Lesson Learned........Maybe

[jonhalter]

Ive been on SB for a little less than a year now. I read the forum almost daily and add my two cents from time to time. One of the biggest lessons Ive learned is that the price and quality of bourbon are not linked. Great bourbon can be had on the cheap, and there are some terrible "top shelf" drams. Having learned this lesson, I was wandering my local liquor store, and I thought "Ive never had a rye whisky, I should buy some" Ritt is not available in FL to my knowledge, and the only other rye I remember reading about is saz. I tried to apply my earlier lesson of price and quality to this purchase. I ended up with a bottle of old overholt. I got home and tried it as soon as I walked in the door. It isnt very good. Do I not like rye? I seem to like high rye bourbon. Then I did a little research here. It turns out most of you dont like OO either. I know through the process you come across bottles you just dont care for. I found one today. Good news, it didnt cost me much, and its not bad as a mixer for my friends who dont know any better. Will I make more blind choices, probably. But I will try to be more informed. If all else fails, Squire has influenced me to buy more OGD.

[tigerlam92]

What also helped me a lot is not only pre-screening with SB.com, but also know who's taste profile is similar to yours as well.

What one may like you may not like at all. But once you know who's like matches yours, that would make your first purchase choice more successful.

I also like the side by side tasting notes so you have a point of reference, say the control is something that you have tasted already as well.

Finally, when I first started on Sb.com, I reviewed member's profile for what their "recommended" are and what they group together and try that - matching especially to a member you think like what you like.

[393foureyedfox]

Ive been on SB for a little less than a year now. I read the forum almost daily and add my two cents from time to time. One of the biggest lessons Ive learned is that the price and quality of bourbon are not linked. Great bourbon can be had on the cheap, and there are some terrible "top shelf" drams. Having learned this lesson, I was wandering my local liquor store, and I thought "Ive never had a rye whisky, I should buy some" Ritt is not available in FL to my knowledge, and the only other rye I remember reading about is saz. I tried to apply my earlier lesson of price and quality to this purchase. I ended up with a bottle of old overholt. I got home and tried it as soon as I walked in the door. It isnt very good. Do I not like rye? I seem to like high rye bourbon. Then I did a little research here. It turns out most of you dont like OO either. I know through the process you come across bottles you just dont care for. I found one today. Good news, it didnt cost me much, and its not bad as a mixer for my friends who dont know any better. Will I make more blind choices, probably. But I will try to be more informed. If all else fails, Squire has influenced me to buy more OGD.

i couldnt have said it better myself. ive probably pissed off more than a few here about my pricing rants. i had the same experience with OO. i like high ryes, so i tried a cheap straight rye.....OO. terrible crap, couldnt even use it in my BBQ sauce, and its the only thing ive poured down the drain. I havent tried Ritt yet, only because i rarely see it here....id give it a shot just because its a rye experiment, its cheap, its well liked here, and its 100 proof (my minimum).

i basically enjoy the experimenting process. i try something new most every time i go to the liquor store. lots of things i decide ill likely never buy again, and a few things i keep around.

squire is a big advocate of OGD BIB, and he is onto something. while i dont personally care for the BIB, i do love the 114.

keep experimenting! youre onto the biggest idea already - price doesnt mean much, quality is all over the board. my favorites range from $10-50, and include both HH BIB's, OGD 114, KC120, and Bookers. I never buy bookers though due to the price, and i only have a stash of KC120 because i found a clearance and wiped them out.........so my regulars are $10-20, and i enjoy them more than most things ive tried at twice the price, or higher.

[TunnelTiger]

Very well put and I agree with what you say. May I suggest the GDR, at $20 I think you'll see a marked improvement ove the OO which I totally agree with, bad stuff

[squire]

It's really a shame what Beam has done to Old Overholt. It has a fairly high rye content in the mashbill (close to 60%) but rather than showcase this (as HH does Rittenhouse) Beam chooses to let the brand languish as a 36 month old 80 proof with indifferent barrel selection. One would think they view it as competition for the regular Beam Rye.

