Is it not actually barley that I'm hating?

[upStomp]

There's a certain flavor note that I've always associated with Scotch & Irish whisky. I'm not necessarily talking about peat/smoke...more of a mustiness. I've always hated the flavor and avoid it as much as I can in any whiskey. It's not prevalent in my regular pours (I'm a BT/4R guy), but I do notice it sometimes when I visit other brands - mostly in Beam products, and to a lesser extent in HH stuff. I always assumed this came from the amount of barley in the mash bill. It seemed that anything close to 10% and I'd notice it - anything 15% and up and my gag reflex would kick in. It was fairly predictable, at least for the whiskies for which a mash bill is public.

Enter Lot 40. This is a Canadian 100% rye (with 10% malted rye), but I'm picking up clearly on that musty flavor. So what gives? Is it not the barley that I'm picking up on after all? Is it actually the malting process that gives off this musty flavor, or could it be some other variable (barrel, etc.)?

[Richnimrod]

Maybe it's the yeast and/or it combined with the barley malt??

I know many speak of the funky under-taste to Beam products, and attribute it to their yeast.

I only pick that up in JB white label.

Never noticed it in HH products; but with my iron palate, I'm sure I miss a lot of stuff others pick up.

[hn4bourbon]

I think you might be describing the notes that the malt contributes.

[sutton]

Could be the barely, might also be the used barrels -

[squire]

Could well be the malt. The only way to be sure is try those brands whose mash bill contains 8% or less.

[Vadertime]

I don't like the malt, don't like the sherry, and don't like peat. Stuck in Scotch crazed Asia I find them unavoidable though.

[squire]

There's always gin & tonic.

[rod]

Right there with you - hate Scotch, love Bourbon.

If we think like scientists, what would be the "A/B" tasting we should do to get to the bottom of this? What is the most commonly available highest-barley Bourbon out there?

e.g. I believe Jack Daniels is 80/8/12 and Dickel is 80/12/8 (corn/rye/barley), and they're both the same style - do you prefer one over the other? (of course these are different distilleries / yeasts - is there a better comparison??)

For example if you wanted to 'test' your palate for Rye you could always try a same-shelf/proof comparison of BT#1 vs BT#2 (Virginia Gentleman vs Benchmark?)

[luther.r]

Right there with you - hate Scotch, love Bourbon.

If we think like scientists, what would be the "A/B" tasting we should do to get to the bottom of this? What is the most commonly available highest-barley Bourbon out there?

e.g. I believe Jack Daniels is 80/8/12 and Dickel is 80/12/8 (corn/rye/barley), and they're both the same style - do you prefer one over the other? (of course these are different distilleries / yeasts - is there a better comparison??)

For example if you wanted to 'test' your palate for Rye you could always try a same-shelf/proof comparison of BT#1 vs BT#2 (Virginia Gentleman vs Benchmark?)

Maybe try a Scottish grain whisky? That would be a whisky not made primarily from malted barley, but aged in similar conditions to malt Scotch, no?

[upStomp]

I believe Jack Daniels is 80/8/12 and Dickel is 80/12/8 (corn/rye/barley), and they're both the same style - do you prefer one over the other? (of course these are different distilleries / yeasts - is there a better comparison??)

For example if you wanted to 'test' your palate for Rye you could always try a same-shelf/proof comparison of BT#1 vs BT#2 (Virginia Gentleman vs Benchmark?)

[squire]

I've never tasted this note with any BT product . . . . regardless of mash bill - though I've never tried any of their bottom shelf offerings.

[upStomp]

Same stuff, bottom shelf is just younger/lower proof and sometimes not as consistent because barrel selection is not so critical when producing a brand whose primary appeal is price point.

[Enoch]

I am convinced that it is the yeast, if you are describing what I think you are. I can detect "it" in ALL current Beam products, but the intensity is inversely proportional to time in barrel. I also have several Beam products from the past and it is not there in the 80s, very slight in the 90s. As for Heaven Hill, I have really noticed it in the new Rittenhouse but never noticed it in the old stuff. (Now I'm glad I stockpiled several cases). May be like Phenylthiocarbamide...some people can taste it and some cannot. JMHO. PS: Just bought a bottle of Mastersons Barley and didn't notice it there.

[squire]

If we think like scientists, what would be the "A/B" tasting we should do to get to the bottom of this? . . . .

For example if you wanted to 'test' your palate for Rye you could always try a same-shelf/proof comparison of BT#1 vs BT#2 (Virginia Gentleman vs Benchmark?)

[squire]

Me thinks a bottle of Benchmark (the only bottom shelf BT product I've seen up here) is calling my name. You know, for science

[upStomp]

But of course, some lines of inquiry must be pursued. I've been a proponent of Benchmark in the past as a solid, basic Bourbon. A note of caution though, they have recently lowered the age statement to 36 months so check the back label. If no age statement the bottle contains the 4 year old stuff.

[upStomp]

I am convinced that it is the yeast...

[Quantum]

As for Heaven Hill, I have really noticed it in the new Rittenhouse but never noticed it in the old stuff. (Now I'm glad I stockpiled several cases). May be like Phenylthiocarbamide...some people can taste it and some cannot. JMHO. PS: Just bought a bottle of Mastersons Barley and didn't notice it there.

Interesting thought. I don't know if it is genetics or repeated concussions, but I am extremely sensitive to most bitter flavors. I am told this would be very useful if I was at risk of being poisoned by having bitter toxins added to my food, but otherwise it is pretty much a negative. What most people taste as a slight bitterness that accompanies many heavily oaked bourbons, will just about knock me out. The upside is that I only have to use half the amount of bitters in a given cocktail, which probably saves me close to $10 a year.

I do know that I get a huge amount of musty grass/green tea from the new Rittenhouse. I find it enjoyable, but with a completely different flavor profile than the old stuff.