Barrel Proof Straight Whiskey: Air & Water

[Louisiana]

 

 

Straight Bourbon discusses the impact of Air & Water on Whiskey very broadly. ECBP introduced me to a whole new League of Whiskey. I really enjoyed Barrel Proofer's neat and refused to add anything to these "Pure Beast". I had several bottles open up with airtime & improve at the recommendation of fellow SB'ers. So I did what some wouldn't dream of... If the bottle was still hot after airtime, I added water and understood the positive impact of toning down some of them. For my palate usually anything up to 120 doesn't need anything & some over 140 still don't. What I've learned is Air & Water can be your best friend. Not Always, but Sometimes! Most long time members know this stuff already, but this may help someone else on here. It's hard to let a bottle sit there, but being patient can pay off! A little bit of water can go a long way!

 

The collection has grown since that first botlle. My knowledge has also broadened. Or at least I think it has...

The one that stands up to these, but has a little water added is KC120.

 

-ECBP

-GTS

-WLW

-THH

-EHTBP

-Bookers

-Booker's Rye

-SAOS Bourbon SB

-SAOS Rye SB

-WhistlePig (Boss Hog & SB)

 

 

 

Cheers, Jeff

 

 

 

[Richnimrod]

Just to clarify...

You're not adding water to the bottle are you?    ...Just to your pour in the glass, right?

 

That said, I often add a little water to high-proofers (always in my glass).    Hell, I'll add water to BIB's sometimes.    Depends upon the purpose of my pour and my mood at the time, and what my intentions are for the rest of the evening, as well.    I've found a few that reliably improve (open up, as many say) when a little water is added.   One that isn't all that high-proof; but seems to almost always improve with a few drops of water (to me, anyway) is OFBB.

Basically, the advice given by many here is accurate and wise: Drink Your Bourbon The Way You Like It!!!

[Whiskeythink.com]

There is science behind adding water. It first dilutes the alcohol so it anesthetises the taste buds less, allowing them to better senses flavors. But it also changes the flavor by breaking up micelles, which are linked ethanol chains which trap other compounds in the chain as well. When broken by water, those compounds are released & can be tasted. A whiskey may prefered either neat or with water because the same whiskey can have different flavor profiles depending on which way it is sipped. Some are better neat, some shine more with water. Finding the right amount of water requires much research. We must get busy. Start pouring immediately.

[Louisiana]

Thanks for the input Whiskeythink. We definitely should get started on that research. Just poured a glass!

[Kpiz]

Good reminder, thanks Louisiana. I am often stubborn about adding water, and other times I simply forget...probably because I've gotten into such a habit of drinking things neat. The bottle that really opened my eyes to this was not bourbon, but brandy - the Copper & Kings Butchertown Brandy. Sku gave it a very good review and I decided to buy a bottle. My first impression was that it was a hot mess, literally and otherwise. I went back to Sku's review and he clearly says that water really helped the flavor, so I tried it, and it tasted completely different (and amazing) with a bit of H2O.

[Louisiana]

13 hours ago, Kpiz said:

Good reminder, thanks Louisiana. I am often stubborn about adding water, and other times I simply forget...probably because I've gotten into such a habit of drinking things neat. 

 

 I am the same way. Old habits are hard to break.

 

15 hours ago, Richnimrod said:

Drink Your Bourbon The Way You Like It!!!

 

 I agree with this way of thinking. Maybe some of the advice above will help newer members like it even more.

Edited November 30, 2016 by Louisiana

[dSculptor]

If you add coke to GTS... I may not like you as much, but now you have the best mixer you can pour! ( Not that I have tried it but I imagine it would be....)

[Louisiana]

1 minute ago, dSculptor said:

If you add coke to GTS... I may not like you as much, but now you have the best mixer you can pour! ( Not that I have tried it but I imagine it would be....)

 

 Ha. I wasn't exactly thinking that, but I guess you could if you wanted.

[Louisiana]

I forgot to add a few more barrel Proofer's from the bunker.

- FR Small Batch LE's

- FR Single Barrel LE's

- FR Single Barrel Private Barrls

I don't think I've ever added any Water to any of these, but Air time does help some of them.

[Richnimrod]

4 hours ago, dSculptor said:

If you add coke to GTS... I may not like you as much, but now you have the best mixer you can pour! ( Not that I have tried it but I imagine it would be....)

Coke???   In your George T. Stagg????!!!!!    Jeeeeeeeez!    MOUNTAIN DEW is the preferred GTS mixer, you idiot.

