New Iowa Micro Bourbon

[CaptainQ]

JFC :deadhorse: Move along people.

[ILLfarmboy]

My reaction to kbrighton's post? Worst producer-to-consumer communication ever.

I think that's what it boilds down to.

I was recently walking through the Northpark shopping mall in Davenport Iowa and passed a booth giving out samples from Wide River Winery located in Clinton IA. The lady was a model of what I expect from someone hawking a product; polite, congenial and friendly. She was everything I would try to be if I were selling something.

My recent forays into the world of beer via local microbreweries have been pretty much the same. If you want to sell a product it pays to be amiable. No one has been offended by my dislike of a free sample and taken the attitude "if you don't like our dry Irish stout, big effin deal, we'll sell plenty to our real target demographic" Had anyone had that attitude, openly voicing it anyhow, I wouldn't have later bought a growler of something of theirs I did find to my liking nor planed later day trips around eating at their joint and drinking more of their brews.

Looking at kbrighton's profile, I see he is in his mid-twenties. I wonder how much experience he has in customer relations. Youth could also explain some of his hot-headedness. God knows I still tend to be that way sometimes, and I was a lot worse when I was younger. I took things personally, as kbrighton appeared to do.

If I've been a jackass and painted with a broad brush, I'm sorry.

I enjoyed the pictures, and after viewing them am guardedly optimistic, again............

[IowaJeff]

Kbrighton came out of the box hostile, aided and abetted by IowaJeff, and got hostile back. That's not the way to learn the history. It's not the way to say hello. If you don't think you were hostile, go back to the 'guest' analogy. In this house, that was considered a hostile introduction.

How did I aid and abet any hostility? I merely tried to defend a newcomer against what I felt was unnecessary negativity. As a newcomer myself I know I wouldn't want to flamed because of a minor misunderstanding. I never made any personal attacks against anyone. Also, again, I don't even know KBrighton!

I understand you shouldn't come into someone's 'house' with hostility, but it was made clear that no hostility was intended. If this was not clear in the initial post, it was made clear afterwards.

Also, this is not your house.

[Scrub]

I just wish I could get a bottle of that whiskey here in NC. If discussing the distiller/distillery is worth eight pages, I must at least find out how it tastes.

[kbrighton]

I just wish I could get a bottle of that whiskey here in NC. If discussing the distiller/distillery is worth eight pages, I must at least find out how it tastes.

http://www.binnys.com/spirits/Cedar_Ridge_Iowa_Bourbon_25345.html

Price jumped $2 since Monday. Not sure why they are selling it for so much. We have it at $36 at the distillery

[cowdery]

Although a few people have been overtly hostile, most of us are just trying to give you guys a gentle orientation, but the chips on your shoulders are apparently just too big. Why that may be is between you and your therapist. I can't explain it any better than I already have.

Example. I know who I am and most people here know who I am. I sure don't need some defensive newbie telling me this isn't my house. No, it's not my house, but it's a house I've lived in since it was built. I moved in at the direct invitation of the owner and I've contributed more than a little sweat equity to its upkeep and development.

[jmpyle]

Although a few people have been overtly hostile, most of us are just trying to give you guys a gentle orientation, but the chips on your shoulders are apparently just too big. Why that may be is between you and your therapist. I can't explain it any better than I already have.

Example. I know who I am and most people here know who I am. I sure don't need some defensive newbie telling me this isn't my house. No, it's not my house, but it's a house I've lived in since it was built. I moved in at the direct invitation of the owner and I've contributed more than a little sweat equity to its upkeep and development.

Chuck you are anything but gentle. :slappin:

[IowaJeff]

Although a few people have been overtly hostile, most of us are just trying to give you guys a gentle orientation, but the chips on your shoulders are apparently just too big. Why that may be is between you and your therapist. I can't explain it any better than I already have.

Example. I know who I am and most people here know who I am. I sure don't need some defensive newbie telling me this isn't my house. No, it's not my house, but it's a house I've lived in since it was built. I moved in at the direct invitation of the owner and I've contributed more than a little sweat equity to its upkeep and development.

[cowdery]

Let's put it another way.

I come here to talk about American whiskey, as I've been doing for more than 10 years. I don't come here to be criticized by someone who just got here. Can you at least put yourself in my shoes and see where I might reasonably consider that presumptuous on your part?

In return, I'm willing to pretend the insulting implication of "fertilized" was unintentional, you know, like "snob."

[nivto]

Let's put it another way.

