Raiding a liquor store's backroom....am I in the wrong here?

[bin31z]

I had a really bad encounter today with a particular store. This is a large supermarket/liquor store that I frequent often when I'm in that area for work. I buy lunch there, dinner there, breakfast, coffee etc. It is my favorite because it is alot like a whole foods and has some really good fresh food and I probably spend at least 30 bucks there a day. One of the things that draws me there is sometimes I get some good bourbon. They have this small glass display where they their more expensive stuff. I buy prolly 500 bucks worth of bourbon here a year, usually visit twice a year for work. On this visit, I saw that they had a bottle of four roses single barrel 2014 in there. I asked the cashier if there were more of them in the back or something because I'm a big fan of the 2013 but did not get more than 1 bottle (traded one away). He said they might and he'll take a look. He came back and said he couldn't find any, I asked him if I can go take a look. It turns out "in the back" is the wine/spirts manager's private little office area where he keeps the more expensive stuff locked away. The store doesn't want employees or patrons to wander in and steal something so that door has a lock on it. So I went in and found another 2 and a CEHTBP and I took them and checked out and was really happy.

The next day when I went back, one of the employees came up to me and goes..."hey...i'm the wine/spirits manager and that's real cute what you did on monday" I said excuse me? He said "you are NEVER going into my office again, this is the last time, don't you EVER go back there again. I was saving a bottle for a customer. Don't EVER *pointing finger at me* go back there again." I was a little dumbstruck and said..ok...

So am I in the wrong here? I am planning on trading at least one of the bottles that I got from him to a friend. This is a large store, not a privately owned one, bigger than most whole foods/trade joe's. The wine/spirits manager is just a employee, not an owner. He is not buying the stuff with his own money but with the companies. Now, I'm sure I could have had a chat with his general manager and raised all kinds of hell because in the end, they just want to sell goods, not act as his personal storehouse for bottles he's holding for his friends, but I didn't. And if he's office is supposed to be a private place, it seems odd that everyone has access to the keys. I went back into that store and basically gave him this talk. I did not steal from you, employees of this store gave me access to your office, you are an employee of this company and not entitled to restrict company inventory for your personal gain, you had no right to talk to me (a customer) in this manner. He didn't really apologize but kinda blew me off and I walked out in a huff but didn't really try to make his life miserable. I noticed he was out of earshot of other employees purposely before he ranted at me.

[393foureyedfox]

i can see both sides of it, but he did react pretty poorly for a manager. I think Id just let it go, unless he acted out like that again.

[oke&coke]

I would have said forget you and walked off. You did nothing wrong. If he didn't want it sold then he should have marked it or left it somewhere that other employees couldn't have grabbed it.

[BourbonGuy]

My 2 cents....It isn't relevant that you spend money there. You make that choice and some may spend more or less. I feel the issue is did you do something wrong by purchasing the bourbon. In my opinion, the wine spirits manager has an issue with employee training. I work in a lab and my staff knows better than to go into my office and remove items. If his office is restricted to either the store employees or customers, his policy should be clear.

When you go back and asked to take a look a properly trained employee should have replied, "I'm sorry. We do not allow customers in the back."

BTW, if you have a office and one of your employees let a customer into your office, and that person removed items, how would you feel?

I agree with 393, the managers reaction was out of liine. A better way to handle this would have been to explain to you the polidy is customers are not allowed in the back to prevent this from reoccuring and then inservice is employees.

[Auracom]

The fault is primarily on employee #1 letting you go in the back. That being said... I consider it an unwritten rule that if a retailer doesn't put certain bottles on the shelf, it's done so for a reason. I would never ask or attempt to go into the back storeroom of my local places. It's way over-zealous and holding back bottles for other customers is a legitimate excuse. Just go with the flow and don't piss people off. Nothing is worth blacklisting yourself. That's my strategy.

[petrel800]

Count me as you are 100% in the wrong here. The fact that you are asking here for people to "back you up" indicates to me that you know you are in the wrong here. Whether you like how a store sells their stuff or not, you are not entitled to buy someones property even if it's a "soulless big chain." If you don't like a store's or manager's policy, shop somewhere else or talk with their boss. I've worked retail before, most everyone has keys to access most areas if you have any authority. That didn't give me the right to go rooting around in the directors office just cause I had access.

