How much does it take?

[Flyfish]

Over the years, a number of SBers have suggested that the way to sample an unfamiliar bourbon is to go to a bar and order a shot. Or to buy a mini. Or a 375.

You fellows must hang out in really nice joints. I've never been in a bar where I could do any serious tasting. It is hard enough to find a bar keep who knows what "neat" means.

Then there is the volume issue. Some bourbons seem to benefit from being allowed to breathe for a while. Hard to let a mini catch its breath. A 375 might be capable of some shallow inhaling. My palate is slow to catch on. The bourbon might be truly wonderful but if my palate were off when I sampled the shot or the mini, I might never order it again. It takes me at least a half bottle before I can begin to "appreciate" a bourbon so I try to withhold judgment until I have given it a fair shot, so to speak. In the case of 4R YL and SmB, it took several bottles and several years. I kept coming back because I admire Jim Rutledge's work. If I had never heard of him and just tried a mini of YL, that would have been the end of that. Even now, I don't love those two but I can "appreciate" them.

So, how much bourbon or time do you need to reach a definitive conclusion?

[dcbt]

Not only do so few bars have any kind of selection to speak of, but when ordering a bourbon neat why must I get it in a shot glass? Huge pet peeve of mine.

[kjbeggs]

I hate being "that guy", but often find myself needing to specify "no ice" and pointing out a specific glass when ordering neat.

DCBT, I think a trip to Austin might be the best solution for our area...

[squire]

To start with I want to be on my own turf, in my favorite chair without distractions. I can tell right off whether I like it, really like it, or it's just ok. But I won't post or write a review until I've spent some time and thought on the matter. A few months and half a bottle sounds about right.

[TunnelTiger]

Just don't go out much at all anymore so all of mine testing is by buying a bottle, which so far has always been the 750 because smaller bottles just aren't available except in dozen or so familar brands.

If the first bottle is just meh all the way through I'll buy a another at a later date and give it another chance.

If it taste like horse p*ss from the first pour to the last nothing will get me to try it again no matter how many SB'ers rave about it (I really don't give credence to anyone not on this forum).

If it taste's like nirvanna when the first drops pass my lips I'm back to the store for as soon as I can for bunkering.

[squire]

Look on the bright side TT, if it's redolent of pasture products then you have something on hand for your brother in law.

[dcbt]

I hate being "that guy", but often find myself needing to specify "no ice" and pointing out a specific glass when ordering neat.

DCBT, I think a trip to Austin might be the best solution for our area...

Edited May 8, 2014 by dcbt

[Ishad]

I keep thinking a good bourbon bar (with a nice selection) would be right up Dallas' alley, what with all its $30,000 millionaires, old school money, new hedge fund money, etc, on top of the city's general bandwagon attitude. But Tried & True closed before I had even heard about it, and Nickel & Rye is almost always half empty... And that's about it as far as options go, jeez. Has Austin stepped it up? I haven't spent enough time there since I left 14 years ago.

[BonVivant84]

I always just buy a 750ml (if its like $65 and under). Like Flyfish noted sometimes you dont have the luxury of really letting it breath at a bar, so being able to do that over a period of time really help solidify my opinion on if i will be purchasing it again. How long does seem to vary from brand to brand for me though. FRSB, RHF were two that one glass in i knew I loved, but EC12 was one i had to sit with for at least half of my first bottle before i started craving the specific taste of it (when im feelin oakey!)

I have always had the opinion that even if its not going to become one of my go to sippers thats its not a waste of money by any stretch because you can always throw it in an old fashioned or a boulevardier and you've got something delicious. I've yet to have any rot gut so bad i've had to just dump it.

[Oboe Cadobro]

what with all its $30,000 millionaires

[dcbt]

What is a "$30,000 millionaire"? Is that somebody who bought high and sold low?

[sutton]

Phew ... I thought it was someone that made $30 trillion dollars ...

[Tony Santana]

I'm lucky enough to have access to at least a couple of bars that have a good selection, but honestly I rarely check them out. I don't go to bars that often anyway, and to me they usually aren't places to truly experience a fine bourbon, especially a new one, unless you're with some other people who are there for the exact same experience. My favorite bar is owned by a couple of buddies of mine. They're pretty pigheaded about what they sell, which if fine - it's their bar. I'm content to have a Knob Creek or a Makers Mark or a Bulleit Rye there. I know I'm not going to get any fancier than that, and that's fine. The bourbon is decent and the company is good, what more can I ask for?

The good: I rarely go into a place where the bartender doesn't know what "neat" means, or serves it up in a shot glass. The bad: I don't see 375's (or smaller) of anything but the big sellers, so if I want to try something new I either have to buy a 750 or find another way to try it.

I don't think I've ever later soured on something that tastes great from the first sip. But I tend to give everything at least a half bottle or so to "show me". Example - I didn't think much of Henry McKenna at first, but it grew on me and I came to appreciate it. On the other hand, if I get through a whole bottle and it's just "meh", I'm almost certainly not going to buy another one. I might try it again if it's available somewhere, just to see if my tastes have changed, but I'm not going to buy a bottle. There's too much good whiskey out there - heck, there's too much good whiskey in my basement - in whatever category one might want to consider (value pours, mid-shelfers, limited editions, whatever) to spend money on something I'm almost certain isn't ever going to wow me.

I keep a list of my whiskey. The categories - wish list, non-bourbon whiskeys, opened bourbons, unopened bourbons, and "drank it/gone". There's nothing in the latter list that I'll probably ever buy again.