I come here to talk about American whiskey, as I've been doing for more than 10 years. I don't come here to be criticized by someone who just got here. Can you at least put yourself in my shoes and see where I might reasonably consider that presumptuous on your part?

In return, I'm willing to pretend the insulting implication of "fertilized" was unintentional, you know, like "snob."

[Josh]

Nobody comes to a forum to be criticized by anybody, whether that be a "newbie" or an established member of the community. IowaJeff disagreed with yours and others assessment of kbrighton, and he chose to stick up for him. He was very rational and didn't insult anybody. In return, he received an accusation from one member of being affiliated with the distillery, and he received a harsh comment from you.

just another newbie's .02

There's a difference between a question and an accusation. I asked a question. There have been MULTIPLE INCIDENTS of sock puppets or employees of a distillery joining solely to talk up their products, so it was a perfectly legit question. This recently happened in the "New Guy Doing a Nutty Taste Test" thread. Check out pp 3 & 4. It's rarely as blantant as that, though. So it does happen, probably more often than we think.

[GOCOUGS2002]

A couple thoughts on this and I'll go back to reading about Bourbon...

Newbies (I hope you don't find that term offensive): Don't take it so personal, this board is more civil than some I've frequented (and subsequently do not participate in anymore); these guys/gals are here to share knowledge (no matter how crotchety it may come off) and once you've been around for a while you will learn that.

While I applaud the newbies coming together, it shouldn't be to fight off Chuck or anyone else for that matter. Come together to further your knowledge on Bourbon and the enjoyment of figuring out the intricacies of each bottle.

I hope that this thread gets back on track and starts discussing the micro bourbon....

Disclaimer: I've been here for a couple years but still consider myself a newbie due to my lack of historical knowledge, a palate that doesn't yet want to cooperate with my sniffer...but I am the reigning Fantasy Football champion so that should count for something.

[IowaJeff]

Let's put it another way.

I come here to talk about American whiskey, as I've been doing for more than 10 years. I don't come here to be criticized by someone who just got here. Can you at least put yourself in my shoes and see where I might reasonably consider that presumptuous on your part?

In return, I'm willing to pretend the insulting implication of "fertilized" was unintentional, you know, like "snob."

Hahaha! I actually thought of putting in something about not meaning feces when I referred to 'fertilizer' but I thought it would be construed as being 'cute.' I really did not mean it that way. It was intended to recognize that you are instrumental in the success of SB, but that I still want to play on the lawn with others.

[IowaJeff]

There's a difference between a question and an accusation. I asked a question. There have been MULTIPLE INCIDENTS of sock puppets or employees of a distillery joining solely to talk up their products, so it was a perfectly legit question. This recently happened in the "New Guy Doing a Nutty Taste Test" thread. Check out pp 3 & 4. It's rarely as blantant as that, though. So it does happen, probably more often than we think.

I admit I was initially a bit offended, but I realize now how the mistake could be made. Once the thead passed a few pages it was no longer clear that I posted the initial semi-critical review and my defense could be seen as being a confederate of some sort.

I don't think there are any hard feelings here. I don't think I attacked anyone (if I did I apologize) and I certainly don't bear any grudges. I'm not the moderator of this discussion/argument, but I'm ready to move on to bourbon.

[edo]

Just took these. I hope this clears up any confusion to what I do on a daily basis. Thanks to the Iowa guys who have tried to show you that im not a defensive jerk with a chip on my sholder.

Grains

Mash tun

Fermenters

Stills

Big barrels

Small barrels

Bottling line

Any other questions, fire away. I love doing this for a living and am willing to share my experiences

Cool pics, ...ya snob.

The next day he received two more complaints, one from a man who came in diffident deprecation. “We really must do something about it, Judge. I'd be the last one in the world to bother Miss Emily, but we’ve got to do something.” That night the Board of Aldermen met--three graybeards and one younger man, a member of the rising generation.

“It’s simple enough,” he said. “Send her word to have her place cleaned up. Give her a certain time to do it in, and if she don’t . . .”

“Dammit, sir,” Judge Stevens said, “will you accuse a lady to her face of smelling bad?”

[Inthewater]

Let's put it another way.

I come here to talk about American whiskey, as I've been doing for more than 10 years. I don't come here to be criticized by someone who just got here. Can you at least put yourself in my shoes and see where I might reasonably consider that presumptuous on your part?

In return, I'm willing to pretend the insulting implication of "fertilized" was unintentional, you know, like "snob."

