2014 Four Roses LE Single Barrel

[DBM]

Reviving this thread to talk, you know, about 2014 Four Roses LE Single Barrel.

Seems that very, very little showed up in WA. Very, very little has been available at retail and I haven't seen it at most bars either, but I know it's been in the distributor's warehouse for at least a month. Is anyone else noticing a strange sense that most of this release is simply missing? I get the feeling that Four Roses growing popularity is creating "bunkering" at the distributor level even before it reaches on-premise accounts now, a la PVW.

[HighInTheMtns]

This release is pretty small, compared to last year. Truth is, I love Four Roses but I'm not even considering a bottle of 2014 Single Barrel; it costs too much and there's so much great Four Roses available as private selections.

[jeffrey r]

This release is pretty small, compared to last year. Truth is, I love Four Roses but I'm not even considering a bottle of 2014 Single Barrel; it costs too much and there's so much great Four Roses available as private selections.

I feel the same way, and I can virtually guarantee that I won't even need to think about it, as I won't have any opportunity to pick this up. This year, I have been able to pick up private selections of OBSO and OBSK for under $50. IIRC, last year's SBLE was OBSK.

The OBSO I have is 104 proof, and I frankly don't love the profile. It's a little too floral for my taste. And the low proof for a barrel proofer bumps it down a notch as well. On the other hand, the OBSK I have is 118 proof, and is terrific. I can now see why OBSK is so highly regarded.

Bottom line, there is so much good Four Roses out there these days, that I simply won't go chasing the limited editions, or paying an arm and a leg for them.

[HighInTheMtns]

Last year's OBSK was really good, and I don't regret buying it, but for me, premium dollars are best saved for the Small Batch.

[Tony]

I will go the contrary and say that I really enjoyed the release this year. I know the OESF is not the favorite of the selections but I think Jim did a great job with the pick and I enjoy it on the front end, as it sits in my mouth and with an enjoyable finish.

Best regards, Tony

[suntour]

From chat with another member here it seems that only two stores got bottles to sell this year and of those neither made it to the shelf. Our state supposedly got 80 bottles. The rest went to bars. Sigh.

[dcbt]

From chat with another member here it seems that only two stores got bottles to sell this year and of those neither made it to the shelf. Our state supposedly got 80 bottles. The rest went to bars. Sigh.

Another example of why it would be nice to see our locations next to our posts....

[dcbt]

These still haven't hit Texas at all. Good thing I'm not in the Four Roses cult I suppose.

[jvd99]

This came and went in Chicago and not one bottle lasted more than a few minutes being off the truck. I was really looking forward to this year's release. In year's past, it was never difficult securing a bottle from Binny's or even smaller mom & pop shops. This year was different, crazed beast. First, my regular store that always sets LE's aside for me throughout the year didn't even get any. I next had to look to Binny's. Based on its BTAC and Pappy releases, which are 1 bottle per customer, I thought it might last long enough to get one. I just had to figure out which day it was arriving. For the past several weeks, I called and visited my local store 2 times per week on delivery day (this method has worked for me in the past for Pappy/BTAC releases). Every time, they said they didn't get it in. Last week, they said the expected it in, so I was there - nothing. Yesterday, I call and the guy says its on his sheet for that day. I promptly drive over only to be told that it came in last week (2 bottles) and it's gone. I also called numerous other Binny's in the past 2 weeks and each said it never not come in. So yesterday, I call around again, and everyone says it came in last week and is gone. Simply put, I'm not feeling the love for Binny's at the moment because there was clearly confusion, poor inventory tracking or just flat out lying going on.

[DBM]

This came and went in Chicago and not one bottle lasted more than a few minutes being off the truck. I was really looking forward to this year's release. In year's past, it was never difficult securing a bottle from Binny's or even smaller mom & pop shops. This year was different, crazed beast. First, my regular store that always sets LE's aside for me throughout the year didn't even get any. I next had to look to Binny's. Based on its BTAC and Pappy releases, which are 1 bottle per customer, I thought it might last long enough to get one. I just had to figure out which day it was arriving. For the past several weeks, I called and visited my local store 2 times per week on delivery day (this method has worked for me in the past for Pappy/BTAC releases). Every time, they said they didn't get it in. Last week, they said the expected it in, so I was there - nothing. Yesterday, I call and the guy says its on his sheet for that day. I promptly drive over only to be told that it came in last week (2 bottles) and it's gone. I also called numerous other Binny's in the past 2 weeks and each said it never not come in. So yesterday, I call around again, and everyone says it came in last week and is gone. Simply put, I'm not feeling the love for Binny's at the moment because there was clearly confusion, poor inventory tracking or just flat out lying going on.

