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JoshuaTDUK
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Hi all,

 

Apologies if I am posting in the wrong place - new member here.

 

So my whiskey journey has just begun proper. I'm from the UK but have found myself drawn more to bourbon than scotch ?.

 

I'm currently working my way (rather alarmingly quickly) through a bottle of Four Roses Small Batch and a bottle of Woodford Reserve.  It seems to be contrary to popular opinion, but I massively prefer the WR. It seems to have a lot more nose for me. I also find it much smoother to drink.  Despite them being similar ABV, I find I can detect less flavour in the FRSB. With the Woodford, I do find it much more interesting on the nose than the palate, but it seems much easier to drink. I'm no connoisseur - I am really just going by the fact that one bottle is going down much faster than the other! 

 

I'm now in the market for my next bottle. Can anyone recommend anything similar to the Woodford? Or perhaps something that is distinct from both the WR and the FRSB?

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There is nothing wrong about liking WR - it is a balanced and easy to drink bourbon. I am not sure of UK availability, but others that I would consider include Old Forester 1870, Old Forester Statesman, Buffalo Trace, Evan Williams Single Barrel, and maybe Knob Creek (a bit more ABV punch).

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42 minutes ago, JoshuaTDUK said:

I'm now in the market for my next bottle. Can anyone recommend anything similar to the Woodford? Or perhaps something that is distinct from both the WR and the FRSB?

Elijah Craig Small Batch would be a good choice as would Buffalo Trace.  Both in the same proof range.  Next step up would be some 100 proofers such as Wild Turkey 101, Knob Creek and various Bottled in Bond expressions such as Evan Williams, Col. EH Taylor, etc.  Good luck on your journey. 

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Old Forester 100 proof should work for you as its similar to WR. I like the extra proof.

WR has a fair amount of OF distillate in it so most of the OF products should be in your wheelhouse if you like WR.

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If you are looking to try different options in a similar proof & price point, I'd also suggest any of the following:
Russell's Reserve 10Y
Eagle Rare
1792 Small Batch
Elijah Craig Small Batch
Bowman Brothers Small Batch (not sure how available that one is in the UK)
Buffalo Trace
Evan Williams Single Barrel

Plenty of wheated bourbons worth at least trying as well: Maker's Mark, Makers 46, Larceny, etc.

Taking it up to around 100 proof, here are a few more I feel might be worthy of consideration:
Knob Creek 9Y
Wild Turkey 101
Evan Williams Bottled in Bond
Old Grandad Bottled in Bond
Old Forester 100 Proof
Four Roses Single Barrel

If you're digging the Woodford, it might also be worth it to try the Woodford Double Oaked.

I personally love trying different things and discovering what does and doesn't fit my tastes, so I hope the experience is the same for you. Best of luck & enjoy the ride!
 

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Thanks for the replies - all suggestions greatly appreciated.

 

I'm keen for some Old Forester - Raymond Chandler references it so that's enough for me!  It seems to have slightly less availability here. I can pick up a bottle of Statesman for around £60 ($80ish) but I'm not sure if that's been marked up for the UK market. Other than that the bog standard bottle is freely available.

 

Elijah Craig is also on my list - so that could very well be my next purchase. It doesn't seem to be so popular here, which I kind of like.

 

To be honest, I am kind of interested to find the cut off between sipping whiskies and the stuff best used in mixers. I'd consider Jack Daniels and Jim Beam (usually under £20) to be the latter - not awful, but not something to be savoured. At the moment, I'm trying to find my 'every day' whiskey...

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On 11/16/2020 at 6:04 PM, JoshuaTDUK said:

Thanks for the replies - all suggestions greatly appreciated.

 

I'm keen for some Old Forester - Raymond Chandler references it so that's enough for me!  It seems to have slightly less availability here. I can pick up a bottle of Statesman for around £60 ($80ish) but I'm not sure if that's been marked up for the UK market. Other than that the bog standard bottle is freely available.

 

Elijah Craig is also on my list - so that could very well be my next purchase. It doesn't seem to be so popular here, which I kind of like.

 

To be honest, I am kind of interested to find the cut off between sipping whiskies and the stuff best used in mixers. I'd consider Jack Daniels and Jim Beam (usually under £20) to be the latter - not awful, but not something to be savoured. At the moment, I'm trying to find my 'every day' whiskey...

