Evan Williams SB 23yr

[RyanL]

I didn't want to start this thread in the premium bourbon threads cause I don't own a bottle, have no tasting notes, and don't know of any member that owns one either.

I just really have a question about what Heaven Hill is trying to accomplish with this. The offer their normal EWSB which is 10 years old for around $25. They have no mid level offering like 15-17yr old bourbon. They just jump straight to 23 years and they jack the price to $375(correct me if I'm wrong) and only offer it at the distillery. Who are they expecting to actually buy this? What are they doing/thinking? They don't even have a middle aged bourbon to get people excited about their older offering. Now that isn't the biggest deal but $375, really? Their customer base is paying $25 for EWSB, which of those customers do they think is going to throw down $350 more for a 23yr bourbon.

I guess this is more or less just a rant thread that I hope Heaven Hill reads because this seems completely insane to me. They have what I would assume is some great bourbon just sitting there that I also assume pretty much no one is buying. Why not put it at a price point that their customers can afford and feel good about buying a premium bottle at? If EWSB was $50-60 I would kinda get it...but the $25 to $375 jump I just can't understand.

[T Comp]

...I just really have a question about what Heaven Hill is trying to accomplish with this. The offer their normal EWSB which is 10 years old for around $25. They have no mid level offering like 15-17yr old bourbon. They just jump straight to 23 years and they jack the price to $375(correct me if I'm wrong) and only offer it at the distillery. Who are they expecting to actually buy this? What are they doing/thinking? They don't even have a middle aged bourbon to get people excited about their older offering. Now that isn't the biggest deal but $375, really? Their customer base is paying $25 for EWSB, which of those customers do they think is going to throw down $350 more for a 23yr bourbon. ...

Elijah Craig 12 and 18 should fit your desire. Same mash bill at least. It would be nice if the 23 year old was given even limited distribution as the HH distillery store prices for PHC and VOF are significantly higher than most liquor stores.

[doubleblank]

EW 12, EW 15 and EW 23 were all Japanese/foreign market bottlings for a long time. It's been a relatively recent development that EW 23 showed up here at all....even if only at the distillery. It's always been expensive. Jim Butler, the Boss, has had a bottle open for many, many years. It's not empty for a reason......tastes like oak splinters. Not worth $50 IMHO.

Randy

[p_elliott]

EW 12, EW 15 and EW 23 were all Japanese/foreign market bottlings for a long time. It's been a relatively recent development that EW 23 showed up here at all....even if only at the distillery. It's always been expensive. Jim Butler, the Boss, has had a bottle open for many, many years. It's not empty for a reason......tastes like oak splinters. Not worth $50 IMHO.

Randy

We had the EW 23 at the distillery tasting room and it's not that good.

[JohnHansell]

I have also had this whiskey on several occassions and agree with the statements above: too much oak.

[OscarV]

Ryan, it ain't worth it.

It looks good but it's like that old saying,...nice house but nobody is home.

[cowdery]

To answer the "what is HH trying to accomplish" question, they're trying to see if enough people think "older is always better" for them to sell an over-aged whiskey for $375 a bottle. I'm sure they didn't 'make' a 23-year-old bourbon on purpose. It was probably a barrel that got misplaced. They found it so they thought they'd bottle it and and see if anybody would buy it, rather than selling it to KBD and letting them try to sell it for some equally absurd price.

They've watched as other people made money off of their rejects, so why not try to keep that for themselves. As Randy mentioned, they've been sending this very old stuff to Japan for years. I remember being at HH 20 years ago when they 'found' one of these very old barrels. I think it was 25 years old. I tasted some right out of the barrel and almost spit it out. It was like what I imagine a half-burned log from a campfire tastes like.

I asked them what they were going to do with it and they said, "send it to Japan." That was 20 years ago.

But it's not a big part of their mix, it's not a big image thing, it doesn't 'mean' anything. It's not a statement about the brand. It's sold in the gift shop, nowhere else, so very few drinkers of EW black label on EW single barrel are even aware of it.

