Night I had some of one of my Bottles of the New Heaven Hills made Rittenhouse Rye it is a wonderful Rye for the price But it is not like Our Rittenhouse rye which was like the old 1942 bottled Mount Vernon Rye I found at the flee market. It is very good and rye flavor but our Rittenhouse had the taste of Fresh Rye bread, carmel and malt and the Old National Distilling Bottle of Rye has that quality to like ours did.

I still tend to think that our rye had something about the mass bill that brought that flavor out. When I have a shot of the Old Mount Vernon distilled 1936 bottled 1942 100 Proof the taste of fresh chewy Rye bread hits your Mouth with caramel and malt. When I cracked it open it took me back to Warehouse D where I had my very first Rye whiskey from a barrel that was about 6 yrs aged and I have not tasted any Rye made today that was the same. And even though it is 100 proof you can just sit and sip it and no need for water or anything else just straight and thats the way I like Rye to be, Dam mixing the water with it just shoot it down slowly and savoir it!

The Old Warehouse D was barely heated with brick walls one or two windows toward the river side and good old wooden racks 48 gal barrels and held the best Rye and Bourbon in the Plant when I started. Our traffic director Bonda got all his whiskey each morning from the old warehouses and He knew his whiskeys having worked there his whole life.

The Whiskey That Continental Used to make their 20 year Old Aniversary Old Hickory came from barrels in warehouse D from the very early 1950's and most likely were Distilled at Kinsey in Dsp-pa-12 and the Rye at Dsp-pa-10
Dave Z
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[Jono]

Dave, be sure to let us know of any email reply by Luxco...we can start an email campaign for the Old Hickory revival if that is what it takes!

[dave ziegler]

Jono That is a great Idea I have not heard anything from them yet but sometimes these things take time as People are very busy. I remember hearing and reading about the past get together in Ky of the Group I think the spring one and someone took Old Hickory to it and Everyone Liked it alot. In fact someone said a man who was a Distiller for many years tried it and said it was Dam good Whiskey! If anyone remembers who that was or tasted it then I would welcome their comments. I am sure that there is someone who could come up with the right mash bill to make it again. Mr Medley made it for a while after he used up what we sold him in bottles and barrels!
I have drank his and it was dam close to the way ours was. I can't say what it is but there something special about that Whiskey in taste and mild Smoothness and all the years I got it regularly it was always top notch.

People would stick to it instead of trying others as they were pleased with it. I have had the 86 proof 10 year and the 80 proof 6 yr and they are Dam Smooth all the way down, I had some of it out of the barrels to be used to and we also had a 100 proof which I never got to try and of course the 20 yr old Aniversary bottling which I never got an of either sadly.

I think if Luxco would find someone that would make it with maybe help from Mr Medley on the Mass bill and left it age for about 6 yrs it would be awesome stuff. When they got started they could just start with some good Older Whiskey and and state that they were bringing it back and that in a couple of years it would be just like the old days and I think it would sell that way till the new batches came out.

There are enough people like me that would buy it because of our love for it back in the day and once they started moving it time would move on and then the happy day when the New 6 yr old stuff has become ready and they could have a special rentroduced bottle with a History of the brand booklet and special labels and maybe even put a fake old time seal on those bottles.
I would buy plenty of it and their are many people I talk to in my work in the office that remember it well. Back in the Old Days the old Pa State stores had special large shelves for it in all sizes there are plenty of people living yet that drank it and they would tell there friends and family about the brand coming back and once people tried it more people would. In its time it was One of The Most Famous Bourbons around, Continental got the name from a distiller out west and turned the brand after Prohibition ended into a household word.

We even Had a large bottle House in Lemont IL that bottled our Old Hckory to sell out west and in Ca. It went oversea's and I guess that is why I never tried some of our other Bourbons because Old Hickory was so dam good. I do know one thing It was different from all our other Bourbons we did not use the same Mash Bill for it as Haller's or the others it had its own special one and that is why it stood out.

If People wanted to mount a e mail campaine to Luxco if they have the brand and we hear from them then I would be proud to help to get it going, I would love while I am still living to drink some brand new Old Hickory and I am finding it very Hard to get any of it anymore. If It comes to that I could use your Help as you find all these Links and sites so well.
Then if It ever comes back the next thing would be trying to get Pa to carry it!
Dave Z
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It Seems All The Nicest People Drink Old Hickory
America's Most magnificent Bourbon
----------------------------------------------------------

[Jono]

Dave, let us confirm that they own the brand and that they have the recipe.
Your commentary on Old Hickory will help them take notice. Of course, we are not clued in to their business plan and capabilities but asking never hurt. Most companies would relish a built in base for their product. A PA special re-entry into the market would be cool with greater distribution coming soon after.

