What do you consider to be ‘bottom shelf’?

[Mako254]

The BiB ‘bottom shelf’ thread got me to thinking. By my measurement, any bourbon that meets BiB standards is by default not a ‘bottom shelfer’ despite where the store guy stocks it. No doubt, most BiBs are work horse bourbons aimed at value conscious consumers but that doesn’t make it bottom shelf per se. 

 

To me, bottom shelf is blended or stuff less than 4 years of age. 

 

Just my ramblings. 

 

[kevinbrink]

I think bottom shelf and least favorite are two different things, at a bar I tend to go with QPR which is of course subjective, if the available bourbons on the shelf are Makers and Woodford I tend to ask what's in the well and as long as it is just about any other KSBW I go with the well. 

[0895]

24 minutes ago, kevinbrink said:

I tend to ask what's in the well and as long as it is just about any other KSBW I go with the well. 

 

Good advice to always check the well @ a bar. 

I’ve been surprised with a bargain pour a few times. 

 

Bottom shelfers to me are typically things I won’t buy.  Pure garbage can items. Sometimes these get stocked on higher shelves and have elevated price tags to try and trick you. 

I will buy BiB’s and most things that are KSBW. 

[rjg1701]

I tend to regard any given (major) distilleries most entry level product as bottom shelf.  By that definition there are no bottom shelf BIB.

[PhantomLamb]

2 hours ago, rjg1701 said:

I tend to regard any given (major) distilleries most entry level product as bottom shelf.  By that definition there are no bottom shelf BIB.

Agreed.  Pretty much anything that tastes thin/like garbage is bottom shelf to me.

[Harry in WashDC]

53 minutes ago, PhantomLamb said:

Agreed.  Pretty much anything that tastes thin/like garbage is bottom shelf to me.

Uh, some of us bottom feeders take pride in being able to tell the difference between "inexpensive" and "crap".  It's all in the tasting.  Unfortunately, one must taste "it" which sometimes leads to, "Yeah, that's crap."  OTOH, I do pass on anything @ $10 or less per handle.  And on Old Crow.  Which I've tasted.

[Mako254]

35 minutes ago, Harry in WashDC said:

Uh, some of us bottom feeders take pride in being able to tell the difference between "inexpensive" and "crap".  It's all in the tasting.  Unfortunately, one must taste "it" which sometimes leads to, "Yeah, that's crap."  OTOH, I do pass on anything @ $10 or less per handle.  And on Old Crow.  Which I've tasted.

 

I remember that VBT!

 

I agree Harry. Inexpensive doesn’t mean poor quality. I’ll see WT101 referred to as bottom shelf and I just shake my head. Sneak 101 into the next blind you do with yours buddies and see what happens. 

 

[kevinbrink]

1 hour ago, Mako254 said:

 

I remember that VBT!

 

I agree Harry. Inexpensive doesn’t mean poor quality. I’ll see WT101 referred to as bottom shelf and I just shake my head. Sneak 101 into the next blind you do with yours buddies and see what happens. 

 

I have never understood that one, WT 81/80 have always been the bottom shelf iteration. 

[Spade]

In my mind it’s anything that goes for around $10-15 or less. There’s some decent pours in that range too. I think AAA10* is alright. And both the white and black label Evan Williams are quite good for the price. I’ve always wondered who’s buying the green label which is not good and like fifty cents less than the white or black label. 

[Billy Reis]

I think the Green label 6 yr BIB is good for the price and I really like the VOB BIB. Both are in the sub 15$ bracket but do not drink like bottom self.

[Kane]

In my opinion WT81, JBW etc. are still worthy and perfectly drinkable next to some other truly bad stuff like Old Crow and Benchmark.

[kevinbrink]

12 minutes ago, Kane said:

In my opinion WT81, JBW etc. are still worthy and perfectly drinkable next to some other truly bad stuff like Old Crow and Benchmark.

True statement. 

[mbroo5880i]

I consider blended or non-straight bourbon bottom shelf.  Straight bourbon that is inexpensive is cheap bourbon.

[PaulO]

I say blended whiskey made from grain neutral spirit and flavoring is always bottom shelf.  I don't even need to try it.

Most of the 80 proof bourbons I consider bottom shelf regardless of price.  My main exception is Four Roses.

 

  

[Richnimrod]

9 hours ago, mbroo5880i said:

I consider blended or non-straight bourbon bottom shelf.  Straight bourbon that is inexpensive is cheap bourbon.