[macdeffe]

Other old whiskies from same company is Rittenhouse 25yo and Parker's Heritage Collection 27yo (and other ages)

Not sure about US prices but aren't they cheaper than EW mentioned ?

I tried the mentioned PH and found it quite oaky, but the Rittenhouse was nice and balanced, but I might say that cause I mainly drink single malts and single grains, of which the Rittenhouse reminded me

Steffen

[Jwilly019]

Other old whiskies from same company is Rittenhouse 25yo and Parker's Heritage Collection 27yo (and other ages)

Not sure about US prices but aren't they cheaper than EW mentioned ?

I tried the mentioned PH and found it quite oaky, but the Rittenhouse was nice and balanced, but I might say that cause I mainly drink single malts and single grains, of which the Rittenhouse reminded me

Steffen

Not sure about the PHC27, but I've seen bottles of Ritt 25 for $250. Cheaper, but still quite pricey.

[jfw]

The EW 23 yr old is less than $200 dollars (adjusted for currency) overseas. I have no idea why they charge so much here.

[White Dog]

Other old whiskies from same company is Rittenhouse 25yo and Parker's Heritage Collection 27yo (and other ages)

Not sure about US prices but aren't they cheaper than EW mentioned ?

I tried the mentioned PH and found it quite oaky, but the Rittenhouse was nice and balanced, but I might say that cause I mainly drink single malts and single grains, of which the Rittenhouse reminded me

Steffen

I agree with your findings. IMHO, there's a big difference between long-aged rye-recipe Bourbon and Straight Rye. Rye-recipe Bourbon gets pretty damn woody to me after 12-15 years, but Straight Rye? I've never met one old enough.:cool:

[macdeffe]

I found the Bitter truth Rye somewhat woody thou, a lot more than the Rittenhouse 25. I should try to find a bottle of the Rittenhouse 25 to do a H2H. I like both thou

Steffen

[p_elliott]

The PHC 27 is $200 and is a much better bourbon.

[StraightBoston]

I've had the EW23 -- like everyone else, found it too woody to be enjoyable (tried several times at several bars in Japan to be sure.) Can still be found there in the $200-250 range depending on exchange rates.

With that said, in the Scotch world $375 is a bargain for an extra-aged whiskey, and I think that's where/how HH is positioning it.

[jbutler]

It's not empty for a reason......tastes like oak splinters.

You forgot to say "burnt" Randy.

It's an expensive bottle, and a gift from Larry Kass, so I'm not complaining, but I find the stuff undrinkable as do most people I know. My friend Tony thought it was delicious however, and most of what's missing from the bottle went down his throat.

[redbear]

Looks like another one is coming out. The label doesn't specify single barrel though.

https://www.ttbonline.gov/colasonline/viewColaDetails.do?action=publicFormDisplay&ttbid=12122001000348

Was the last one also 107 proof?

[StraightBoston]

Looks like new label for the same (old) juice to match the newish packaging for the standard vintage SB. Yes, the last one was also 107 proof.

(I actually preferred the script "Evan Williams" labels...)

[sob0728]

Is this the reason Elijah Craig 18 is going away for a while?

[T Comp]

Is this the reason Elijah Craig 18 is going away for a while?

I'm sure the 23 is very limited and from only a few barrels so no. The 18's going away because there are not enough barrels coming of age to sustain the 18 year brand currently. The '96 fire not only destroyed barrels (95,000 reported) but put pressure for other surviving barrels to be used. It'll only be 16 years since the fire and 13 since they started distilling at Bernheim. Just not enough 18 year old barrels because of the above and now a chance to bottle up and sell continuing older survivng honey barrels at a premium and before they turn for the worse (as in the recently announced 1,300 bottles of EC 20 year at $130). I'd guess 18 may not be back to its more recent bottling numbers till the HH Bernheim distilled barrels come of age or another 5 years.