Booker’s...consensus on recent batches??

[The Black Tot]

Just now, EarthQuake said:

I mean, it depends on what we're talking about. I'm not say the batches aren't different, I'm simply saying they aren't so different that from one batch to the next it's going to tastes like an entirely different product. Have you tried multiple Booker's that have been drastically different? I certainly haven't, but I've only tried probably 4 different batches, so perhaps that's not a large enough sample size.

 

I keep a small spreadsheet of batches that I have tried. I started it recently because of the variability of experiences I was having with the batches. 

 

I have sampled probably 12 Booker's batches, but I've only got 5 in the spreadsheet so far. They range from "Awesome" to "Jobber" to "Unbalanced" and vary in the scale from peanut brittle to red berry. 

 

So I'm in the camp of high variability. Having said this, there have been fewer winners among the last couple of years when the ages dropped below 7yrs, so I'm with lcpfratn when we say we're hanging fire until those numbers come up. I'll resume experimentation at 7.5yrs and above.  7 if I'm feeling daffy.

[lcpfratn]

Well last year they released an older bottle and got me to spend $200 on it 

OK, I forgot about “that” older bottle release...so they have enticed me to make an older aged Booker’s purchase, but it wasn’t exactly a “regular” Booker’s.

[EarthQuake]

12 minutes ago, The Black Tot said:

 

I keep a small spreadsheet of batches that I have tried. I started it recently because of the variability of experiences I was having with the batches. 

 

I have sampled probably 12 Booker's batches, but I've only got 5 in the spreadsheet so far. They range from "Awesome" to "Jobber" to "Unbalanced" and vary in the scale from peanut brittle to red berry. 

 

So I'm in the camp of high variability. Having said this, there have been fewer winners among the last couple of years when the ages dropped below 7yrs, so I'm with lcpfratn when we say we're hanging fire until those numbers come up. I'll resume experimentation at 7.5yrs and above.  7 if I'm feeling daffy.

That's interesting. What's your sampling method? Have you tried them blind side by side to eliminate bias / palate variation?

 

For me, pretty much every Booker's I've tried has tasted like Booker's (which is to say: about what I expect), but admittedly a number of them have been pours at bars, which is not the best way to do critical tasting. I've never been a huge fan of Booker's so I haven't done a deep dive with multiple bottles at the same time, though I have given more exhaustive treatment to Stagg Jr batches, with blind tastings where I generally can find some small difference but couldn't tell you which was which for the life of me.

Edited May 15, 2019 by EarthQuake

[Curtis Reed]

I love me some Booker’s. I wish it was $55

[The Black Tot]

3 minutes ago, EarthQuake said:

That's interesting. What's your sampling method? Have you tried them blind to eliminate bias / palate variation?

I keep the spreadsheet to myself, as my own personal buying guide, specifically so I don't have to waste my time proving the mitigation of bias

 

I do the same thing with my observations of sonic differences in audio equipment. My ears and my palate seem to work good enough for me without a blindfold. I allow that maybe they could work a little bit better with one, but I'm a busy dude... 

[kevinbrink]

6 minutes ago, EarthQuake said:

That's interesting. What's your sampling method? Have you tried them blind to eliminate bias / palate variation?

 

For me, pretty much every Booker's I've tried has tasted like Booker's (which is to say: about what I expect), but admittedly a number of them have been pours at bars, which is not the best way to do critical tasting. I've never been a huge fan of Booker's so I haven't done a deep dive with multiple bottles at the same time, though I have given more exhaustive treatment to Stagg Jr batches, with blind tastings where I generally can find some small difference but couldn't tell you which was which for the life of me.

I think both are relatively consistent to me for the most part, Stagg Jr having come to form around batch 3, Booker's pretty much tastes like Booker's to me but SBS there is definitely some variation but not enough to get me to chase a particular batch.

[EarthQuake]

6 minutes ago, The Black Tot said:

I keep the spreadsheet to myself, as my own personal buying guide, specifically so I don't have to waste my time proving the mitigation of bias

 

I do the same thing with my observations of sonic differences in audio equipment. My ears and my palate seem to work good enough for me without a blindfold. I allow that maybe they could work a little bit better with one, but I'm a busy dude... 

I do the same myself for the most part (and have a spreadsheet as well, though I've been neglecting it recently), and generally don't taste test blind unless I'm doing something really esoteric, like comparing multiple batches of the same product. Those tests are often rather informative though, so I would suggest doing it if you ever find the time. If nothing else it tends to be fun. My wife is usually better at it than me.  The double blind, 2 of one and 1 of another is a fun game.

 

And just to be clear, I wasn't trying to suggest that however you form your opinion is invalid, I think we have some similar habits, if perhaps not similar conclusions, which is what I find interesting.

Edited May 15, 2019 by EarthQuake

[kevinbrink]

I think the bourbon community is starting to over-engineer their enjoyment with the whole blind tasting thing, in my experience even blind results vary when repeated which could be due to all sorts of stuff, the order you tried them, what you ate, who knows. At this point maybe my mind takes over my taste buds on occasion but I'm fine with that as long as the experience is ultimately enjoyable. 

[EarthQuake]

11 minutes ago, kevinbrink said:

I think the bourbon community is starting to over-engineer their enjoyment with the whole blind tasting thing, in my experience even blind results vary when repeated which could be due to all sorts of stuff, the order you tried them, what you ate, who knows. At this point maybe my mind takes over my taste buds on occasion but I'm fine with that as long as the experience is ultimately enjoyable. 

I suppose it depends. I generally find blind tasting to be a lot of fun, so it's a part of enjoying bourbon, and I often learn new things about myself and the liquid.

 

But if you're so obsessive that you can't enjoy a dram without making sure to blind taste it against some reference bourbon or something, sure, that would be crossing the line of reason.