If it makes you feel any better, my story about trying to track down the delivery at retail is almost identical to yours. Lots of confusion, misinformation from the retailers who said "not here yet, not here yet" then "oh it was here last week, already gone". Supposedly it arrived on a day that I was in the store, in the morning, asking about deliveries from the FR distributor and being told they didn't deliver that day. Retailers, especially large ones, have zero incentive to acknowledge customers who appear to know more than they do about their products, especially "behind the scenes" activities. I believe a lot of employees and managers resent customers like that and go out of their way to ignore us.

[garbanzobean]

I am guessing a lot more of this year's release got snapped up by restaurants trying to ride the bourbon boom than last year's, which was supposedly smaller. Oh well.

[squire]

Well I guess from a distributor's viewpoint a sale is a sale no matter who gets it and the restaurants are repeat volume customers.

[DBM]

Well I guess from a distributor's viewpoint a sale is a sale no matter who gets it and the restaurants are repeat volume customers.

Can't argue with that. It's just unfortunate that Four Roses has fallen into the same category as BTAC and PVW - these aren't popular labels for retailers anyway, the effort to sell them is usually more trouble than the margin they make on a few bottles here and there. On the other hand, on-premise accounts will fight tooth and nail to get a bottle of hyped-up premium spirits, and distributors use these bottles as leverage to sell other products into an account, especially lower end brands.

Now that Four Roses LE bottles are getting as much attention as BTAC and PVW, the distributors will hold on to them and sell most to on-premise accounts as carrots.

Sad but true.

[garbanzobean]

Well I guess from a distributor's viewpoint a sale is a sale no matter who gets it and the restaurants are repeat volume customers.

Yeah, I can't say I blame them. I had planned on passing on this release anyway, and the thread(s) here make me glad I didn't even bother. Of course I am happy to let any Maryland folks know if I see a bottle or two lying around . . .

I have seen one case where a liquor store hoarded the majority of the limited releases from throughout the year and released small batches of them quarterly in special events (one limited item per customer). I noticed a lot of people who lost out on the BTAC or PVW rush in the first few minutes of the morning walking away happily, bottles of store select bourbons and other less limited items in hand. Seemed like a good way to use low-profit releases like BTAC to boost sales of other stuff. I was impressed with the tactic, and the participants certainly seemed to be enjoying themselves (I bought scotch).

Edited July 3, 2014 by garbanzobean

[Auracom]

Last year I experienced firsthand a Binny's floor manager lying to me in-person about PVW being available in their very own store, at the exact moment I asked about it. I told them I wouldn't leave until the bottles arrived. 20 minutes later I saw another customer checking out with a PVW15 in-hand, and only when I pointed it out to the manager did she fess up and have an employee grab one for me from the back. I'm quite certain that had that other guy not visibly walked out with a bottle, they would never have said a word to me.

I get lying over the phone to avoid a rush of people, but straight to my face when I'm standing in your store?

Edit - I realize I'm complaining in this post even though I succeeded in getting a bottle, but I'm not happy that 1) the manager was an ass, and 2) I had to be an ass right back in order to succeed. It turned what-should-have-been an exciting moment into frustration both at the store and myself. Shit like that makes me not want to bother hunting anymore, which is exactly why I avoided trying for this 4R release.

Edited July 3, 2014 by Auracom

[Tony Santana]

I got a bottle. My (so far) rock solid/I'll set aside a bottle for you guy came through, and for that I am grateful. I've never even seen a Four Roses barrel pick in Wisconsin, but I am becoming a cultist so anything I can grab beyond the basic single barrel is a score. Another place where I shop on occasion said they got two bottles. They did a lottery system - I didn't win, but so be it, I at least view that process as fair. Put my name on a list at another big local retailer, where I make a fair number of purchases, they claimed it hadn't hit town yet (this was a couple of days after I already scored my one bottle) and I never got a call. Either they never got any - which seems odd given their volume - or they blew me off. Am unaware of anyone else getting any, but that doesn't mean they didn't.