KIDDING!     I know of nobody that mixes soda pop with GTS.... and Hope I Never Find Anyone I Know doing it.

[Charlutz]

My bourbon buddy neighbor had an old friend over who put coke or ginger ale in Lot B. While my buddy was horrified, this particular friend is very well off and very generous in sharing his own bourbon. He spends money on things like Hillrock and orphan barrels, but also buys ECBP and EC18 if the liquor store steers him there. He doesn't research, doesn't care and shares any and all of his own whiskey and other things generously. While it's a waste of good whiskey no insult was meant, and none taken. 

[Richnimrod]

Just now, Three quarks said:

 

I did  . . . in 2002, when it was around $38 and readily available. Why not?

Why Not????!!!!    BECAUSE!!!!!    That's why not!!!!!    Good Lord Man, are you paying any attention at all????!!!!!

[Knocksville10]

On 11/29/2016 at 7:30 PM, Whiskeythink.com said:

There is science behind adding water. It first dilutes the alcohol so it anesthetises the taste buds less, allowing them to better senses flavors. But it also changes the flavor by breaking up micelles, which are linked ethanol chains which trap other compounds in the chain as well. When broken by water, those compounds are released & can be tasted. A whiskey may prefered either neat or with water because the same whiskey can have different flavor profiles depending on which way it is sipped. Some are better neat, some shine more with water. Finding the right amount of water requires much research. We must get busy. Start pouring immediately.

This is fascinating! Just out of curiosity, what do you think a good bourbon to water ratio would be? I'm still rather new at getting some of the nuisances in flavor and I can't drink many neat that are above 90 proof or so. I've done some dabbling but I'd like some input from those who seem to have been tinkering with this longer than myself.

[Richnimrod]

8 minutes ago, Knocksville10 said:

This is fascinating! Just out of curiosity, what do you think a good bourbon to water ratio would be? I'm still rather new at getting some of the nuisances in flavor and I can't drink many neat that are above 90 proof or so. I've done some dabbling but I'd like some input from those who seem to have been tinkering with this longer than myself.

As to drinking neat: SMALL SIPS!!!!    As to amount of dilution: Start with a few drops, add a few more, then a few more, then a few more, etc.... Tasting a few sips between each of the additions of water.    You'll arrive at a dilution that suits the whiskey poured  in due course; and slowly figure what each one needs to get to your sweet spot.

I'm betting, though, that you'll find, being slow and careful, taking those really small sips; you'll discover many don't NEED that much water.      That doesn't mean you won't WANT a certain amount of water to 'open up' some of 'em.    Experimentation is the key, and always remember: The Journey Is The Destination!    Have FUN!!!!       Cheers!!!

[Whiskeythink.com]

Water amount is strictly subjective, & differs for each whiskey. Experimentation is key. Small amounts so not to drown it. And as Richnimrod says, small sips. Plus chew it. Gulps are for Fireball, if one must.

[Louisiana]

Yes. Very Very Small Sips. Try to get a taste for what you are drinking. Next thing you know the sips will get bigger & your palate will be able to differentiate flavors.

 

Each whiskey does react different with water. Small drops like the comments above suggest. Once it gets enjoyable Stop! A lot of Barrel Proofer's don't need any water though.

[GeeTen]

On 11/29/2016 at 7:30 PM, Whiskeythink.com said:

There is science behind adding water. It first dilutes the alcohol so it anesthetises the taste buds less, allowing them to better senses flavors. But it also changes the flavor by breaking up micelles, which are linked ethanol chains which trap other compounds in the chain as well. When broken by water, those compounds are released & can be tasted. A whiskey may prefered either neat or with water because the same whiskey can have different flavor profiles depending on which way it is sipped. Some are better neat, some shine more with water. Finding the right amount of water requires much research. We must get busy. Start pouring immediately.

So, as I understand it, the micelles were formed during the distillation process when amphiphiles from the mash/wort preparation and fermentation were mixed in the steam/water. They consist of an inner core of assembled hydrophobic segments capable of solubilizing lipophilic substances and an outer hydrophilic corona serving as a stabilizing interface between the hydrophobic core and the external aqueous environment.  Do you have more specifics about the composition of the "lipophilic substances" as it relates to mashbill and/or distillation methodology w/ or w/o chilled or non-chilled filtration?   

 

Just askin' . . . . . . . 