 

It seems like for the topic at hand today, having tried more than one batch side by side, blind or otherwise, would be relevant though. The brain does a lot of weird things when it comes to memory. For instance, you never remember the same thing in the same way, you're remembering a memory of the memory every time you think about it, and over time it gets distorted. There's some pretty interesting science on this topic, but as it applies here it means that the taste memory of a bourbon you had 1 year ago or 5 years ago probably isn't a reliable indicator (this is a great reason to keep a spreadsheet - I personally never put stuff in the sheet as I remember it even if only a few days old memory). Add to that the fact that our tastes change over time, and the whole thing becomes somewhat of a mess when trying to determine whether batch Y is better than batch Z or if either are better or worse than they used to be.

 

But I get it, some people are less interesting in theory, and more interested in simply enjoying a good dram. That's where I fall most days too.

Edited May 15, 2019 by EarthQuake

[smokinjoe]

4 minutes ago, kevinbrink said:

I think the bourbon community is starting to over-engineer their enjoyment with the whole blind tasting thing, in my experience even blind results vary when repeated which could be due to all sorts of stuff, the order you tried them, what you ate, who knows. At this point maybe my mind takes over my taste buds on occasion but I'm fine with that as long as the experience is ultimately enjoyable. 

^^^^Pure Gold Post.  

[Bourbinvestor]

So an old round table booker's batch C07-B-7 for $70 shouldn't get me excited?  

Edited May 15, 2019 by Bourbinvestor

[flahute]

Damn fantastic conversation going on here in the last couple hours. 

[lcpfratn]

So an old round table booker's batch C07-B-7 for $70 shouldn't get me excited?  

OK, so I’d probably be tempted to pick that one up...even though I don’t need it, and probably wouldn’t get around to drinking it for a long time.

[GeeTen]

5 hours ago, flahute said:

Damn fantastic conversation going on here in the last couple hours. 

Who's still up at these hours?!?   Or even awake!   

 

[mosugoji64]

45 minutes ago, GeeTen said:

Who's still up at these hours?!?   Or even awake!   

 

 

I am. And it looks like you are, too!

[fosmith]

9 hours ago, Bourbinvestor said:

So an old round table booker's batch C07-B-7 for $70 shouldn't get me excited?  

I would be all over that if I ever found it...

[fosmith]

12 hours ago, The Black Tot said:

Also, aren't KCSB and Booker's aged in different warehouses/locations?

 

They may start out the same distillate, but I don't think they're the same animal. Booker's at it's best (for me) has more of a caramel thing going on that doesn't happen for me with KCSB, and KCSB has a lot more of a peppery spice thing than Booker's (although my favorite KCSB selections don't have this).

 

Both of them in rare instances can do the Beam red berry thing - those are my faves.  But even then, the Booker's spin on the flavor is different from the KC spin.

I don't agree with those that say that KCSB is a substitute for Booker's.  To me, they have a very different flavor profile.  Don't get me wrong, I love KCSB, especially store picks but, to me, Booker's is fruitier, more complex and balanced and less oaky. 

[EarthQuake]

If nothing else the extra age on the KCSB is generally evident, especially with the older store picks. I tend to like more oak personally so KCSB is usually my preference.

 

Booker's generally tastes a bit young to me by comparison. It's odd that, of the two, Booker's is the premium placed product. 11-14 year 120 proof for $40-50? Yes please.

[Mako254]

11 hours ago, Bourbinvestor said:

So an old round table booker's batch C07-B-7 for $70 shouldn't get me excited?  

 

Thats a buy for me. 

[Mako254]

1 hour ago, fosmith said:

I don't agree with those that say that KCSB is a substitute for Booker's.  To me, they have a very different flavor profile.  Don't get me wrong, I love KCSB, especially store picks but, to me, Booker's is fruitier, more complex and balanced and less oaky. 

 

I agree though as stated I don’t drink a ton  of either. In my SbS the other night, I got a lot of the beam signature peanut on the finish along w/ a dry note on the kcsb. The bookers though younger had a more developed finish. 

 

If Booker’s was in the 7-1/2-8-1/2 range, it would warrant the current price tag. And Id buy more of it. 

[PhantomLamb]

Just went up to $80 here, I'll be passing on Booker's for a while...

[Kane]

The consensus is: It's overpriced.

[Bourbinvestor]

On 5/15/2019 at 1:16 AM, lcpfratn said:

OK, so I’d probably be tempted to pick that one up...even though I don’t need it, and probably wouldn’t get around to drinking it for a long time.

 

On 5/15/2019 at 8:48 AM, fosmith said:

I would be all over that if I ever found it...

 

On 5/15/2019 at 10:16 AM, Mako254 said:

 

Thats a buy for me. 

 

Thanks! I was a little confused not seeing a catchy name on the label and just a bunch of numbers. I love ordering Booker's at a restaurant/bar but have been hesitant to get a bottle because of this whole price increase debate and the KCSB (which I also love) comparison. I genuinely appreciate the feedback. I love the intellectual debate that goes on here instead of the idiotic trolling that goes on other places.

[Shizzy]

On ‎5‎/‎14‎/‎2019 at 7:40 AM, alcoholica said:

Until just recently, ECBP has been fairly easy to spot around here. If I do see a bottle, it’s about $60. I usually pick up a bottle when I see it for that price. Staff Jr is the same, only not nearly as available. 

 

It’s hard to find Booker’s for less than $90 here. So needless to say, i’m not buying Booker’s, unless it’s older. 

Cue the 30th anniversary release.

[alcoholica]

4 hours ago, Shizzy said:

Cue the 30th anniversary release.

Actually meant older, as in non stained boxes. No plexi even better.

 

But your point is well taken!!!