First, welcome to the wonderful world of bourbon!  The finest brown liquor known to man.  Second, you can't go wrong with any of the suggestions above.  I would suggest Old Forester 100 before Statesmen only because of price and the ability to evaluate the proof difference compared to Woodford Reserve.  Elijah Craig is definitely worth exploring.  I may have missed where you are located but help us know what is available in your area.  Evan Williams, Jim Beam. Makers Mark, and Jack Daniels are all great mixers.

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1 hour ago, mbroo5880i said:

First, welcome to the wonderful world of bourbon!  The finest brown liquor known to man.  Second, you can't go wrong with any of the suggestions above.  I would suggest Old Forester 100 before Statesmen only because of price and the ability to evaluate the proof difference compared to Woodford Reserve.  Elijah Craig is definitely worth exploring.  I may have missed where you are located but help us know what is available in your area.  Evan Williams, Jim Beam. Makers Mark, and Jack Daniels are all great mixers.

 

 

Thanks man!

 

Sadly it looks like I might be limited on choice. The only options I have for Old Forester are the Statesman Kingsman edition, which is pretty pricey, or the standard bottle. I was going to go for Elijah Craig, but the small batch is also apparently quite expensive wherever I've found it for sale. Eurgh. 

 

At the moment, my readily available options seem to be:

 

Most of the Wild Turkey line,

1792 small batch,

Larceny,

Bog-standard Buffalo Trace

Bog-standard Old Forester

Knob Creek

Elijah Craig Small Batch

Makers Mark (standard and 46)

 

Also Eagle Rare - but I have a sneaking suspicion my missus has got be a bottle of that for Christmas.

 

Are any of these noted for being smooth? Happy to go with anything as I am keen to explore different brands, but as a bit of a newbie I am wary of the stronger stuff - I found I got a lot of alcohol burn from the Four Roses. 

 

 

 

 

 

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On 11/16/2020 at 5:04 PM, JoshuaTDUK said:

I can pick up a bottle of Statesman for around £60 ($80ish) but I'm not sure if that's been marked up for the UK market.

 

You might check out Whisky Exchange as I see it on there for quite a bit less.

I agree with the others in that it would be a good choice since you already like the Woodford. Nothing wrong with staying with the WR as a regular pour either.

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Probably my current favorite is Wild Turkey 101.  It can stand up to a splash of water or an ice cube if you want less proof.  That's better than getting the 80 proof version.

Really, everything on your list is worth trying at least once.

If you can find Jim Beam Double Oak, that's a real easy sipper.

 

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It's not surprising about your experience with Four Roses, as I have seen similar reactions from others just starting out.  I have a buddy that didn't care for 4R single barrel that I recommended although he did enjoy Evan Williams Bonded and Wild Turkey 101. Four Roses is very high rye content in the mash bill and that often translates to a spicy flavor that can come across as alcohol burn to some, especially when first drinking neat.

 

Of those in your list I would recommend Elijah Craig Small Batch, Buffalo Trace, and 1792 Small Batch as excellent choices. All are outstanding representations of what bourbon should taste like around 90-94 proof. Those should be your next targets to explore before moving up in proof to the Knob Creek.

 

Btw, if you ever want to dip your toe in the Wild Turkey water, I would recommend the 90 proof Russell's Reserve 10 Year as your first bottle. Then WT101 after that.  Ignore the 81 or 80 proof bottle as it is not worth your time unless used only as a mixer.

 

Good luck in your journey!

Edited by Kepler
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15 minutes ago, Kepler said:

Btw, if you ever want to dip your toe in the Wild Turkey water, I would recommend the 90 proof Russell's Reserve 10 Year as your first bottle. Then WT101 after that.  Ignore the 81 or 80 proof bottle as it is not worth your time unless used only as a mixer.

 

Good luck in your the journey!

You've said a lot here my bourbon friend.

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On 11/16/2020 at 10:47 AM, JoshuaTDUK said:

...So my whiskey journey has just begun proper. I'm from the UK but have found myself drawn more to bourbon than scotch ...

I'm glad you're exploring american.  A while back a friend brought 6 scotch samples 40 to 60 years old.  we all agreed they were great but some of our 18 to 20 year old americans at the table were much better.  Is it a matter of wood?  Or what we are used to?

 

I like scotch and japanese but american is the regular.

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6 hours ago, BigSkyDrams said:

I’d recommend the regular old Buffalo Trace in your circumstances

Dohhhh! I totally missed this one. (It sucks getting old.)  Excellent recommendation Sky. ? 

