Schultz24 Posted November 30, 2017 Share Posted November 30, 2017 With such a low bottling this year, what do you all think one of these might be worth in the future? Fairly new to bourbons, so do low numbers up the secondary value much? Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CardsandBourbon Posted November 30, 2017 Share Posted November 30, 2017 We buy bourbon to drink, not for what it's value later on the secondary market might be. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry in WashDC Posted November 30, 2017 Share Posted November 30, 2017 1 hour ago, Schultz24 said: With such a low bottling this year, what do you all think one of these might be worth in the future? Fairly new to bourbons, so do low numbers up the secondary value much? Thanks! Welcome to SB. You'll find lots of bourbon history info here as well as lots of opinions on what lots of bourbons (and other spirits and beers) taste like to lots of people. Be sure to check out "New to StraightBourbon" under "Home" which leads off with a "sticky" topic from the Boss, jbutler. Also, read through the next several stickys. All stickys are marked with a green box with a stickpin icon in it. They'll help you figure out what this site is all about and what you can expect from its members and what they expect from you. RE: your question - a bottle of bourbon to me is worth what I am willing to pay for it, and I only buy from licensed, commercial dealers because buying one from anybody else is a violation of federal and state laws as is selling one if you are NOT a licensed, commercial dealer. In 50+ years of drinking bourbon legally, if have NEVER paid more than MSRP for one, and there are lots of them on the shelf that I wouldn't buy at HALF the MSRP. Also, I don't trust the secondary market. Browse through the recent topics about the secondary market, and you'll see why I don't trust it. That Koch Brother story is something. Search the internet for "Koch bourbon". I look forward to you comments on your journey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schultz24 Posted November 30, 2017 Author Share Posted November 30, 2017 1 hour ago, CardsandBourbon said: We buy bourbon to drink, not for what it's value later on the secondary market might be. I get it, and also buy and drink more bourbon than my wife cares for me too!!! Just was curious since it seemed like a very linited bottling this year especially. I look forward to the great info that this forum will provide! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schultz24 Posted November 30, 2017 Author Share Posted November 30, 2017 (edited) 13 minutes ago, Harry in WashDC said: Welcome to SB. You'll find lots of bourbon history info here as well as lots of opinions on what lots of bourbons (and other spirits and beers) taste like to lots of people. Be sure to check out "New to StraightBourbon" under "Home" which leads off with a "sticky" topic from the Boss, jbutler. Also, read through the next several stickys. All stickys are marked with a green box with a stickpin icon in it. They'll help you figure out what this site is all about and what you can expect from its members and what they expect from you. RE: your question - a bottle of bourbon to me is worth what I am willing to pay for it, and I only buy from licensed, commercial dealers because buying one from anybody else is a violation of federal and state laws as is selling one if you are NOT a licensed, commercial dealer. In 50+ years of drinking bourbon legally, if have NEVER paid more than MSRP for one, and there are lots of them on the shelf that I wouldn't buy at HALF the MSRP. Also, I don't trust the secondary market. Browse through the recent topics about the secondary market, and you'll see why I don't trust it. That Koch Brother story is something. Search the internet for "Koch bourbon". I look forward to you comments on your journey. Thanks for your comments and I will read up on the stickeys. Have you been able to buy all of the big boys at MSRP (PVW 20/23, BTAC), or fo you just steer clear of them or maybe try at a bar?? Seems like they are super hard to find in most places. Thanks Edited November 30, 2017 by Schultz24 Forgot something Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schultz24 Posted December 1, 2017 Author Share Posted December 1, 2017 Im not finding the koch bourbon story. Anyone have a link?