[mozilla]

Even if they own the label...they get all their bourbon as second hand. From what I have read about the Yellowstone quality...it has gone down hill. I doubt Old Hickory would get much better juicethan their other labels.
If they could get some better juice...the cost would probably be somewhere in the range of Jefferson's Reserve.
Maybe the Angosture venture will improve the prospects of bulk market whisky???

[Jono]

If Luxco ever wanted to enter with a premium bourbon...the Old Hickory label would provide the opportunity. It is not a current product, it would be a revived bourbon with all of the potential marketing upside...especially if rolled out in its former distribution areas first....build a base and then grow from there. I guess the key is this....Dave Z recalls a terrific bourbon...based on the mash bill and processes of Kinsey...can it be recreated? If Medley came close....others could as well. This would be a fun and gratifying exercise for the bourbon community....revival of a dead brand. Of course, it would have to compete and succeed in the market. If a quality product is rolled out...the future is unlimited.

Who knows, at some point Luxco may want to own the production end of its business.

[dave ziegler]

Well Put Jono that is my feeling on the return of Old Hickory Bourbon! Right now there are still many people living that drank Old Hickory and as you said bringing it back to the, Pa NJ area would be a awesome move as far as quality they could get soem Help from Mr Medley as far as mash bill and other things He told me the Mans name there and that He thought they still had the brand so they could get his Input and as Jono said they could get their own Distillery in the Future which would be a smart move.

They already Have the Caffe Lolita on the Market and they also have the Haller's reserve Label I think. It would be a bold Move and the reason for Publicker's great sucess back when I worked for them was the Bold Moves That Mr Si Neuman made! He did not sit around thinking should I he thought it out and made the Move.

My Friend who was a top Ex in the Company said that when Mr Neuman went to Scotland the year before Building Inver House Distillery's when He came back sent 10 million Dollars right away and said lets get it going asap!

Waiting is to lose great chances, there are Many people still living that remember and loved Old hickory that gives them a base and also people who will say why don't you try this, and word of mouth is your best selling point!

Dave Z
--------------------------------------------------------
It Seems All The Nicest People Drink Old Hickory
America's Most Magnificent Bourbon
---------------------------------------------------------

[dave ziegler]

Well Put Jono that is my feeling on the return of Old Hickory Bourbon! Right now there are still many people living that drank Old Hickory and as you said bringing it back to the, Pa NJ area would be a awesome move as far as quality they could get soem Help from Mr Medley as far as mash bill and other things He told me the Mans name there and that He thought they still had the brand so they could get his Input and as Jono said they could get their own Distillery in the Future which would be a smart move.

They already Have the Caffe Lolita on the Market and they also have the Haller's reserve Label I think. It would be a bold Move and the reason for Publicker's great sucess back when I worked for them was the Bold Moves That Mr Si Neuman made! He did not sit around thinking should I he thought it out and made the Move.

My Friend who was a top Ex in the Company said that when Mr Neuman went to Scotland the year before Building Inver House Distillery's when He came back sent 10 million Dollars right away and said lets get it going asap!

Waiting is to lose great chances, there are Many people still living that remember and loved Old hickory that gives them a base and also people who will say why don't you try this, and word of mouth is your best selling point!

Dave Z
--------------------------------------------------------
It Seems All The Nicest People Drink Old Hickory
America's Most Magnificent Bourbon
---------------------------------------------------------

I have not yet heard from Luxco and I may send an e mail to the regular company E Mail address, it has only been a couple of days so I am still Hoping to hear from the big Guys office, I think it would be a bold and good move and I have no doubt that if made right Old Hickory could be in that special group of Great Bourbons that rise above the rest!
Dave Z
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It Seems All The Nicest People Drink Old Hickory
America's Most Magnificent Bourbon
------------------------------------------------

[Jono]

I would write to the local marketing rep too......in fact, a nice paper letter to Mr. Lux may work well for getting on his desk...I don't know how to create an online petition but that would be an idea too. This is an interesting experiment...who knows, maybe they will scratch their heads and say "pull our info on that brand and do some test marketing on it...is it still known and is there a base market for it?" The only disappointment would be an inferior product coming out with the same label....rather not have it if it will not be made up to standards.
Keep us posted!
Luxco markets Rebel Yell....can anyone speak to the difference between the old and new whiskey? I have not had either and have never had Ezra Brooks (but from reputation will probably pass on that one).