Iron Horse Kentucky Bourbon

[barturtle]

74 proof? Scott, did you know it would be at that proof when you placed the order? I have a bottle of Prichards Sweet Lucy and I beleive it is at 70 proof.

Can it be called bourbon at a proof lower than 80? I'll have to check the bottle of Lucy and see what it says on the bottle.

Not in the US. I believe Sweet Lucy says something like Bourbon Liqueur.

There may be a diluted bourbon category for those places in the US that only allow up to a certain proof in groceries and such, though

[barturtle]

Hmmm....found this in a document dated 2003...

5.2 Protection for GI Spirits
The current regulations for spirits only allow geographic indications to be indicated for spirits
if the %ABV in the spirit is at a level permitted by the laws of the country of origin.
5.2.1 Bourbon whisky
Under US law the federal regulations specify no whisky can be called Bourbon unless it has
been manufactured within the United States according to a specific Bourbon formula. This
formula requires Bourbon to be bottled at not less than 80 degrees proof (40% ABV) unless
otherwise noted on the label it has been ‘diluted’. However, the US provides a waiver for
exports which permits the bottling of Bourbon at 37% ABV without reflecting that the
product has been ‘diluted’.

[ggilbertva]

Hmmm....found this in a document dated 2003...

That is interesting. I thought bourbon had to be at 80 proof but didn't realize that export could be lower and still be called bourbon. Guess that's something to watch for when shopping internationally. Thanks.

[cowdery]

The real answer is that U.S. standard of identity for distilled spirits, including TTB labeling rules, only apply to products sold in the United States. US-made products sold in other countries have to conform to the laws of those countries.

[bluesbassdad]

Chuck,

Check me on this.

Distillers in other countries can theoretically make a product that is indistinguishable from bourbon, but they can't call it "bourbon".

Distillers in the USA can make a product that is not bourbon under US law and sell it as bourbon in those other countries.

Do I have it right?

Yours truly,
Dave Morefield

[camduncan]

I was under the impression that Iron Horse was a Heaven Hill brand bottled for Australia? Kind of like Nelson County and (probably) several other bottlings we have?

[barturtle]

Distillers in other countries can theoretically make a product that is indistinguishable from bourbon, but they can't call it "bourbon".

Distillers in the USA can make a product that is not bourbon under US law and sell it as bourbon in those other countries.

Do I have it right?

Sounds about right to me. Though if the country doesn't have an agreement with the US to protect those "protected geographic region names" then they could probably still use the title "bourbon". Of course any country that doesn't have this sort of trade agreement probably doesn't do much business with the US anyway and the market for such things would be little...

But Chuck might know better

[wku88]

Regardless of the "technicalities", it ain't bourbon unless:
1) The mashbill is >51% corn
2) It's fermented, distilled, and aged in Kentucky in new charred oak barrels
3)the ABV is 43% or greater
4) the only thing mixed with it before it goes in the bottle is limestone spring water.
5)the whiskey can be mixed with different ages, but must not be mixed with distillate from different recipes

It may be whiskey, it may taste good, but unless it meets the above criteria, it ain't bourbon to me. You want different taste profiles, fine, but don't call it Bourbon unless it is from the same recipe. American Whisky is a fine label for blends and watered down stuff...but please don't call it Bourbon.

[Barrel_Proof]

Regardless of the "technicalities", it ain't bourbon unless:
1) The mashbill is >51% corn
2) It's fermented, distilled, and aged in Kentucky in new charred oak barrels
3)the ABV is 43% or greater
4) the only thing mixed with it before it goes in the bottle is limestone spring water.
5)the whiskey can be mixed with different ages, but must not be mixed with distillate from different recipes

It may be whiskey, it may taste good, but unless it meets the above criteria, it ain't bourbon to me. You want different taste profiles, fine, but don't call it Bourbon unless it is from the same recipe. American Whisky is a fine label for blends and watered down stuff...but please don't call it Bourbon.

Why greater than 51% corn, when the rest of the world considers 51% just fine? Now if you were to say not less than 75% corn, I could understand your point. The final criterion means that no Four Roses bottlings except its Single Barrels qualify as bourbon to you. Both of these criteria seem pretty arbitrary to me.

[camduncan]

Regardless of the "technicalities", it ain't bourbon unless:
1) The mashbill is >51% corn
2) It's fermented, distilled, and aged in Kentucky in new charred oak barrels
3)the ABV is 43% or greater
4) the only thing mixed with it before it goes in the bottle is limestone spring water.
5)the whiskey can be mixed with different ages, but must not be mixed with distillate from different recipes

It may be whiskey, it may taste good, but unless it meets the above criteria, it ain't bourbon to me. You want different taste profiles, fine, but don't call it Bourbon unless it is from the same recipe. American Whisky is a fine label for blends and watered down stuff...but please don't call it Bourbon.

Hmmmm, someone better tell Jim Beam that they aren't selling bourbon in Australia then ......All Jim Beam White sold in Australia is shipped here (in barrels I assume) and bottled at 37.5% and is still legally able to be called bourbon....