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gorzo Posted December 1, 2017 Share Posted December 1, 2017 If your intentions are to make money flipping bourbon.... good luck. The reason I say that is if your asking the questions you are your too late. Your not going to find PVW20/23 or anything in that category unless you know somebody , know someone who knows somebody or win a lottery. You may have a 1-5% chance of finding other limited stuff that's just the way it is, so I get your wondering about the secondary market. When I first started on this site I asked some of the same type of questions and got scolded, so don't feel bad you can bounce back. I did the whole secondary market thing, never to make money,but to try stuff that I could never find. It's not worth it trust me. If you can tell a $400 difference in Stagg JR and GTS I will kiss your ass. If you want one of these bottles be patient let it come to you or try a pour at a bar. This site is a wonderful resource to find what people enjoy and to get ideas on trying new things, it's not for investment questions. As far as what you just referenced it was a counterfeit scam of wine bottles if I remember correctly. I personally don't think fakes are as prevalent as some on this site, but something you may want to be aware of if you go the secondary market route. I do realize it is illegal, but that wouldn't be my main concern. I would be worried ordering a bottle of PVW and getting a bag of cheetos in the mail. Who are you going to go to to get your money back.... the cops. Stick with enjoying Bourbon for what is. The smart money is already in on the investment side and your probably way to late to cash in. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whiskeythink.com Posted December 1, 2017 Share Posted December 1, 2017 (edited) 11 hours ago, Gorzo said: If you can tell a $400 difference in Stagg JR and GTS I will kiss your ass. Well said Gorzo. Welcome to the site & please jump in on discussions with your opinions! I have not been here long at all compared to some, but there is an incredible wealth of knowledge to be had here, as well as real discussion on whats going on in bourbon. Secondary values can be found on the many facebook groups that are dedicated more to selling secondary, showing off unicorns, and dissing others. Peeps here show off what they are buying/drinking no matter the price or rarity, aimed at discussing taste (and value) rather than bragging about trophies. But you will see unicorns here because many have established their connections and buy them at or close to retail. I stay away from secondary because I am a cheap ass with a limited budget, & no way GTS is $400 better. I can buy 10 bottles of 12-13 yr KCSB store pix with that. Rarity dont make it taste better. That said, who has tried this years ER17, and how is it? Edited December 1, 2017 by Whiskeythink.com 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry in WashDC Posted December 1, 2017 Share Posted December 1, 2017 18 hours ago, Schultz24 said: Im not finding the koch bourbon story. Anyone have a link?? Sorry. It was counterfeit wine, and the Koch brother was Bill Koch. Search SB for "counterfeit". the Story is linkede in one of the threads about counterfeit spirits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schultz24 Posted December 1, 2017 Author Share Posted December 1, 2017 2 hours ago, Harry in WashDC said: Sorry. It was counterfeit wine, and the Koch brother was Bill Koch. Search SB for "counterfeit". the Story is linkede in one of the threads about counterfeit spirits. Perfect, thanks! Found a few good articles. Anything I have ever gotten is either off the shelf or at auction from a reputable store. But it is good to know this is going on to be careful!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry in WashDC Posted December 1, 2017 Share Posted December 1, 2017 (edited) 24 minutes ago, Schultz24 said: Perfect, thanks! Found a few good articles. Anything I have ever gotten is either off the shelf or at auction from a reputable store. But it is good to know this is going on to be careful!! I live in Washington DC, and we have a peculiar alcohol beverage control system. Essentially, we are two-tier instead of three-tier in that the local government does not sit between wholesalers and retailers. Rather, it licenses but does not own. Consequently, some stores do offer secondary market resales picked up at estate sales, wholesale liquidations, etc. Nevertheless, I have not been motivated (YET!!!) to purchase, say, a 1956 bottling of Hiram Walker 8YO BIB. (Made that up so I didn't pick on a store I shop at regularly and cause [that guy I joke with] to cut me off from recently released mid-priced, semi-rare LEs - I am no fool, mostly.) Instead, I took the $1,500 asking price and . . . So, you up to 6 posts. Coming along fine. You said you are recently into bourbon. What have you tried that you really like? Each of us has a different taste, but over time, I have found, some SBers tend to like many things I like, some things are liked by most of us, and a few things are an acquired taste. For example, until earlier this year, I had NEVER tasted Old Ezra 101 proof 7 yrs old (written on SB sort of as OE101 7YR). The brand is owned by Luxco, a nondistiller producer (NDP), but it's bourbon made by and purchased from Heaven Hill (HH). It is a bottom shelfer - dirt cheap for what it is, frowned upon by the masses, a terrible mixer (i.e., DO NOT MAKE COCKTAILS WITH THIS!!), and funny off flavors. I LOVE IT In other words, welcome, again, and keeps us old fahts posted on our travels through bourbon-land. Edited December 1, 2017 by Harry in WashDC left out a crucial apostrophe - my bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schultz24 Posted December 2, 2017 Author Share Posted December 2, 2017 Currently sipping on ER10, and just got back from a bourbon auction. Everything went for secondary values ($400+ for ORVW). Was hoping to try to get something nice for a deal, but no luck. A Weller 12 went for $200 which seems crazy to me!!! Other than the ER, I really like 4R Single Barrel, Stagg Jr, and actually OGD114. Also a pretty big fan of a good rye such as most of High West's offerings. I'm having a pretty good time so far, but spending quite a bit (retail cost or reputable auction only) and probably drinking more than I should!