 

Biba! Joe

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On 11/16/2020 at 6:04 PM, JoshuaTDUK said:

Thanks for the replies - all suggestions greatly appreciated.

 

I'm keen for some Old Forester - Raymond Chandler references it so that's enough for me!  It seems to have slightly less availability here. I can pick up a bottle of Statesman for around £60 ($80ish) but I'm not sure if that's been marked up for the UK market. Other than that the bog standard bottle is freely available.

 

Elijah Craig is also on my list - so that could very well be my next purchase. It doesn't seem to be so popular here, which I kind of like.

 

To be honest, I am kind of interested to find the cut off between sipping whiskies and the stuff best used in mixers. I'd consider Jack Daniels and Jim Beam (usually under £20) to be the latter - not awful, but not something to be savoured. At the moment, I'm trying to find my 'every day' whiskey...

Statesman is my favorite OF these days - the vanilla is amped up and the  95proof is, for me, an easy sipper.    At about the same price point, at least in these parts,  is the Elijah Craig Toasted Barrell, which I really, really like - and I usually don't praise Heaven Hill bourbon (their rye is superb).  

 

I second those who suggested 1792 Small Batch.   I have no idea whether it's available in the UK,   but it's been hitting on all cylinders these days.    I overlooked it for years,  and glad I re-discovered how straight-down-the-middle delicious it is.   

 

And of course there's Wild Turkey.   It makes sense to start with the Russell's Reserve 10 at a bit over 90 proof,  although I confess I haven't had it in years.   Lately I've been enjoying the Rare Breed  (or RR Single Barrel) and proofing it down.   I usually prefer a small batch bourbon to a single barrel; the whole point of batching is to get the balance and desired flavor profile down.    

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On 11/18/2020 at 4:04 AM, Kepler said:

It's not surprising about your experience with Four Roses, as I have seen similar reactions from others just starting out.  I have a buddy that didn't care for 4R single barrel that I recommended although he did enjoy Evan Williams Bonded and Wild Turkey 101. Four Roses is very high rye content in the mash bill and that often translates to a spicy flavor that can come across as alcohol burn to some, especially when first drinking neat.

 

Interesting you've said this. I've seen so many good reviews of FR it made me second guess myself a bit when I didn't take to it. Perhaps it's an experience thing. To be honest, I've not been able to detect many flavours in it and I find it harder to hit that sweet spot for smoothness. I'll try it again further down the road. 

 

On 11/18/2020 at 6:57 AM, B.B. Babington said:

I'm glad you're exploring american.  A while back a friend brought 6 scotch samples 40 to 60 years old.  we all agreed they were great but some of our 18 to 20 year old americans at the table were much better.  Is it a matter of wood?  Or what we are used to?

 

I like scotch and japanese but american is the regular.

 

Thanks man. I enjoy Scotch and Japanese too, but I feel inclined to drink bourbon a lot more. Not really sure why. Then I am something of an Americanophile, so perhaps its all image!

 

 

Availability has turned out to be a bit more of an issue than I anticipated. Buffalo Trace, Wild Turkey, Makers and Knob Creek are all pretty wildly available in bars, so I'll probably sample them when things open up again. For now I'm going to go with either the Elijah Craig or the 1792. Just going to search for a few tasting notes before I decide.

 

Just one other thing - over here, EC and 1792 are more or less double the price of BT, is that the case in the US too?

 

Thanks for all the responses fellas. 

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15 minutes ago, JoshuaTDUK said:

Just one other thing - over here, EC and 1792 are more or less double the price of BT, is that the case in the US too?

 

Thanks for all the responses fellas. 

No, here EC, BT, and 1792 SmB are basically the same price. I do prefer EC over BT, but it's definitely not twice the price good. 

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I had my 1st pour of WR double oak last night, which I avoided religiously. I can definitely see myself craving this once in awhile. Also if you can track down a WR barrel pick, they seem to be just as easy drinking with a little more complexity. Got mine at a signing/etching here and a Total Wine in Dallas...

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On 11/20/2020 at 10:28 PM, JCwhammie said:

No, here EC, BT, and 1792 SmB are basically the same price. I do prefer EC over BT, but it's definitely not twice the price good. 

Thanks for this. Kind of frustrating as I'm still learning about the different distilleries, so price is really all I have to go on when judging what's what.