...AND... 'Cheap Bourbon' is nirvana!      ...In many cases. 

Kinda reminds me of a gal waaaay back in the halcyon days of my wild oats who never wanted me to spend a lot of money on dates and such; only wanted to go under the bleachers after dark and get busy. 

Never needed anything but a blanket.    

[mbroo5880i]

14 hours ago, Richnimrod said:

...AND... 'Cheap Bourbon' is nirvana!      ...In many cases. 

Kinda reminds me of a gal waaaay back in the halcyon days of my wild oats who never wanted me to spend a lot of money on dates and such; only wanted to go under the bleachers after dark and get busy. 

Never needed anything but a blanket.    

Right you are!  Working on a little Night Moves.  

[PhantomLamb]

On 7/26/2018 at 4:25 PM, Harry in WashDC said:

Uh, some of us bottom feeders take pride in being able to tell the difference between "inexpensive" and "crap".  It's all in the tasting.  Unfortunately, one must taste "it" which sometimes leads to, "Yeah, that's crap."  OTOH, I do pass on anything @ $10 or less per handle.  And on Old Crow.  Which I've tasted.

I agree, to me, I get a certain degree of pride of finding something cheap that's still smooth.  Now, if you are talking bourbon to mix with, it's a whole different ballgame IMHO.

[Mako254]

On 7/27/2018 at 10:37 PM, mbroo5880i said:

I consider blended or non-straight bourbon bottom shelf.  Straight bourbon that is inexpensive is cheap bourbon.

 

You condensed my thoughts into two sentences. 

[CardsandBourbon]

I guess bottom shelf to me would be stuff that is undrinkable.  The stuff I have that is considered bottom shelf is pretty good (HH BIB, VOB BIB, Old Fitzgerald BIB0.  I feel like my finding this forum early in my bourbon journey allowed me to avoid the BOTB (Bottom of the Barrel) stuff.  I really don't consider any of the bottles I have "bottom shelf", just that I found them lower on the shelf than some of my other bottles.

[Surtur]

This is a tough question as it could mean either price or quality, and are you referring strictly to bourbon or just American whiskey? We’re in the bourbon forum so we’ll rule out Kessler and other rotgut items. As far as price, I would consider anything under $20 these days bottom shelf, where you can find quality items like WSR and Evan Williams BiB. Bottom shelf quality is usually mass produced 80 proofs like modern Old Crow, plain Ancient Age, Jim Beam, Jack Daniels, etc. I would buy Evan Williams black over all those as I prefer the price, proof, and flavor by far. Stuff like the aforementioned WSR, OGDBiB, WT101 and other stuff around that range i consider value pours instead of bottom shelf, although value pours can extend into any price range. I would also consider Henry mckenna a value as well as Four Roses SiB for the $40 range. The golden rule of bourbon for the infinite time: enjoy what you like, how you like it.

[DEH1212]

VOB

[fishnbowljoe]

Bottom shelf to me........?   All the taller bottles and handles that won't fit on the middle and/or open shelf of my liquor cabinet/hutch.  

 

Biba! Joe

[berto]

Living on top of the fault line most likely to rupture any day now my home bottom shelf is full of fancy and hard to find bottles.  My house aside I consider the bottom shelf to be whatever blended monstrosity is the supermarkets house brand.  BiB has rules and stuff so can't be bottom shelf.  The stuff that's cheaper with fewer rules is it.  I'm at a point in life where Turkey 101 meets my inexpensive needs quite well for $18.  No need to mess around with anything less unless I luck into the 6yr HH again.

[Jazz June]

At VA ABC the literal bottom shelf is mostly blends and a few truly terrible straight bourbons (poor Old Crow). However, when I ordered VOB BiB, they put the extras on the bottom shelf, which by price is where it belongs, but quality wise I wouldn't consider it bottom shelf. With maybe one or two other exceptions, I would mostly avoid this shelf.

[mikeydk]

Two definitions of bottom shelf for me.  

 

1) The stuff literally on the bottom shelf in truck stop liquor stores that is caked in dust, blended with neutral grain spirits, or comes in a plastic jug, that I refuse to buy.  (Old Crow, Kessler, etc..)

 

2) The bottom shelf in my home bar.  Bottles typically in the under $25 range.  (Old Grand Dad 114, Old Bardstown, Jim Beam Devils cut, distillers cut, Evan Williams BIB, Elijah Craig small batch).