 

Edited December 1, 2016 by GeeTen
content, spelling & grammar corrections

[Clueby]

6 hours ago, GeeTen said:

So, as I understand it, the micelles were formed during the distillation process when amphiphiles from the mash/wort preparation and fermentation were mixed in the steam/water. They consist of an inner core of assembled hydrophobic segments capable of solubilizing lipophilic substances and an outer hydrophilic corona serving as a stabilizing interface between the hydrophobic core and the external aqueous environment.  Do you have more specifics about the composition of the "lipophilic substances" as it relates to mashbill and/or distillation methodology w/ or w/o chilled or non-chilled filtration?   

 

Just askin' . . . . . . . 

 

What I heard was: 

 

[tanstaafl2]

On ‎11‎/‎30‎/‎2016 at 10:42 AM, dSculptor said:

If you add coke to GTS... I may not like you as much, but now you have the best mixer you can pour! ( Not that I have tried it but I imagine it would be....)

 

Can be a pain to get that powder to fully dissolve though...

[dSculptor]

4 minutes ago, tanstaafl2 said:

 

Can be a pain to get that powder to fully dissolve though...

Yeah, but when you do ... WHAT A MIXER!!!  (Highball?)

[jeffrey r]

What I heard was: 

 

Alright, I am sitting at jury duty bored out of my mind, and that video gave me a good laugh.

[t-ball]

Newbie question.  I am assuming tap water is not the way to go because of chemicals and God only knows what else is in there. Never had bourbon with water.  Willing to try .  Do I use distilled or spring water ? 

[Clueby]

11 minutes ago, jeffrey r said:

Alright, I am sitting at jury duty bored out of my mind, and that video gave me a good laugh.

Thanks for your service!  I had jury duty last month.  I was actually picked to be on the jury.  It was a tedious but fascinating day.  Over in one day thank God.  Our county courthouse has a strict no-cell-phones-allowed-in-the-building-whatsoever policy.  If you are found with one you are charged with contempt of court.  I was there from 8:30am till 7pm.  We were allowed to go to our cars to call family, work, etc. on breaks.

[Flyfish]

17 hours ago, Knocksville10 said:

This is fascinating! Just out of curiosity, what do you think a good bourbon to water ratio would be? I'm still rather new at getting some of the nuisances in flavor and I can't drink many neat that are above 90 proof or so. I've done some dabbling but I'd like some input from those who seem to have been tinkering with this longer than myself.

The ratio of water to bourbon is extremely low to initiate the chemical reaction that produces "opening up." There are more aromas released and a noticeable change in the texture or body of the bourbon with as little as two or three drops administered by medicine dropper. This has nothing to do with altering the proof of the bourbon. Do a web search for E-pistle 2009/03--The Chemistry of Water and Whisky. As to adjusting down to 90 proof where you feel more comfortable drinking it, there are also formulas on the web for adjusting the proof. Sorry, don't know what can be done for the "nuisances" of flavor. I have enough trouble coming up with names for subtle flavors. I can taste them better than I can name them. Same goes for nuances. I don't think there is any magical water to bourbon ratio. I prefer mine barrel proof when I can get it. Alcohol carries flavor so uncut and unfiltered means that everything in the bourbon is still in there, not watered down or removed. It is always really easy to adjust proof down but damn hard to adjust it up.   

[tanstaafl2]

1 hour ago, t-ball said:

Newbie question.  I am assuming tap water is not the way to go because of chemicals and God only knows what else is in there. Never had bourbon with water.  Willing to try .  Do I use distilled or spring water ? 

 

Water from your local creek, or "branch" if you will (as in "Bourbon and branch", meaning still water rather than sparkling water in your drink) back in the day when you could safely drink water from a creek (Like a 100 years or more ago maybe depending on where you were!) still had some chemicals and "flavor" to it so I tend to look for a decent bottled spring water (it probably is still purified in some way before it goes in the bottle of course). To me distilled water just tastes a bit odd but I am not sure exactly why that is. It is almost too flat and bland in taste so I never use it. 

 

Some distilleries back in the bad old glut era would bottle Kentucky limestone filtered water to mix with, probably mostly just to try to make ends meet!

 

In some places tap water can be pretty decent. Atlanta tap water is pretty tolerable in a pinch to me for example, especially if you let it sit for a day or two to off gas some of the chlorinated taste. If you want to get really fancy then aerate the water as well to help reduce the chlorine.  But not every municipality has water that I would want to use. tap water with a higher level of iron and sulfur are obviously to be avoided!