 

I realise this is of absolutely no interest to anyone across the pond, but I'd be interested to know if any of the pricing jumps out as particularly outrageous. I don't mind paying more money for good whiskey, but I'd like to know if I'm paying above the odds for import costs. I was all set for the EC, but seems it may be way over-priced... ?

 

Guessing it's down to popularity as everything in the £20 - 25 bracket is drunk in bars a lot - save OF

 

Under £20:

Jack Daniels 

Jim Beam 

Wild Turkey

 

£20 - 25

Old Forester - standard

Buffalo Trace

Wild Turkey 101

Makers Mark

Woodford Reserve

Bulleit

 

£25 - 30

Knob Creek

Four Roses SmB

Eagle Rare

 

£30 - 35

Wild Turkey LB

 

£35 - 40

Makers Mark 46

1792

Larceny

 

£40 +

Old Forester Statesman

Elijah Craig SmB

Wild Turkey RB

 

 

 

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37 minutes ago, JoshuaTDUK said:

Thanks for this. Kind of frustrating as I'm still learning about the different distilleries, so price is really all I have to go on when judging what's what.

 

I realise this is of absolutely no interest to anyone across the pond, but I'd be interested to know if any of the pricing jumps out as particularly outrageous. I don't mind paying more money for good whiskey, but I'd like to know if I'm paying above the odds for import costs. I was all set for the EC, but seems it may be way over-priced... ?

 

Guessing it's down to popularity as everything in the £20 - 25 bracket is drunk in bars a lot - save OF

 

Under £20:(<26 USD)

Jack Daniels 

Jim Beam 

Wild Turkey

 

£20 - 25 (26-34 USD)

Old Forester - $20 USD

Buffalo Trace $20-22 USD

Wild Turkey 101 $20-22 USD

Makers Mark ($18-20 USD)

Woodford Reserve ($30 USD)

Bulleit ($30 USD)

 

£25 - 30 ($34-$39)

Knob Creek ($30 USD)

Four Roses SmB ($30 USD)

Eagle Rare ($33-39 USD)

 

£30 - 35 ($39-$46)

Wild Turkey LB ($38-40 USD)

 

£35 - 40 ($46-$52)

Makers Mark 46 ($30 USD)

1792 ($39 USD)

Larceny ($25 USD)

 

£40 + ($52+)

Old Forester Statesman ($45 USD)

Elijah Craig SmB ($30 USD)

Wild Turkey RB ($45 USD)

 

 

 

 

I believe the British pound equals around $1.30 USD,  I  added the prices typically found in Indiana for the products you identified.  Prices and availability (which also affects prices) vary significantly across the U.S.  

 

Availability in the UK and import costs can also affect the premium you will pay.  It appears your better values in terms of price comparable to those in the U.S. is probably in the price range.  Although, depending on how much above 40 pounds, OF Statesmen and WTRB are, they may be decent values.

 

WT101, KC, and ER seem reasonable given your location and the exchange rate.  The three that really stick out to me as being out of whack value-wise is ECSmB, 1792, and Larceny.

Edited by mbroo5880i
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Given your local prices, if you are shopping for value first, I'd recommend the Eagle Rare as your next purchase.  It's a good whiskey and I think you'll like it.

Edited by Kepler
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On 11/22/2020 at 2:31 AM, mbroo5880i said:

 

I believe the British pound equals around $1.30 USD,  I  added the prices typically found in Indiana for the products you identified.  Prices and availability (which also affects prices) vary significantly across the U.S.  

 

Availability in the UK and import costs can also affect the premium you will pay.  It appears your better values in terms of price comparable to those in the U.S. is probably in the price range.  Although, depending on how much above 40 pounds, OF Statesmen and WTRB are, they may be decent values.

 

WT101, KC, and ER seem reasonable given your location and the exchange rate.  The three that really stick out to me as being out of whack value-wise is ECSmB, 1792, and Larceny.

Thanks for that - really useful reference and something of an eye opener! Looks like I'll be paying through the nose when I move onto the legit premium stuff 

 

 

On 11/22/2020 at 5:43 AM, Kepler said:

Given your local prices, if you are shopping for value first, I'd recommend the Eagle Rare as your next purchase.  It's a good whiskey and I think you'll like it.

 

Thanks for the input. Have ordered Knob Creek and Buffalo Trace, with a bottle of the Eagle Rare coming for Chrimbo.

 

Appreciate all the info fellas. 

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