Price variations throughout the US

[DBM]

Yesterday I was browsing the shelves of a respected Seattle wine and spirits merchant and saw Old Grand Dad 114 for $30.95 and Elmer T. Lee for $44.95. These prices seem high, but include 27% in state taxes built into the shelf tag price and are average among Washington State retailers. Only the biggest national chains are able to sell lower due to nationally negotiated pricing contracts (and other slimy, likely illegal business tactics).

Washington also has crazy sales and sin taxes on spirits, so my out-the-door price on the OGD114 would be $40.12 and the ETL checks out at $56.99.

It made me really question what I consider value pours because these prices put them on par with what others are paying for ultra-premium brands and limited releases.

Being on the west coast where it often takes a full day of driving to reach beyond one adjacent state, I don't have ready access to other markets. I'm curious if others, particularly on the east coast, use state lines as a shopping "tool" when making every day purchases.

[Max Power]

Yesterday I was browsing the shelves of a respected Seattle wine and spirits merchant and saw Old Grand Dad 114 for $30.95 and Elmer T. Lee for $44.95. These prices seem high, but include 27% in state taxes built into the shelf tag price and are average among Washington State retailers. Only the biggest national chains are able to sell lower due to nationally negotiated pricing contracts (and other slimy, likely illegal business tactics).

Washington also has crazy sales and sin taxes on spirits, so my out-the-door price on the OGD114 would be $40.12 and the ETL checks out at $56.99.

It made me really question what I consider value pours because these prices put them on par with what others are paying for ultra-premium brands and limited releases.

Being on the west coast where it often takes a full day of driving to reach beyond one adjacent state, I don't have ready access to other markets. I'm curious if others, particularly on the east coast, use state lines as a shopping "tool" when making every day purchases.

There's still some places that ship to Washington if I'm not mistaken. I'd be checking those out.

[sutton]

DBM, yes, I make full use of my neighboring states, but I'd say most of the stock is the same stuff and prices, with some exceptions, are all within a few dollars of each other. So the gas prices even at these short distances rarely make economic sense. Mostly it is finding stuff that is out of stock in your area that is on the shelf somewhere else.

I did get a handle of Old Heaven Hill 8 yr old in RI that apparently is only available there and in MN - haven't opened it yet though. I get lots of nice SKUs and store selections at Julio's and great prices on the high volume stuff at Wegman's and BJ's Warehouse.

[DrBob]

I live in New Mexico so its a 4 hr round trip for me to get to the nearest other state, but I will say this:

I stayed in Massachusetts on vacation this summer with high taxes on liquor and limited selection in most stores. When driving north to Maine, right on the New Hampshire border of the freeway, both directions and with their own exits, were NH state run liquor stores with way better selection,prices, and they were selling on Sunday.... They were doing a huge business and people buying liquor by the shopping cart full. so not only individuals play that game but states as well.

If I were forced to live in Massachusetts I would drive to New Hampshire to buy without a second thought.

Also I travel a lot for work, and many times my suitcases are checked luggage on the way back due to holding 5-6 bottles of "other state" bought bourbon.

[sutton]

Yeah, I know both of those stores on I-95 - I used to live just over the border in MA and went there almost every other weekend.

A few years back MA and NH got into a squabble about the tax revenue, and the MA state troopers were sitting right over the line and were filling tractor trailers with confiscated booze as you re-entered MA. They were just calling in the plates as you pulled out of the parking lot back onto I-95S. Since then, MA has allowed Sunday sales after noon in stores that I believe are within 12 miles of any border - which covers a good bit of the state. Some of the larger retail outlets (like a Costco, BJ's) can also now sell on Sunday's after noon. Takes awhile to move off those Puritan ways...

[squire]

Centuries even . . . . . . . .

[portwood]

Centuries even . . . . . . . .

Ontario is working to your time-table.

[squire]

So are parts of the Country that are still dry.

[Flyfish]

Washington also has crazy sales and sin taxes on spirits, so my out-the-door price on the OGD114 would be $40.12 and the ETL checks out at $56.99.

