OYO Bourbon Whiskey Michelone Reserve

[bllygthrd]

My son-in-law brought over a bottle of OYO Bourbon Whiskey Michelone Reserve today to try. Looked at other posts on the board and didn't see any reviews posted.

I was a bit skeptical ... not a straight bourbon, no age statement, from Ohio, and an opaque bottle. I generally avoid liqour in opaque bottles. Its from Middle West Spirits in Columbus, OH. 90 proof and states "a small batch whiskey that pairs the finest Kentucky straight bourbon with our award winning OYO Whiskey. Ohio's finest 100% wheat whiskey produced in nearly a century."

The nose is sweet with no hint of alcohol at all. The initial taste is sweet ... very sweet. Not like caramel, brown sugar or maple syrup ... just sweet, and simple. I was expecting it to taste young, it didn't. The finish is sweet also. Not an unenjoyable pour, but the sweetness was a bit overpowering. At ~$40 ... doubt I'll but one for the stash.

It did pair well with my Gurkha Park Avenue 44 though ...

[jankdc]

[ATTACH=CONFIG]19062[/ATTACH]

My son-in-law brought over a bottle of OYO Bourbon Whiskey Michelone Reserve today to try. Looked at other posts on the board and didn't see any reviews posted.

I was a bit skeptical ... not a straight bourbon, no age statement, from Ohio, and an opaque bottle. I generally avoid liqour in opaque bottles. Its from Middle West Spirits in Columbus, OH. 90 proof and states "a small batch whiskey that pairs the finest Kentucky straight bourbon with our award winning OYO Whiskey. Ohio's finest 100% wheat whiskey produced in nearly a century."

The nose is sweet with no hint of alcohol at all. The initial taste is sweet ... very sweet. Not like caramel, brown sugar or maple syrup ... just sweet, and simple. I was expecting it to taste young, it didn't. The finish is sweet also. Not an unenjoyable pour, but the sweetness was a bit overpowering. At ~$40 ... doubt I'll but one for the stash.

It did pair well with my Gurkha Park Avenue 44 though ...

If it tastes that sweet and it doesn't say "straight", then they added sugar to it.

[smokinjoe]

If it tastes that sweet and it doesn't say "straight", then they added sugar to it.

Sounds like you're stating this as "fact". Something else you know about this product? Or, just based on Bllygthrd's review?

[chrisg]

So they mixed Kentucky bourbon with their own wheat whiskey? MGP?

[jmj_203]

Sounds like you're stating this as "fact". Something else you know about this product? Or, just based on Bllygthrd's review?

We don't ever get full info on bourbons, something I've learned getting really into sipping whiskey the last year. Maybe we need some additional oversight into the industry. I don't want more, but I'd love to have a requirement for any additives listed on the label. Do not want FDA type oversight though.

[squire]

Well we do have some safeguards, if it's labeled Straight Bourbon it doesn't contain additives, also Bottled in Bond which actually has some restrictions on how it's made. This is why I'm leery of a distillery rep saying straight and BIB are outdated terms.

[jankdc]

Sounds like you're stating this as "fact". Something else you know about this product? Or, just based on Bllygthrd's review?

[flahute]

If it doesn't say straight on it they can put 2.5% by volume of other stuff including sugar, caramel, fruit juice, flavoring, oak extract and more. The only reason to not use the term straight is to put this stuff in there. So, while I'm basing it on Bllygthrd's review, if it tastes sweet, and it's not straight, then there's sugar in there.

[jankdc]

Not necessarily. Says it's a mixture of Kentucky Straight Bourbon and wheat whiskey. They can't call it straight legally because of the mixture of bourbon and wheat whiskey. Wheat whiskey is pretty sweet is it not?

[callmeox]

This seems to be another TTB failure as the class/type is bourbon whiskey, the label states blended bourbon among other things.

The end product of adding wheat whiskey to bourbon isn't bourbon. This is similar to the Four Kings "bourbon" that Binny's sold from the collaborating micro-distilleries. OYO even calls it a four grain bourbon on the label which is incorrect.

Overall, it's a confusing label. It mentions all of these items in a small space:

Bourbon Whiskey (front label)

Blended Bourbon Whiskey (front label)

Kentucky Straight Bourbon (back label)

Wheat Whiskey (back label)

How the heck is the consumer supposed to know what is in the bottle?

Also, leaving straight off of the label doesn't allow you to put in sweeteners, coloring, etc. To do that, you need to call it Bourbon with __________ or it needs to be labeled as a blend.

As far as what is in the bottle? Only OYO knows.

