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  1. #911
    Bourbonian of the Year 2011
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    Re: Which Water of Life Did You Purchase Today?

    I think most would agree that Beam bourbon isn't really heavy on the barrel, you have to go up to 9 years old - Knob Creek - to get some noticeably assertive barrel influence. Even then Knob Creek isn't a bourbon heavy on tannin and wood sugars, neither is Booker's, or Baker.

    Therefore, I'd argue the raw grains tend to show up more in its profile - not a raw taste, I'm talking about the effects on the palate of distilling mostly from non-malted grains.

    This is exactly the case with pure pot still Irish, now called single pot still Irish. The majority of the mash is from unmalted grains (barley in that case). And there is likewize no charred barrel to cover over that taste. And both this form of Irish and bourbon are typically sold at 6-8 years aging, a bit higher in some cases.

    Scotch malt is 100% barley malt which results in a softer taste to begin with and also, the grains taste often is modified with a peat flavour. Finally, Scotch malt is typically aged rather longer than most bourbon and pot still Irish on the market. Redbreast at 12 and 15 years is the outside limit for pure pot still aging but most comes in from 8-10 years age, this is the range of Green Spot for example, and the pot still elements of regular Jameson and Powers are probably around 6-8 years.

    Putting it a different way, I think other bourbons would show a similar connection to pure pot still Irish whiskey but often the barrel effect of U.S. straight whiskey obscures it. But I get an Irish-like connection too with WR, with it's pot still component. It presents assertively the raw grains taste - the triple pot stills do even at 159 - yet at 5-6 years aging the barrel doesn't have time to cover it over and transform it. Or take any young bourbon from HH or Buffalo Trace, say, that doughy oily taste from the grains is similar to good Irish pot still.

    Just a theory, but to me it makes sense that Irish methods would inform early American ones. I've read that before Bushmills in Ulster - home of the Scots-Irish who emigrated in significant numbers to parts of Appalachia - used all-malt, it used a typical Ireland mashbill of unmalted grains and barley malt...

    Gary
    Last edited by Gillman; 05-04-2012 at 06:06.

  2. #912
    Connoisseur
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    Oct 2011
    Location
    downtown DC
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    762

    Re: Which Water of Life Did You Purchase Today?

    Am I right that you're saying they used unmalted barley with barley malt? If that's the case, do you mean that they added extracted liquid to the unmalted grain?

    A general question - can you get the same amount of sugar from fermentation of unmalted grain, or is it just impossible, no matter how long you wait? Also, I'm guessing that specialty yeast strains are needed - would this also be true?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gillman View Post
    I think most would agree that Beam bourbon isn't really heavy on the barrel, you have to go up to 9 years old - Knob Creek - to get some noticeably assertive barrel influence. Even then Knob Creek isn't a bourbon heavy on tannin and wood sugars, neither is Booker's, or Baker.

    Therefore, I'd argue the raw grains tend to show up more in its profile - not a raw taste, I'm talking about the effects on the palate of distilling mostly from non-malted grains.

    This is exactly the case with pure pot still Irish, now called single pot still Irish. The majority of the mash is from unmalted grains (barley in that case). And there is likewize no charred barrel to cover over that taste. And both this form of Irish and bourbon are typically sold at 6-8 years aging, a bit higher in some cases.

    Scotch malt is 100% barley malt which results in a softer taste to begin with and also, the grains taste often is modified with a peat flavour. Finally, Scotch malt is typically aged rather longer than most bourbon and pot still Irish on the market. Redbreast at 12 and 15 years is the outside limit for pure pot still aging but most comes in from 8-10 years age, this is the range of Green Spot for example, and the pot still elements of regular Jameson and Powers are probably around 6-8 years.

    Putting it a different way, I think other bourbons would show a similar connection to pure pot still Irish whiskey but often the barrel effect of U.S. straight whiskey obscures it. But I get an Irish-like connection too with WR, with it's pot still component. It presents assertively the raw grains taste - the triple pot stills do even at 159 - yet at 5-6 years aging the barrel doesn't have time to cover it over and transform it. Or take any young bourbon from HH or Buffalo Trace, say, that doughy oily taste from the grains is similar to good Irish pot still.