[mbroo5880i]

Can't argue with that. It's just unfortunate that Four Roses has fallen into the same category as BTAC and PVW - these aren't popular labels for retailers anyway, the effort to sell them is usually more trouble than the margin they make on a few bottles here and there. On the other hand, on-premise accounts will fight tooth and nail to get a bottle of hyped-up premium spirits, and distributors use these bottles as leverage to sell other products into an account, especially lower end brands.

Now that Four Roses LE bottles are getting as much attention as BTAC and PVW, the distributors will hold on to them and sell most to on-premise accounts as carrots.

Sad but true.

What I hope doesn't happen (much like with PVW/WL12) is that LEs will become so hyped up that the pent up demand trickles down to barrel selects and standard products, as distributors, retailers, and bartenders tell everyone they are the same thing.

[bicktrav]

Yeah, this year's release was completely insane. I had the same experience as many here: stores telling me they still hadn't gotten it, then calling the next day and hearing, it came and went a week ago. I think it's possible that certain unscrupulous employees are snatching them up to resell aftermarket, or the more upright of them may just be snatching them up for themselves or friends. I also think the explosion of whiskey bars is contributing to the problem, not to mention standard restaurants just looking to better their bourbon lists. Whatever the reason, the end result is that now the FR LE's are not any different in scarcity from PVW or BTAC. At least the private barrel selections are still around. And let's be honest, they are pretty darn comparable in quality to the Single Barrel LE. But the Small Batch LE don't have comparable alternatives, so I shudder to to think of what this year's release is going to be like.

[MauiSon]

If they only sold 'em out of the Gift Shops (or the lion's share, at least), then no one would have to worry about dem darn distributor/retailer antics.

[i can say that because distribution to Hawaii is either nonexistent or miniscule.]

Edited July 3, 2014 by MauiSon

[Chi-Town]

I don't see what the big deal is, I got 6 and live in Chicago.

Yall just too slow!

I totally kid...

[jvd99]

Last year I experienced firsthand a Binny's floor manager lying to me in-person about PVW being available in their very own store, at the exact moment I asked about it. I told them I wouldn't leave until the bottles arrived. 20 minutes later I saw another customer checking out with a PVW15 in-hand, and only when I pointed it out to the manager did she fess up and have an employee grab one for me from the back. I'm quite certain that had that other guy not visibly walked out with a bottle, they would never have said a word to me.

I get lying over the phone to avoid a rush of people, but straight to my face when I'm standing in your store?.

I was in the store the day they claim it came in and that's what really pisses me off. Flat out lying IMO - not until a week later was I told the actual day it came in. Binny's sucks right now in my house.

[P&MLiquorsEric]

Make sure you are speaking with a manager who does ordering when asking about releases.

And I will say that truck chasers are very frustrating to a retailer. When something comes in, we can't just scan it and sell it. It has to be entered into inventory and priced. So do the other hundreds of cases that are on the same truck. Oftentimes we might not be able to enter the items into our POS until later that day or the next.

I feel your pain about the 4R limited. 4 bottles for us and we have purchased 6 barrels in past year.

[theglobalguy]

I feel your pain about the 4R limited. 4 bottles for us and we have purchased 6 barrels in past year.

[Restaurant man]

Well I guess from a distributor's viewpoint a sale is a sale no matter who gets it and the restaurants are repeat volume customers.

Actually the package stores buy a lot more than restaurants. And they buy on volume across all sizes of bottles. Minis, liters, 750, handles, gift packs, 375's where restaurants but one size only. The reason brands like to

be "on premise" (restaurants) is because that is where people get exposed to brands they might not be familiar with. It's easier to take the plunge trying 1 drink of something vs buying the whole bottle. Plus four roses gets in front of 10 or so customers with a single bottle vs 1 person in a retail store or less if we are dealing with hoarders or the flipper types that shut down the last four roses 2014 thread.

I am guessing a lot more of this year's release got snapped up by restaurants trying to ride the bourbon boom than last year's, which was supposedly smaller. Oh well.

Distributors make that call bean. It's all split up before we place our orders.

[squire]

Actually the package stores buy a lot more than restaurants. And they buy on volume across all sizes of bottles.

Oh I agree, I'm sure they do, my point was the distributors make the call over who gets what of the high end stuff.