[GaryT]

Shame that Ritt BIB isn't available. I'm a rye fan, but found I didn't like GDR (and also didn't like OO). After Ritt, the next best ryes (IMHO) are going to run in the mid $30s (Jefferson 10yr, or Willett 4yr). I can't think of anything between $20 and $35 (at least in Atlanta) that I would reach for in a rye. Does Jim have any Willett ryes at the store/bar? Next time you're in Atlanta we can definitely line up a nice rye tasting

[squire]

Jon you might check with your local ABC store for some Wild Turkey Rye 101, if they don't have any in stock it can be ordered from another store through their system.

[jeffrey r]

Shame that Ritt BIB isn't available. I'm a rye fan, but found I didn't like GDR (and also didn't like OO). After Ritt, the next best ryes (IMHO) are going to run in the mid $30s (Jefferson 10yr, or Willett 4yr). I can't think of anything between $20 and $35 (at least in Atlanta) that I would reach for in a rye.

I would put Baby Saz in this class, by way of quality and price. Really nice rye in my opinion, at under $30.

[smokinjoe]

I don't find anything "bad" or offensive with overholt, I just find it incredibly boring, bland, nearly tasteless, and the meer mention of it's name induces me to nod off to sle...zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz...Wha?...What happened?!?!...Is that you ma??? Anywho, these ain't qualities I'm lookin for in a rye! Quite to the contrary, I want to be bitch slapped by my ryes...and by Adriana Lima dressed in a black leather Catwoman outfit, with red...ahem...but I digress...:crazy:

Please don't make your final verdict on rye whiskey based on your OO experience. Continue your quest, and seek out some others, and see if you can find one in your wheelhouse. FWIW, my own experience with ryes has illustrated to me that each distillery's rye has it 's own very distinct house style that goes well beyond the house style differences in their bourbon offerings. Here's 3 I'd try...Baby Saz, LDI (GD, Bulliet, Willett, et al), WT101 (if you can find a dusty), and Knob Creek (bitch slapper )...wait, that's 4...No matter...Personally, I'm in the 3% minority who does not dig the Ritt (too bourbony, but looking forward to trying the new make from DSP1), but too many love it for you not to go for it.

Just keep 'sperimentin'!

[393foureyedfox]

I want to be bitch slapped by my ryes...and by Adriana Lima dressed in a black leather Catwoman outfit, with red...ahem...but I digress...:crazy:

i agree, but id prefer Carol Seleme.......with hair, of course

[suntour]

Its amazing to think that Knob Creek rye and OO are related with their differences in quality.

You guys that hate OO should try it in Manhattans. For whatever reason something magical happens to that bad rye when paired with bitters and even a decent vermouth. Definitely better than Dickle rye in this particular drink, and I prefer Dickle not dressed up as a cocktail.

I'd definitely like to taste OO, JBR, and KCR side-by-side.

[BAO]

What also helped me a lot is not only pre-screening with SB.com, but also know who's taste profile is similar to yours as well.

What one may like you may not like at all. But once you know who's like matches yours, that would make your first purchase choice more successful.

Nail on the head here. You can do this with whiskey writers as well.

[CL]

Shame that Ritt BIB isn't available. I'm a rye fan, but found I didn't like GDR (and also didn't like OO). After Ritt, the next best ryes (IMHO) are going to run in the mid $30s (Jefferson 10yr, or Willett 4yr). I can't think of anything between $20 and $35 (at least in Atlanta) that I would reach for in a rye. Does Jim have any Willett ryes at the store/bar? Next time you're in Atlanta we can definitely line up a nice rye tasting

I'd give Smooth Ambler Old Scout Rye a shot. I buy ryes for my Manhattans, but I have been drinking this one neat. I don't know if they sell in GA yet, though.

[Yeti]

What also helped me a lot is not only pre-screening with SB.com, but also know who's taste profile is similar to yours as well.

[Variable]

John, last time I was in Jax I saw some Ritt at Total Wine. If you are not too far away from Town Center you should be able to get some.

[smokinjoe]

Its amazing to think that Knob Creek rye and OO are related with their differences in quality.