Being here for 10 years means you are an awesome part of this community and you have helped it grow to what it is now, but it doesn't mean you are beyond reproach, does it?

I think anyone can see that you, or anyone in your shoes, should feel somewhat empowered by that sort of commitment and longevity, but you are still just another member of a community. Maybe you are #5 and I am #5005 or whatever, but as long as nothing is blantanly personal, shouldn't we all be somewhat similar ground here? And i totally took the "fertilized" comment to mean, such as a grounds keeper, or gardener, not the negative way you must have taken it.

Also, just because Jeff is from Iowa, Josh automatically assumed he "could" be some sort of plant. Even though his review was not favorable at all, nor was P_Elliott's.

Jeff has been a member for a decent amout of time, Kolin from CR just joined.

Anyway, I still haven't tried the stuff. Grrr.

Did manage to have some good stuff this weekend, though. Tastes good when you get 10 inches of snow and it's -2, as well.

[DeanSheen]

You guys stick around long enough and you will see the patterns that Chuck , Josh and others reacted to. Maybe they were off base but the statements they made hardly warrant all the crying.

[Inthewater]

You guys stick around long enough and you will see the patterns that Chuck , Josh and others reacted to. Maybe they were off base but the statements they made hardly warrant all the crying.

This is quite true, for both sides of this discussion.

[cowdery]

This is quite true, for both sides of this discussion.

Where we presumably disagree is that I believe newbies have a responsibility to (1) learn the local culture before they leap in with both feet or, barring that, (2) they need to take it with grace when they get called out for committing a cultural faux pas.

The "other side" in this discussion has done neither.

You and those parties apparently disagree with the premise above. Obviously my tenure here does not put me above reproach, as evidenced by the fact that I am constantly being reproached. Nothing I've written has been in response to said reproach. Go back and read my original reaction to kbrighton's first post in this thread, which was his first post to the board. Realize that every criticism of me in this thread is based on that post. He wasn't reproaching me in that post, so nothing I've written in this thread is about me being "above reproach."

I concluded that post with, "I'm calling you out because part of making a product you intend to sell to the public is learning how to talk to that public, and you have a lot to learn."

That's how we talk to each other here, all of us. We can dish it out and we can take it. Sorry, but I have no patience with people who come in here and without knowing anything about us, start to criticize our way of doing things. That's what all this is about. I don't see how we can make such people feel welcome and I don't see why we should bother.

Does anybody else want to pick at this scab?

[Inthewater]

Cowdery, if you honestly think neither you or anyone else from the "other side" of the discussion did anything to inflame it, then I think it is you that needs to go back and re-read the thread.

"I come here to talk about American whiskey, as I've been doing for more than 10 years. I don't come here to be criticized by someone who just got here."

That sounds like someone saying, in lay man's terms for people like me, "You haven't been here long enough to question what I do or say, newbie."

I think half, or more, of the issue here is that you keep stepping in to post about things that likely haven't been directed at you for most of the last 6 pages.

There were others along the way that really took this whole thing a little too far, in my humble newbie opinion.

Anyway, I hope Kolin stays around and contributes. I'd like to hear more from people in the industry, when possible. Especially a small company in my state that is actually doing it right, rather than some of what we have seen before.

[GOCOUGS2002]

I think half, or more, of the issue here is that you keep stepping in to post about things that likely haven't been directed at you for most of the last 6 pages.

Ironic statement, you've been doing the same thing...

[Inthewater]

Ironic statement, you've been doing the same thing...

Negative, I am one of the newbie people from Iowa that stepped in early and had some issues with some things said early on.

Anyway, we have likely succeeded in turning a possible contributing member away. Even if he had some mis-steps right out of the gate, I feel like some things could have gone differently.

There is no doubt that he could have approached some things better and made some comments with more clarity, but I think we all could have.

The guy IS a bit younger, and I think a lot of us were probably more like that 10+ years ago (assuming on median age here) than we remember. He was obviously passionate about his product, which I think is good, he just didn't do the best at getting the info he had across. Hopefully he will take the constructive aspects of the criticism given and continue as a member.

Anyway, it's Friday, and that means I get to drink some bourbon.

Happy weekend.

[Virus_Of_Life]

If the next post in this thread isn't on topic it'll be closed, far too much bickering going on here!

[jbutler]

Not to belabor the obvious but what we have here is a thread quickly escalating into a flame war. Shutting it down.

If you want to play on this lawn folks, then play nice.