Sad Manhattans

[bigtoys]

I hadn't really thought about it, but I do know that I order my martinis "up". I frequently order my bourbon on the rocks when I'm out, but now that I think about it, one of my friends orders scotch "neat".

I looked around the virtual world and that seems to be the consensus.

Up: Drink stirred/shaken with ice and strained into a (usually stemmed) glass. However, I've had bourbon this way; get it cool, but don't keep diluting it and it should probably be in a double old-fashioned.

Neat: Drink poured straight from the bottle at whatever temperature it's stored at. That is, a glass of vodka stored in the freezer is considered neat. Guess the glass should be double old-fashioned.

How many ounces should be in a straight bourbon drink, be it on the rocks or neat? Seems like it should be the same as a martini, since vermouth is a pretty minor ingredient in a 'tini. Around here, the premium brands go for $10 or so. What should we be getting? Seems like some places give around 6 oz. That's a good amount of alcohol, if I'm right.

[Jake_Parrott]

Standard bar pour is 1.5 ounces. UK standard bar pour is 25mL (doubles are often ordered). Many bars will offer a "martini" pour for gin and vodka that is more than 1.5 ounces (but usually not a double) due to the size of their cocktail glasses (a standard bar pour looks shy in too-large cocktail glasses).

[Rughi]

I was just standing in line at the Bevmo and leafed through their bartender's guide. The glossary listed straight up as another way of saying neat - no ice, no mixer, just a shot in a stemmed glass.

I wonder if this is a regional difference. I'm so used to bartenders in my area giving me a blank look when I say neat that I've given that up and say straight up. I've never been given a chilled drink from that request before.

My mother-in-law was a bartender in Cambridge, Mass and Idaho and she just told me straight up was a synonym for neat in the places she worked - so it being a regional difference seems even less clear cut and er... neat.

Roger "not stirred not shaken... and no fuckin' ice!" Hodges

[Rughi]

And of course, when I told my wife about this controversy, she wanted... a Manhattan

-Shaken, not stirred.
-With Rye - Not Bourbon (not even Grand Dad or 4 Roses) - and especially not a Wheater.
-With Angostura and Orange Bitters.
And 2 Cherries

Yes, Ma'am....

Bye for now,

Roger

[gothbat]

I always thought that "straight up" meant neat but I guess I've just been lucky. The only time I've had a problem using "neat" was on an airplane, I said I was going to drink the mini neat and the steward handed me a cup with ice along with it. Could have been worse... (Like the time I ordered "a bourbon" at the AC Tropicana, the girl came back with a cup that was 1/3 bourbon and 2/3 water...)
I don't drink at bars often but in my experience most bartenders don't know what's what these days. Most of the times I ask what kinds of bourbon they have and the first bottle they'll list is Jack Daniels...

[ILLfarmboy]

I was just standing in line at the Bevmo and leafed through their bartender's guide. The glossary listed straight up as another way of saying neat - no ice, no mixer, just a shot in a stemmed glass.

I wonder if this is a regional difference. I'm so used to bartenders in my area giving me a blank look when I say neat that I've given that up and say straight up. I've never been given a chilled drink from that request before.

My mother-in-law was a bartender in Cambridge, Mass and Idaho and she just told me straight up was a synonym for neat in the places she worked - so it being a regional difference seems even less clear cut and er... neat.

Roger "not stirred not shaken... and no fuckin' ice!" Hodges

It was always my understanding that "straight up" originally meant shaken or stirred with ice and then strained into a glass but has been corrupted to mean a synonym for neat when asking for just whiskey. I have even had bartenders who were unfamiliar with the term "neat" exclaim most people just ask for it "straight up" when that's the way they want it.

Like you I have almost given up and started saying "straight up". But I'm horribly stubborn, intractable and resistant to change. Just ask my wife.

[burbankbrewer]

If I ordered a drink at a high end place and specified how I wanted it and it came differently, I would send it back and refuse to pay for it. Then, if it were truly a high end place, they would correct their mistake.

Tim

I was at a christmas party and didn't feel like waiting for another. The place was packed. The drink tasted good and I took out the ice. I 'm thinking of making cards to give when I go out, or tell em, if it's not the way I ordered it, someone else is drinkin it, cause it aint gonna be me.

[Jake_Parrott]

It was always my understanding that "straight up" originally meant shaken or stirred with ice and then strained into a glass but has been corrupted to mean a synonym for neat when asking for just whiskey.

Methinks this fellow has hit the nail on the head. "Straight up" has become another way of asking for cold gin or vodka (i.e., no vermouth) in a cocktail glass (which is not called a "martini glass").

So few people drink whiskey neat in bars that I imagine a lot of bartenders might do a double take at either "straight up" or "neat."

[burbankbrewer]

They had me until they garnished with lemon but I'm gonna try it. The mechanics look sound.

http://www.videojug.com/film/how-to-make-a-manhattan

[ratcheer]

I don't drink at bars often but in my experience most bartenders don't know what's what these days. Most of the times I ask what kinds of bourbon they have and the first bottle they'll list is Jack Daniels...

I agree 100%. Most bartenders these days have next to no knowledge of classic cocktails, liquors, and bar methods. It is all about fancy modern "cocktails" that aren't even really cocktails.

In my experience, "straight up" and "neat" have meant exactly the same thing. But, I am an old fashioned old timer.

Tim