Seriously, you're probably a good guy and I've never met you, but, come on man, digging around in another man's office you don't know for a few bottles of LE bourbon. You had to know that wasn't going to go over well when you went back in there.

[Xevious]

Not sure anything else needs to be said. The manager may have gone about it wrong, but I understand why he's mad. Holding items for customers is common in retail. I for one would be pissed if I was expecting to purchase said item only to find out that somebody else went into the back and took it before I could pick it up.

[garbanzobean]

I think blaming the OP is kind of ridiculous. Asking to "look in the back" is a pretty common tactic SBers seem to use, though I can't say I've done it. Usually "in the back" is a warehouse, not some dude's office. I guess the OP could have said "never mind" as soon as he realized it was an office, but generally if an employee of a store gives me permission to do something, I assume it is okay for me to do.

If the wine and spirits manager wanted to prevent the problem in the future, he should train his employees on his policy. And potentially speak to the OP about it, but more politely.

To the OP: if this was a store I cared about maintaining a long term relationship with, I would offer to return the items even if the spirits person is acting like a tool. Sometimes a kind offer is enough to calm people down. Worst case scenario, you earn some good karma.

Edited December 19, 2014 by garbanzobean

[Enoch]

I had the same thing happen to me at K****r. I complained to the corporate office and got a gift card. The manager got fired. (I'm sure he was the recipient of numerous complaints before me.) I was also in Total Wine recently and asked if they had gotten in some Parker's 13-year Wheat. The employee said it was in the system but didn't know why it wasn't out. Another employee said he knew where the manager had hidden it, so she said get it because corporate policy is that customers come first. She said the manager was probably saving it for himself which is not allowed if customers want it. I ended up with 2 bottles.

[The Black Tot]

Agree the employee was wrong to let you in there in the first place, but if you can see special bottles being held back in a manager's office, it should click, especially with an experienced hand like yourself, that said manager has a plan for them. You put your own interests first, plainly disregarded and scuttled his plan, and you put him in a spot with three customers whom he has already told "I've saved you a special bottle for being a loyal customer". So yeah, I'd be pissed with you, too.

Then you came back in and gave him the customer is always right talk, and told him he is but a pawn in his organization which exists to serve you, and told him what he can and can't do managing his department? Now you're kind of double in the wrong. You already raided his locked office, dude. Are you going to key his car next?

Would I as a manager confront you like that? No, I'd call that my mistake for not having my employees properly trained, and chalk it up as a lesson. But you definitely screwed up his day with your actions, and then gave him a talking to about how he has no right to express his anger.

Another aspect you haven't touched on yet is that the employee you convinced to let you back there probably got an epic ass-chewing for your benefit. You don't seem to be too bothered about that either.

Consider that your own description of this mission in the subject title uses the word "Raiding". When is the word raiding ever attributed to a justifiable act?

The whiskey hobby is supposed to be about fun - not maximum exploitation with total disregard for any and all collateral damage. Take a deep breath and ask if whiskey is really worth being the proverbial "that guy".

Just my opinion (you asked ), written in the spirit of friendly debate

[ThirstyinOhio]

I think the blame is with employee number 1 or the lack of training he received. He obviously shouldn't have let you back there, but since he did, I don't fault you for buying the bourbon. I also think that the manager was wrong in talking to you like that. I don't have a problem with him telling you that you shouldn't have gone back there and to please not put an employee into that situation by asking to go back there again. The only problem I have with you is your assumption that you were entitled to those bottles. The manager has every right to hold inventory for other customers if he feels it will improve customer relations with high spenders. I'm not knocking your spending habits, but $500 in booze over a year is likely to be a very small amount compared to some other buyers and maybe he was trying to reward those other guys and I'm sure corporate would support him doing so.

[The Black Tot]

Not sure anything else needs to be said. The manager may have gone about it wrong, but I understand why he's mad. Holding items for customers is common in retail. I for one would be pissed if I was expecting to purchase said item only to find out that somebody else went into the back and took it before I could pick it up.

This happened to Mrs Tot and myself just two weeks ago. We lost our 4RSmBLE, as it happens

[T Comp]

. The store doesn't want employees or patrons to wander in and steal something so that door has a lock on it.

What's the debate? If I was the manager I'd of had you arrested for convincing a lowly cashier to unlock the door and then trespass.