You guys that hate OO should try it in Manhattans. For whatever reason something magical happens to that bad rye when paired with bitters and even a decent vermouth. Definitely better than Dickle rye in this particular drink, and I prefer Dickle not dressed up as a cocktail.

I'd definitely like to taste OO, JBR, and KCR side-by-side.

I am a big fan of the LDI ryes, but like you, I don't care for them in a Manhattan. Very, very nice with Ginger Ale, though. On most occasions, I drink the LDI rye iterations neat.

[RWBadley]

It's really a shame what Beam has done to Old Overholt. It has a fairly high rye content in the mashbill (close to 60%) but rather than showcase this (as HH does Rittenhouse) Beam chooses to let the brand languish as a 36 month old 80 proof with indifferent barrel selection. One would think they view it as competition for the regular Beam Rye.

Years ago ( I should say 'many' years ago) Old Overholt was my go-to whiskey. That and Old Crow. Now I haven't tasted them in years as there have been several disappointments. One being quite funny in retrospect, and not the fault of the whiskey:

Living in Reno back in the early 80's I was in a favored casino and asked for an OO. They had those stupid little open pour jobbies and it was the bottom of the bottle, probably been open for quite a while. It poured and I tasted it- tasty, wonderful stuff- however I look in the glass and there are about a dozen fruit flies. They were not doing the backstroke, but they did look well preserved and I'm sure all died a happy death.

I brought up the situation with the barkeep, who then accused me of planting the fruit flies in the glass! Hey, all I wanted was a fresh pour without the wildlife. Maintaining a mostly calm demeanor, I replied it was silly to think I would carry a batch of fruit flies into the bar to add to my whiskey for the purpose of? and by the way bring your manager over- I thought this would go well- tho oddly the manager did not just capture me a fresh pour- They seemed to think I had planted the fruit flies because 'we don't serve booze with flies'. Jeebus. I decided it just wasn't worth the effort. They lost a pretty decent customer that day, just because they wouldn't toss him a fresh pour.

Edited September 13, 2013 by RWBadley

[393foureyedfox]

They lost a pretty decent customer that day, just because they wouldn't toss him a fresh pour.

casinos do run a really small profit margin......

[Bourbon Boiler]

To the OP, I really like rye-heavy bourbons, but don't like many ryes. I love the spicy, peppery flavor that the rye gives a bourbon, but to many ryes taste too much of pine or mint for my taste. So yes, it's very possible to like rye bourbon and not ryes.

That's not to say there are no ryes worth buying, I happen to enjoy both the WT and Russell's Reserve Ryes, which puts me in a minority around here. You have it right, study your tastes, not the price tag.

[squire]

The complex, sophisticated, lighter style of rye out of Canada offer some alternatives.

[jonhalter]

Variable I just went to Total Wine, and they did have Ritt BIB. At 29.99 I didnt pull the trigger. Instead I bought fighting cock at 17.99 and EW white at 16.99. Havent had FC in over a decade, and never had the EW white. Good to know Ritt is an option around here. Ill try some one of these days.

[GaryT]

Variable I just went to Total Wine, and they did have Ritt BIB. At 29.99 I didnt pull the trigger. Instead I bought fighting cock at 17.99 and EW white at 16.99. Havent had FC in over a decade, and never had the EW white. Good to know Ritt is an option around here. Ill try some one of these days.

[TunnelTiger]

Just can't, no how, no way, get any FC even if they were giving it away.

[GaryT]

Just can't, no how, no way, get any FC even if they were giving it away.

Bad experience with it in the past?

[Variable]

Wow - $30 seems high. I see it for under $20 around Atlanta. I've never had older FC, but the I think the current stuff is a damn nice pour for the price. I'd have gone that route rather than spring $30 on the Ritt.

Yeah at times we tend to get bent over down here in FL when it comes to bourbon. Some stuff seems plentiful (w12 for example), while the nicer pours everybody else gets (ecbp) are unavailable or extremely hard to get.

To the op, I am glad at least now you have Ritt as an option. It is a very nice pour imho. Then again, so is FC. Enjoy!

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