One of my usual rants on SB is the state control of liquor prices and, more important to me, availability of bourbon brands in OH. Does $40 for OGD114 seem outrageous? How about not being able to get it at any price? We do a high percentage of our bourbon shopping in KY but, from Toledo, TPS is a little more than 200 miles away. MA to NH it ain't. Sometimes we pay a premium price in OH (Blanton's is $10 more than in AZ) but nothing approaching the levels mentioned by DBM. But most people who live in Blue states will tell you that taxes are the price you pay for civilization. I could live with just a tad more bourbon and a tad less "civilization."

[Paddy]

Yesterday I was browsing the shelves of a respected Seattle wine and spirits merchant and saw Old Grand Dad 114 for $30.95 and Elmer T. Lee for $44.95. These prices seem high, but include 27% in state taxes built into the shelf tag price and are average among Washington State retailers. Only the biggest national chains are able to sell lower due to nationally negotiated pricing contracts (and other slimy, likely illegal business tactics).

Washington also has crazy sales and sin taxes on spirits, so my out-the-door price on the OGD114 would be $40.12 and the ETL checks out at $56.99.

It made me really question what I consider value pours because these prices put them on par with what others are paying for ultra-premium brands and limited releases.

Being on the west coast where it often takes a full day of driving to reach beyond one adjacent state, I don't have ready access to other markets. I'm curious if others, particularly on the east coast, use state lines as a shopping "tool" when making every day purchases.

Yes, every resource is used to it's advantage. KY and VA historically always had the lowest cigarette taxes around and were "drive in" states for the purpose of purchasing large quantities and moving them to outside markets for resell. TN always historically had lower alcohol tax (and much greater availability) due to the vast areas of KY and VA that were dry. We always looked at it as a "fair trade off". Obviously these factors are much easier to exploit when living near multiple state borders, as in the area where I was raised.

[Phil T]

.

Washington also has crazy sales and sin taxes on spirits, so my out-the-door price on the OGD114 would be $40.12 and the ETL checks out at $56.99.

[mbroo5880i]

I was in Indiana last weekend and picked up OGD114 ($20.99) and ETL ($26.99). Sales tax was 7%.

[sutton]

I think the primary benefit of livin' in the tiny states, is that TPS or another large online presence will ship to at least one of them! Just have to time the shipments to family holiday get togethers and order in large enough quantities to make the shipping costs tolerable (only way I got the VOB BiB, AAA 10yr, and a few others that no amount of driving will find you around here. And while I didn't buy the squire-mandated VOB case, it was close ... :grin:).

[393foureyedfox]

27% tax, and over $30 on OGD114?!?!

its 20.99 here in KY, and a 6% tax.

if i were living where you did, i would take a long road trip-vacation once a year and fill the trunk, but i dont know how far youd have to drive to get to reasonable prices and taxes...

[PaulO]

Yeah, I know both of those stores on I-95 - I used to live just over the border in MA and went there almost every other weekend.

A few years back MA and NH got into a squabble about the tax revenue, and the MA state troopers were sitting right over the line and were filling tractor trailers with confiscated booze as you re-entered MA. They were just calling in the plates as you pulled out of the parking lot back onto I-95S. Since then, MA has allowed Sunday sales after noon in stores that I believe are within 12 miles of any border - which covers a good bit of the state. Some of the larger retail outlets (like a Costco, BJ's) can also now sell on Sunday's after noon. Takes awhile to move off those Puritan ways...

I can't see how MA state troopers could legally confiscate booze that came from another state. If they caught some one flipping it (re-selling without a license) that is illegal. But I don't see a problem for personal use. Are the MA troopers going to confiscate everything of value bought outside the state?

[sutton]

In many states (not sure if all) it is simply illegal to transport alcohol across state lines. Doesn't matter why. Normally nothing is done about it - but in this case, they were obviously trying to make a point.

So yeah, when you go on a road trip, pay attention to that speed limit.

[ebo]

One of my usual rants on SB is the state control of liquor prices and, more important to me, availability of bourbon brands in OH. Does $40 for OGD114 seem outrageous? How about not being able to get it at any price? We do a high percentage of our bourbon shopping in KY but, from Toledo, TPS is a little more than 200 miles away. MA to NH it ain't. Sometimes we pay a premium price in OH (Blanton's is $10 more than in AZ) but nothing approaching the levels mentioned by DBM. But most people who live in Blue states will tell you that taxes are the price you pay for civilization. I could live with just a tad more bourbon and a tad less "civilization."