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCFan Posted December 2, 2017 Share Posted December 2, 2017 8 hours ago, Schultz24 said: Currently sipping on ER10, and just got back from a bourbon auction. Where was this? Welcome to the group. And don't think that everyone here is a purist and only pays MSRP. Plenty of people here walk into LS's everyday of the week and pay double or more just to get that precious bottle. Myself living in a control state I don't have that dilemma. But DC is but a short car ride away where I can hit up Costco and get my booze at Costco prices. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schultz24 Posted December 2, 2017 Author Share Posted December 2, 2017 I'm in Wisconsin. Seems like most of the big stores around here do lotteries and others do auctions. I'm going to keep trying to make relationships by buying during the year from 1 main store to see if they will help me get my hands on something good next fall. Good thing is that I generally have no trouble finding common and even tougher to find drinkers (stagg jr, blanton's, 4R, bookers, etc). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bourserker Posted December 9, 2017 Share Posted December 9, 2017 You sorta got scolded here, but don't fret. I see where you have already taken it in stride. I also understand the drive to want to get those unicorns, I used to be there. One thing I can say is that it's fun to get them and a lot of them are good, but to be honest they don't taste that much better than some of the standard stuff...to me anyway. I clearly do not have the olfactory system and palette of some of these tasters that get like 30 different things out of a single pour. I can typically only pick up a few things from a pour myself...caramel, wood, vanilla, maybe one or two other things. The main thing I notice between the easier to get "standard" stuff and the unicorns is that the latter are usually higher quality, better balanced, and richer. Anyway, if you are one of those that picks up the 30 different things then the unicorns might be worth the trouble, but if not I can guarantee you that you aren't missing that much. On 12/2/2017 at 10:54 AM, Schultz24 said: I'm in Wisconsin. Seems like most of the big stores around here do lotteries and others do auctions. I'm going to keep trying to make relationships by buying during the year from 1 main store to see if they will help me get my hands on something good next fall. Good thing is that I generally have no trouble finding common and even tougher to find drinkers (stagg jr, blanton's, 4R, bookers, etc). I'm not in the habit of divulging my honey holes, and therefore will not. What will say is that I travel to WI once a year, and I often find many things up there that I have trouble finding in most other places...and the prices are usually fair. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeeTen Posted December 13, 2017 Share Posted December 13, 2017 On 12/1/2017 at 9:02 AM, Whiskeythink.com said: Rarity dont make it taste better. That said, who has tried this years ER17, and how is it? Here's a link to my notes on a tasting of the 2017 Pappy/BTAC collection, minus the THH (Thomas H. Handy rye) which hadn't been delivered yet. But I did win one in the Hold Card lottery when they did arrive. Tasting notes are further down the page. YMMV. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCFan Posted December 16, 2017 Share Posted December 16, 2017 I attended a bourbon tasting the other evening put together by someone who works where I do. That's all I can divulge on that. He put a notice on the work website where employees advertise things for sale and the like. There were 7 others who attended. I brought my OGD BiB, Rhetoric 23 and WTRB to share. One of the things I noticed was that my taste buds are fried well before I'm on my 8th bourbon to taste. So to connect this to the thread the host had a ER10 for the tasting and someone else brought the ER17 (he said he got it for $60 at Costco some time not long ago). I couldn't really taste the difference between the 2 but that could be that my buds were fried at this point. And in the immortal words of Forrest Gump, that's all I have to say about that. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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