[dSculptor]

I would have to agree with TBT here, I have a few contacts, and have never asked any of them to look in the back, I know there are people out there that do, and there is nothing wrong with that, but the fact that someone else let you in to someone else's office, after you asked to take a look... after they told you there was none to be had, is kind of "balsy" in the first place. Then when you did gain entry and found these bottles it never crossed your mind that these were there for a reason? That is one reason I get what I get, because of people like that.. that put certain bottles aside for people like me. Bottom line ..... it's really not worth it.

[michaelturtle1]

if I am getting access to the back room of a liquor store it is with the owner or manager, it has never ended well when a random employee let me poke around. Maintaining relationships with a store is way better than having an extra bottle of a LE to trade to a friend.

[ramblinman]

Yeah, not to pile on, but if an employee offers to go look in the back for me I'll take them up on it in but seems a bit forward to ask.

[TunnelTiger]

This happened to Mrs Tot and myself just two weeks ago. We lost our 4RSmBLE, as it happens

Happened to me with a Handy. An employee sold my bottle while my dealer was out to lunch. The employee got a last and final warning.

[kjbeggs]

The store I buy almost exclusively at now, has a small area where they keep most of their allocated stuff. The owner has taken me back there to look several times (usually he has bottles set aside for me in there).

If he has promised someone one of those bottles, they almost always have a note on them.

All his employees also know not to sell anything out of that room without his OK.

Most of the people who work there know me, and have (hesitantly) let me take a look "in the back" when the owner was not there, but with the stipulation they could not sell me anything out of there until he gave the OK.

The manager should not have spoken to you the way he did. I'm sure he heard about it from a disappointed customer when his promised bottle was gone, and took it out on you, which is never the right thing to do.

[bin31z]

Well there you have it. I guess I was being too aggressive. Lesson learned. But yea, I mean, maybe I'm kind of disillusioned but I work at a CPA office and I pretty well understand that our clients are always right. There are plenty of time when I'm "in the right" but if a client had a problem, I solve it no matter whose fault it is. I would never dream of talking to a client in any accusatory tone. I've had my partners take things from my office before, but I always thought that it is his business and I just work there. Honestly, if I was a general manager, I would give this employee a hard time. We are in the business of selling things so out there out there to be sold, you don't see the guy in the fruits section holding back apples. I think his problem with me is that he likes to have stuff in stock and doesn't like the fact I bought it all. These limited bottles honestly don't move in that area, they just don't have the clientele for it.

[bin31z]

Btw, I did not ask a random employee, it was the customer service manager that was on duty. The wine/spirits guy wasn't working that day.

[bin31z]

What's the debate? If I was the manager I'd of had you arrested for convincing a lowly cashier to unlock the door and then trespass.

Lol. I'm the state/federal auditor for the city. Pretty sure I'm not going to arrested for looking in a storeroom with permission from the on site customer services manager.

[AaronWF]

No harm in asking. If the answer is no, fine. If someone lets you in, that's on them, not you.

[bin31z]

But honestly, this whole situation at that store and also the whole environment around bourbon lately has me looking elsewhere for distilled needs. I remember when store manager were happy to sell you stuff to clear out their inventory. Even in 2012, I remember the single barrel Frle was pretty much pushed on me by the owner. To have to deal with this ordeal and have all these upset feelings just because I want to BUY something from a STORE, you know, a place full of stuff to sell, really had me questioning if these limited editions are even worth hunting for anymore.

[The Black Tot]

You're not being accurate about the situation with the above language.

Those bottles weren't out on the shelf, waiting to be sold. They were reserved in a locked back office for someone else. To be sold, to people who had just as much right to purchase them as you did, if not more, because they had worked out their agreement with the manager.

Also, you are playing down the fact that you already got yours - the first one, that was on the shelf for your purchase. What you wanted was to get yours, and then get two more plus a CEHT for your own trades.

You aren't being vilified for purchasing goods for sale, you are being called out for purchasing other people's earmarked goods out from under them, not satisfied with the limited that was already made available to you for purchase. You got yours, and then three other people's, and yet you still see the situation primarily as that you were victimized by the manager's displeasure

Edited December 19, 2014 by The Black Tot

[brettckeen]

I'd say all three of you are wrong.