[kjbeggs]

DFW is the Mecca for "$30K Millionaires". Guys who drive BMWs they can't really afford (even though they bought used), carry business cards for absolutely no reason, and pay way too much to live in the trendiest neighborhoods. They go to Pottery Barn to decorate with crap I could have tossed out of my father-in-law's workshop, shop at Central Market, and work out of Starbuck's when they aren't "in the office". - And they've "...heard Pappy is PHENOMENAL..."

[Zeke]

Howdy!

Living in a place with an even worse selection of Bourbon bars than Dallas. I usually get 2 750ml bottles of anything new (assuming I can afford it, your $65 bottles will cost me $100+ here) and then try it in a variety of ways (neat, ice, water, with friends, alone, etc). The second bottle then gets designated as either Great and gets saved for a special occasion to be shared with friends. Good/Alright and gets in line to be a bottle that I drink regularly. Or Crap and gets offloaded (read: traded) for something else.

[dSculptor]

I rarely/almost never go to bars, just not my thing. When going to a restaurant, the first place I’m looking is at the bourbon selection, if they have something I’ve never tried, I’ll order it … neat.

Otherwise when I go to my LLS I’m always looking to try a new one, and I’m buying a 750. I can tell usually right off the bat if it’s for me or not. Sometimes a bottle will take a bit longer to come to a conclusion, because it just didn’t strike me at first. Rarely have I found one that was just so bad I couldn’t drink it. A couple come to mind that are a bit slow to empty because I’m just not sure, so I keep going back to them and sometimes they taste better than the last…..1792, Wathens SB.

[squire]

I've yet to have any rot gut so bad i've had to just dump it.

I can say the same thing though I haven't tried Cleveland yet.

[dcbt]

What is a "$30,000 millionaire"?

Man, our search feature stinks, had to use google to find this thread. Now everyone can partake vicariously in Dallas' $30,000 millionaires:

http://popcultureblog.dallasnews.com/2014/07/30000-millionaires-wanted-for-reality-tv-show.html/

[smknjoe]

DFW is the Mecca for "$30K Millionaires". Guys who drive BMWs they can't really afford (even though they bought used), carry business cards for absolutely no reason, and pay way too much to live in the trendiest neighborhoods. They go to Pottery Barn to decorate with crap I could have tossed out of my father-in-law's workshop, shop at Central Market, and work out of Starbuck's when they aren't "in the office". - And they've "...heard Pappy is PHENOMENAL..."

Man, our search feature stinks, had to use google to find this thread. Now everyone can partake vicariously in Dallas' $30,000 millionaires:

http://popcultureblog.dallasnews.com/2014/07/30000-millionaires-wanted-for-reality-tv-show.html/

I thought you guys were describing Houston for a second. Especially, the following the "trend bandwagon" part.

[dcbt]

I thought you guys were describing Houston for a second. Especially, the following the "trend bandwagon" part.

Two city peas of a state pod. (Not that I think all of Texas is like this, to clarify.)

[smknjoe]

As for the OP...I can usually tell if I like a bourbon within 2 pours. Otherwise, I'm just acquiring a taste for it which I don't think I should have to do if it's any good. That's the main reason I don't drink scotch. If it was good it would be good right out of the bottle.

[garbanzobean]

I rarely make a final decision about a given whisky or bourbon until I am about a quarter or a third of the way through the bottle. Heck, I had to buy a second bottle of Four Roses Single Barrel and open that one before I finally decided that I absolutely loved it. A lot of whiskies (especially non-chill filtered ones) need a good bit of air time to open up before I really like them. I am absolutely not averse to trying samples or trying new things at bars (particularly Jack Rose), but I think a single drink of whisk(e)y in isolation from the rest of the bottle is often an inaccurate predictor of my enjoyment for that whisk(e)y if I were to purchase an entire bottle. Given that whiskies seem to taste better in the company of good friends, I tend to overestimate my enjoyment of them at bars. This has led to some disappointments at home (Willett Pot Still, Greenore 8, Ardbeg Uigeadail, Clynelish 14, and Tullamore D.E.W. Phoenix come to mind). On the other hand, I have had whiskies that I have disliked the first sip of turn out to be bottles I truly loved after some air time (Promise of Hope, OGD114, Port Charlotte, E.H. Taylor Single Barrel).

[nd2005]

What is a "$30,000 millionaire"? Is that somebody who bought high and sold low?

http://www.dallasobserver.com/2007-11-29/news/douchebags-in-the-mist/

Someone who spends a gross amount of money on consumables in an attempt to appear rich, when in reality they make more like 30K per year.

[smknjoe]

...I'll always give a bourbon I don't care for another shot on another date. Sometimes it works out and other times it doesn't. I still need to buy a third bottle of RHF to see if I like it. I'm not a believer in this "air time" theory unless you are talking about airtime in a glass. I have bottles that have been open for years that taste the same, or very close, to a newly opened bottle.

[garbanzobean]

I'm not a believer in this "air time" theory unless you are talking about airtime in a glass. I have bottles that have been open for years that taste the same, or very close, to a newly opened bottle.

It depends on the bottle for me. If I open a bottle and it tastes or smells off, I will leave the cork out for a few hours and try again later. Most of the time, it makes a considerable difference. Once that "opening up" period has run its course, I don't notice much in the way of change in my open bottles.

If it works for Ralfy, it works for me . . .