[jankdc]

Also, leaving straight off of the label doesn't allow you to put in sweeteners, coloring, etc. To do that, you need to call it Bourbon with __________ or it needs to be labeled as a blend.

As far as what is in the bottle? Only OYO knows.

[squire]

Ok, given the most generous interpretation it contains a little of all the whiskys listed on the label which sounds like a mish mash of stuff designed to be produced cheaply because they can change the mix anytime using whatever is on hand.

And no, wheat whisky isn't sweet. No grains in the mashbill are going to distill out sweet because the yeast converts the grain sugars into alcohol. The sweetness comes from barrel sugars leached out during aging or by adding sweetners (sugar, sweet wines, prune juice, etc.) to the finished product.

[tanstaafl2]

I certainly don't know for sure what is in it but it does appear to be yet another massive fail by the TTB in terms of labeling. The website implies it is just sourced straight bourbon and their own 100% wheat whiskey blended together (I would guess a relatively small amount of their own make). I would doubt there is anything else in it but as noted only OYO knows for sure.

Sweetness is a relative term and while unaged white dog may not have any sugar left in it doesn't anything aged in a new barrel acquire some sugar over time (which is part of the point of aging it)? Charring breaks down the Xylan in the wood into Xylose and brings those wood sugars to the surface where they can mingle with the whiskey.

[callmeox]

Sure it does. See this. Also, there is blended bourbon in it, so the sweetener can be put in that blend before it's blended with the rest.

The class type is bourbon whiskey.

Where in your interpretation of the CFR is the statement that bourbon whiskey can have added flavoring, coloring, etc?

[jankdc]

The class type is bourbon whiskey.

Where in your interpretation of the CFR is the statement that bourbon whiskey can have added flavoring, coloring, etc?

From their website:

our generations of distilling traditions and one particularly determined grandfather inspired Middle West Spirits’ first Master’s Blend.

From §5.22 The standards of identity.

(4) “Blended whisky†(whisky—a blend) is a mixture which contains straight whisky or a blend of straight whiskies at not less than 20 percent on a proof gallon basis, excluding alcohol derived from added harmless coloring, flavoring or blending materials, and, separately, or in combination, whisky or neutral spirits. A blended whisky containing not less than 51 percent on a proof gallon basis of one of the types of straight whisky shall be further designated by that specific type of straight whisky; for example, “blended rye whisky†(rye whisky—a blend).

From §5.23 Alteration of class and type.

(a) Additions. (1) The addition of any coloring, flavoring, or blending materials to any class and type of distilled spirits, except as otherwise provided in this section, alters the class and type thereof and the product shall be appropriately redesignated.

(2) There may be added to any class or type of distilled spirits, without changing the class or type thereof, (i) such harmless coloring, flavoring, or blending materials as are an essential component part of the particular class or type of distilled spirits to which added, and (ii) harmless coloring, flavoring, or blending materials such as caramel, straight malt or straight rye malt whiskies, fruit juices, sugar, infusion of oak chips when approved by the Administrator, or wine, which are not an essential component part of the particular distilled spirits to which added, but which are customarily employed therein in accordance with established trade usage, if such coloring, flavoring, or blending materials do not total more than 21⁄2 percent by volume of the finished product.

(3) “Harmless coloring, flavoring, and blending materials†shall not include (i) any material which would render the product to which it is added an imitation, or (ii) any material, other than caramel, infusion of oak chips, and sugar, in the case of Cognac brandy; or (iii) any material whatsoever in the case of neutral spirits or straight whiskey, except that vodka may be treated with sugar in an amount not to exceed 2 grams per liter and a trace amount of citric acid.

Important to note: straight whiskey can not have any sugar, coloring, or additive in it. A blended whiskey can have 2.5% additives like sugar in it. This is (as they call it) a master blended bourbon whiskey.

So let me state that I could be wrong. I have never tasted OYO Michelone Reserve. I have not had it tested for sugar. Nor did I contact the company. So, I wrote them an email before posting this and will put any replies if I get one. I expect that it will be like my experience with Firestone & Robertson Distilling, they will just ignore my email.

[bllygthrd]

Hopefully you can read these ...

I thought it might be helpful if I uploaded copies of both the front and back labels.

[callmeox]

The class type is bourbon whiskey, not blended bourbon or bourbon, a blend. We know that it is not classified properly as they declare that there is wheat whiskey in the bottle as well.

https://www.ttbonline.gov/colasonline/viewColaDetails.do?action=publicDisplaySearchBasic&ttbid=14035001000487

Again, we don't know what is really in the bottle because the TTB has it mis-classified.