    Just a theory, but to me it makes sense that Irish methods would inform early American ones. I've read that before Bushmills in Ulster - home of the Scots-Irish who emigrated in significant numbers to parts of Appalachia - used all-malt, it used a typical Ireland mashbill of unmalted grains and barley malt...

    Gary

  3. #913
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    Sep 2008
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    2,862

    Re: Which Water of Life Did You Purchase Today?

    Went on a small spree yesterday and picked up bottles of Laphroaig Quarter Cask, Talisker 10 and Caol Ila 12. Along with the Highland Park 12 and Lagavulin 16 I bought not long ago, I now have (nearly) all of my favorite single malts back in the cabinet. I'll be turning my attention to Speysides soon and have my eye on Aberlour 16 (I love that whisky!) and Balvenie DoubleWood. (I still have a few bottles of the now-discontinued Balvenie Founders Reserve 10 in the bunker which I hope to stretch for years to come.)
    "I distrust a man who says 'when.' He's got to be careful not to drink too much, because he's not to be trusted when he does." Sydney Greenstreet

  4. #914
    Virtuoso
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    Nov 2007
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    paradise Miyazaki, Japan
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    Re: Which Water of Life Did You Purchase Today?

    Quote Originally Posted by unclebunk View Post
    Went on a small spree yesterday and picked up bottles of Laphroaig Quarter Cask, ...
    I bought a small bunker-load of LaphQC (found it for $35/700ml bottle-taxes, shipping an' all) and just opened up one after dinner- and I swear to God that SMOKE (or something that looks just like it) came out of the bottle when I wrenched out the cork (which seemed a lot tighter than usual ... if that has anything to do with it.) I took a whiff and it sure smelled like Islay peat smoke!

    Damn!

    I also got Arran 10 y.o. and Knockando 12 y.o. - but haven't ever tasted them ... yet.
    Last edited by edo; 05-05-2012 at 04:52.
    Peace, ... and Hippy Love.

  5. #915
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    Re: Which Water of Life Did You Purchase Today?

    Quote Originally Posted by edo View Post
    I bought a small bunker-load of LaphQC (found it for $35/700ml bottle-taxes, shipping an' all) and just opened up one after dinner- and I swear to God that SMOKE (or something that looks just like it) came out of the bottle when I wrenched out the cork (which seemed a lot tighter than usual ... if that has anything to do with it.) I took a whiff and it sure smelled like Islay peat smoke!

    Damn!

    I also got Arran 10 y.o. and Knockando 12 y.o. - but haven't ever tasted them ... yet.
    Man, that's a seriously good price on the Laphroaig QC. I'm looking at $55 most places around here and that's before taxes! So, now those clever Scots have even figured out a way to bottle actual peat smoke? Very cool! I enjoyed my bottle of Arran 10 but you should expect something light and refreshing, not briney and rugged. Let us know what you think of it and the Knockando as well when you get around to them.
    "I distrust a man who says 'when.' He's got to be careful not to drink too much, because he's not to be trusted when he does." Sydney Greenstreet

  6. #916
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    Jul 2009
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    Massillon, Oh.
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    1,255

    Re: Which Water of Life Did You Purchase Today?

    I was going to replace my bottle of Lagavulin 16 today, but, at almost $90.00...... I'll pass.

  7. #917
    Virtuoso
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    Apr 2011
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    Sutton, Massachusetts
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    1,290

    Re: Which Water of Life Did You Purchase Today?

    Glenfarclas 21 y.o. ...
    Mark

  8. #918
    Taster
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    Jan 2011
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    Newberry, FL
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    91

    Re: Which Water of Life Did You Purchase Today?Airi

    Airigh Nam Beist - the 18 year old version.

  9. #919
    Advanced Taster
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
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    176

    Re: Which Water of Life Did You Purchase Today?

    Dalmore Cigar Malt (the older one)
    Sheep Dip Old Hebridean

  10. #920
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    Re: Which Water of Life Did You Purchase Today?Airi

    Quote Originally Posted by onewman View Post
    Airigh Nam Beist - the 18 year old version.
    How is it? /me jealous

 

 

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