Four Roses employees on strike

[flahute]

16 hours ago, HoustonNit said:

 

I just assumed he was ready for retirement or semi retirement and wanted to pass the reigns to Elliot.

 

Most definitely not. He's not the kind of guy who likes to be idle. He wants to be getting his hands dirty on the operations side.

[Kepler]

On 9/19/2018 at 5:44 AM, CUfan99 said:

I have limited experience and exposure to unions but what I have had has all been negative. After hearing from both sides on this I have to say the union gets another mark in my negative impression box. 

 

I work in a 3 or 4 tier system; some folks with more time in than me got some nice benefits not available to me. Nobody looks at those people with contempt. Good for them. If I don’t like my situation then I need to look for better elsewhere and if new hires don’t like the package being offered don’t sign on. The union is holding the employer hostage and their demand is “never change the benefit package for anybody ever”. Unreasonable IMO. 

 

Methinks that bourbon distillery workers who find themselves working in a boom industry should be grateful that said bourbon is, by definition, American-made and cannot be off-shored to lower cost labor locations ... unlike almost every other industry that most of us are involved in.  American unions in a global economy are antiquated and need to go the way of the dinosaur and the do-do bird, because on balance they do American workers no favors....

Edited September 23, 2018 by Kepler

[GaryT]

4 hours ago, Kepler said:

 

Methinks that bourbon distillery workers who find themselves working in a boom industry should be grateful that said bourbon is, by definition, American-made and cannot be off-shored to lower cost labor locations ... unlike almost every other industry that most of us are involved in.  American unions in a global economy are antiquated and need to go the way of the dinosaur and the do-do bird, because on balance they do American workers no favors....

I used to be fairly anti-union based on my personal experience as a kid.  Working as a grocery bagger, we had to pay union dues, and as part of the union everyone got the same bump in pay at 6 months, at 1 yr, etc - regardless of how hard (or little) you worked.  Having a strong work ethic, it ticked me off when I'd be hustling to shag carts from the lot, and others would be dragging their feet - and would get the same reward for simply not getting fired over time.

 

I'm not exactly pro-union today, but I think that the growing inequality with corporate profits reaching all-time highs while wages stagnate is creating an environment where unions may see a rebound.  It is impossible to say with any certainty, but my speculation is that without any union, FR would likely have been able to lower the wages of the workforce and because of low unemployment - find folks willing to work.  I'd argue that preventing wage declines in an era of ever-growing corporate profits is absolutely doing the American worker a favor.

 

Ultimately, I'm glad that both parties came to an agreement, and they're back to making bourbon!

[FasterHorses]

3 hours ago, GaryT said:

I used to be fairly anti-union based on my personal experience as a kid.  Working as a grocery bagger, we had to pay union dues, and as part of the union everyone got the same bump in pay at 6 months, at 1 yr, etc - regardless of how hard (or little) you worked.  Having a strong work ethic, it ticked me off when I'd be hustling to shag carts from the lot, and others would be dragging their feet - and would get the same reward for simply not getting fired over time.

 

I'm not exactly pro-union today, but I think that the growing inequality with corporate profits reaching all-time highs while wages stagnate is creating an environment where unions may see a rebound.  It is impossible to say with any certainty, but my speculation is that without any union, FR would likely have been able to lower the wages of the workforce and because of low unemployment - find folks willing to work.  I'd argue that preventing wage declines in an era of ever-growing corporate profits is absolutely doing the American worker a favor.

 

Ultimately, I'm glad that both parties came to an agreement, and they're back to making bourbon!

I find myself with a similar mindset the last few years surprisingly.

[lcpfratn]

...It is impossible to say with any certainty, but my speculation is that without any union, FR would likely have been able to lower the wages of the workforce and because of low unemployment - find folks willing to work...

Gary, I’m not sure if that is what you meant to say, but a low unemployment environment usually makes it harder for an employer to lower wages and/or find replacement workers without maintaining or increasing pay levels.

[smokinjoe]

On 9/19/2018 at 4:49 AM, GaryT said:

Here's a response from Four Roses.  Per their statement, sounds like the only change (at least that being talked about outside the room) is to the sick leave bank and the introduction of short-term disability.  

 

https://lex18.com/news/covering-kentucky/2018/09/17/four-roses-releases-statement-on-strike

 

 (as the workers talking points don't seem to line up - were they mis-informed by the negotiators?)

The more I read about the agreement on this final point, read the 4R statement and the labor response, watch the film of the union leader addressing one of the camps announcing a tentative agreement, and all the blustery talking points, I’m thinking this may be the case.  

 

A video I have seen has the head union guy and his lieutenant standing there telling the group how much they’re going to like the new option...Wha?  I thought that was bad...And, they gloss over a lot of positive things that were agreed on early and easily.  

 

With all the canned bluster on solidarity, respect, standing down a multinational conglomerate, brothers, no concessions, and outside labor reps documenting/critiquing/disseminating it, I think this was all part of the “show”.  That’s why there was the disconnect between the rank and file and union leadership.  I don’t think the leadership fully understood what the heck was going on...

 

In the end, I’m glad it all worked out, and everybody can move along until the next one, when rich money and power hungry national labor organization reps can whip up the next injustice.  

[GaryT]

4 hours ago, lcpfratn said:

Gary, I’m not sure if that is what you meant to say, but a low unemployment environment usually makes it harder for an employer to lower wages and/or find replacement workers without maintaining or increasing pay levels.

Sorry - you're correct; I shouldn't post pre-coffee!  

[TunnelTiger]

On 9/23/2018 at 9:59 AM, FasterHorses said:

I find myself with a similar mindset the last few years surprisingly.

Another vote where my mind has changed over the many years. 

[mosugoji64]

Count me as another glad to hear they were able to move forward! (Mostly it's selfish as I didn't want to feel bad about buying FR or visiting them in Spring!)