The TTB beverage alcohol manual says that harmless color, flavor and blending materials are not permitted in the bourbon whiskey class/type (along with every straight whiskey class/type)

http://www.ttb.gov/spirits/bam/chapter7.pdf

So the assertion that only straight whisky is void of coloring/flavoring is incorrect. The additives are not permitted in the bourbon whiskey class/type either.

[jankdc]

Callmeox,

Great links and research. Thanks. I'll let you know if I hear back from Oyo.

[callmeox]

Callmeox,

Great links and research. Thanks. I'll let you know if I hear back from Oyo.

Good luck. I traded a number of emails with them when they opened. They stopped responding when I asked how their vodka had distinctive flavors when the regs say that it must be without distinctive character, flavor or aroma. [emoji2]

[jankdc]

I was wrong. Here is the response from OYO. My apologies for slandering the company:

Greetings Michael,

Thank you for your message… and the heads up on the misinformation posted on the message board you referenced in your email. We can assure you that all of our whiskeys are produced with nothing more than whiskey distilate and white american oak barrels — the true measure of a world class product. The balanced sweetness you taste in our whiskeys and bourbons is the result of proper mashing, fermentation, distillation and barrel aging techniques… balanced by the experienced palate of our master distiller. Glycerins and coloring agents are traditionally added by some producers to mask inferior production techniques… none of which are used in the production of our award winning spirits.

Thanks again for the opportunity to respond, and please don’t hesitate to reach out directly if you have any questions about our products in the future.

All the best,

Brady Konya

General Manager | Owner

MIddle West Spirits

614-299-2460 main

206-947-3792 cell

614-299-2270 fax

brady.konya@middlewestspirits.com

www.middlewestspirits.com

www.facebook.com/middlewestspirits

www.twitter.com/middlewestspts

Here is my email to them:

I may be slandering you: Can you clear something up.

A review on a discussion board stated that your Michelone Reserve Bourbon was very sweet and I stated that since it didn't say straight on the label and that it tasted sweet that there had to have been sugar/fruit juice or other additive to sweeten it up. It would be either added by you or by your supplier for the whiskey that you blend in it. Can you confirm or deny any additions. If I am wrong, I will print your response with a profound apology and edit all of my posts to reflect my mistake.

Thank you.

[jankdc]

OK, so it seems that I am unable to edit my earlier posts. Too much time must have passed. Can an admin post this into at the very least my first post?

Please note that I was wrong in my accusation that OYO added sugar to their whiskey. I regret posting not only this opinion without trying to contact the distiller, but also the tone of the accusation. You can read their reply to my email here.

Finally, thank you callmeox. I had never seen the TTB beverage alcohol manual and it clears up many confusions that I had.

Edited August 2, 2014 by jankdc

[Jazzhead]

I think this is quite decent stuff, a sweet-tasting bourbon of uncommon balance and quaffability. It's funny how what's taken for granted in Scotland - the blending tradition - makes bourbon drinkers uncomfortable. In Scotland, there's no demand to know the specific make-up of the blend, it's accepted that that's part of the blender's art and skill.

What OYO is doing reminds me of Smooth Ambler's recent "Contradiction" release. Both are craft distillers, coping with the problem endemic to their breed - how does one stay afloat while waiting for stocks of whiskey to mature? Each is blending their young whiskey - in OYO's case, a wheat whiskey not labeled as a straight (and, therefore, I assume, less than two years old) - with a mature straight bourbon. High West also blends together very young and fully mature whiskies, in their "Double Rye". But with High West, both components are sourced whiskies.

I don't think there's anything wrong with this approach. Blending takes taste, skill and knowledge. This isn't just buying some Barton barrels and pouring it into fancy bottle with the name of Kentucky horse farm. I think this is legit, and asks to be judged on its own merit. As such, it's pretty fair tipple.

Edited July 9, 2015 by Jazzhead

[squire]

It's funny how what's taken for granted in Scotland - the blending tradition - makes bourbon drinkers uncomfortable.

Oh I'm quite comfortable with the idea which in fact I think is a good one. The Scottish model has been copied all over the World (Ireland, Canada, Japan, India, Malaysia) and should certainly work here presuming a good product. Marketing would have some hurdles to overcome with the pejorative connotations attached to American Blends generally but the process could produce a fine product.

[Harry in WashDC]

Maybe if we bourbon persons called it something other than blending. I know: vatting.:cool:

Edited July 9, 2015 by Harry in WashDC
addded a w to e. sheesh fat fingers

[squire]

Melding, mingling, several terms are out there and they are accurate as well as more pleasing. Should be an artful way around the labeling requirements.