I hear ya. I really don't understand why we can get OGD in 86/80 proof and Bonded 100 proof but we can't get the 114. WHY??? Why can we get regular BT and Blanton's but we can't get ETL?.... at least I've never seen ETL in my area. Why can we get WT101, 81 and WTRB but we can't get WTKS?...... again, at least not in my area. I will never understand the hows, whys and wherefores of Whisk(e)y availability in Ohio.

[Flyfish]

Why can we get regular BT and Blanton's but we can't get ETL?.... at least I've never seen ETL in my area. Why can we get WT101, 81 and WTRB but we can't get WTKS?...... again, at least not in my area. I will never understand the hows, whys and wherefores of Whisk(e)y availability in Ohio.

I am fortunate, I think, to have a daughter and son-in-law on the faculty/staff at OSU so we go to Columbus. At Weiland's, I can get ETL. The Columbus market is more sophisticated (i.e, more politicians and lobbyists) so the selection there is somewat better. Somewhat. Even so, no Wellers, no upscale WTs, no.....(fill in the very large blank).

Edited September 20, 2013 by Flyfish

[miller542]

I will never understand the hows, whys and wherefores of Whisk(e)y availability in Ohio.

The one thing I loved about buying liquor in Ohio: the price on the shelf is exactly what you pay at the register. I know, calculating 6% on $20 isn't difficult, but for whatever reason, all taxes already included makes it easier at the register.

And the way I've rationalized price variation around the country: there is no rationalization to price variation around the country. Too many historical and political bias built into sin taxes and sales tax. And for the non-control states, the individual store owners are going to do what they think is best for their store.

[DBM]

Yeah, I don't try to rationalize why price variation happens, I am just interested in how others view and adapt to such large differences (when they occur). Washington is surrounded by control states (Oregon, Idaho, Montana) with a 3 to 5 hour one-way commute to reach them from Seattle, and British Columbia, so it's not like I have a border to freedom.

I did learn the art of packing bottles in checked luggage this year, so that might be my primary plan going forward.

Availability and pricing is a convoluted arrangement between manufacturers, importers, distributors and retailers with federal, state, county and city influence. Most of the unwelcome symptoms are perpetuated by the distributors, but they aren't the only ones to blame.

[mbroo5880i]

Yeah, I don't try to rationalize why price variation happens, I am just interested in how others view and adapt to such large differences (when they occur). Washington is surrounded by control states (Oregon, Idaho, Montana) with a 3 to 5 hour one-way commute to reach them from Seattle, and British Columbia, so it's not like I have a border to freedom.

I did learn the art of packing bottles in checked luggage this year, so that might be my primary plan going forward.

Availability and pricing is a convoluted arrangement between manufacturers, importers, distributors and retailers with federal, state, county and city influence. Most of the unwelcome symptoms are perpetuated by the distributors, but they aren't the only ones to blame.

Price variability is less of an issue in Indiana. I find our prices pretty similar to KY. However, they tend to be lower than OH. I assume due to taxes. I have only shopped for bourbon once in OH and was turned off because all of the prices were exactly $10 greater than for the same product in IN. Interestingly, rum and vodka were cheaper.

Your situation is so much different since the states around you are farther away and control states. Does Washington allow residents to receive shipments from out of state?

[theglobalguy]

On vacation or work trips a few times to states other than KY...i quickly learned to be thankful for pricing/selection in my adopted home. In fact i may have hugged my whiskey shop owner next visit once home.

One spot i couldn't understand was Colorado, saw WR and Beam brands for way less than we pay here. Chalked it up to taxes and moved on.

[steeltownbbq]

Another frustrated Ohio shopper here.

Ten minutes ago I finished my last VOB (purchased in Indiana) and told my wife it's time for another trip to KY or IN. And since I'm in Youngstown this weekend - I'll be skipping over to PA to get some OGD114 and a case of Duquesne Beer for some buddies in Toledo.

With better variety my tax (and other dollars) would stay in OH.

[WhiskyRI]

In theory the high prices in WA are "temporary" because of the transition from state run stores to private stores. The high tariffs are part of a transition plan to ensure that revenue isn't negatively impacted. It is shocking though to walk into a store and see stuff for $60 or $80 that you can buy for $40 elsewhere.

[squire]

If I were a betting man I'd bet that temporary morphs into permanent.