SAOS recipe

[Wedelstaedt]

So I am wondering if SAOS, is one of the 10 recipes Four Roses currently uses.  I believe SAOS has been sourced from MGP, a former Seagram's distillery.  4R also being a former Seagram's distillery.

 

Thanks for your reply, Cheers.

[Harry in WashDC]

Here's a link to the MGPI beverage products page which lists the percentage of the second grain used in their bourbons, ryes, and whiskies.

 

http://www.mgpingredients.com/product-list/

 

Guessing that it uses 4% or 5% malted barley or an enzyme (more likely given the size of their operations) to help feed the yeast, you can figure out about how much corn is used in their bourbons. The per cent rye and wheat is given so you can figure out about how much corn is used as a second grain in their ryes and wheat whiskey.

 

These mash bills can be compared to the Four Roses mash bills which can be found on the 4R site and is explained on bourbonr.com (http://bourbonr.com/blog/four-roses-mash-bill/) as well as in OscarV's 2010 topic on SB here: https://www.straightbourbon.com/community/topic/13268-four-roses-10-recipes/?tab=comments#comment-197350   

 

Note that the 4R recipes also depend on which yeast is used.  I could find no information on the strain or strains of yeast used by MGPI.  I suppose the strains used by 4R (a Kirin company for many years now) and the MGPI strains (several iterations to get to today's MGP) MIGHT have a common ancestor from the Seagram's era, but I would not put money on it.  Also, since many generations of yeast (or yeasts) have passed since that possible common ancestor, the properties of the different lines might be quite different now.  I also tried checking some books (like "Proof" and a couple commercial texts on distilling - yeah, it's geeky but so what?) about the yeast issue and concluded that company chemists specializing in yeast propagation MIGHT be able to determine whether any current 4R strains are substantially similar to current MGP strains.

 

Still, the sometimes incestuous relationships in the bourbon business . . .

 

Just my opinion over here.

 

 

Edited October 29, 2017 by Harry in WashDC
To ask myself why, at 6:30AM, I'm researching YEAST.

[Clueby]

On the subject of yeast and 4R....how do they keep the different strains of yeast pure without contamination from the others?  Seems like over time they would change and strains would mingle. Is the fermentation using the different strains kept completely physically isolated?

[Swamp55]

1 hour ago, Clueby said:

On the subject of yeast and 4R....how do they keep the different strains of yeast pure without contamination from the others?  Seems like over time they would change and strains would mingle. Is the fermentation using the different strains kept completely physically isolated?

 

Workers at Four Roses prepare for shift change:

 

[Wedelstaedt]

Harry,

 

Thank you for your research and detailed post.  Good info. 

 

The reason I posted the question, is when I enjoy some of the  SAOS SiBs, I am reminded of many of the 4R PS OESKs, I have had the pleasure of sampling. 

 

Wedel

[flahute]

9 hours ago, Clueby said:

On the subject of yeast and 4R....how do they keep the different strains of yeast pure without contamination from the others?  Seems like over time they would change and strains would mingle. Is the fermentation using the different strains kept completely physically isolated?

Yeast sources are kept isolated as you would expect. After each fermentation run, the tanks are sterilized. I don't think every single fermenter in the room has the same yeast. Fermentation is staggered because you don't have enough still capacity to distill every single tank at once. At one point every single take may have the same yeast, but when you switch over to a new yeast, there's a slow transition from one to the other. 

[Harry in WashDC]

5 hours ago, Wedelstaedt said:

Harry,

 

Thank you for your research and detailed post.  Good info. 

 

The reason I posted the question, is when I enjoy some of the  SAOS SiBs, I am reminded of many of the 4R PS OESKs, I have had the pleasure of sampling. 

 

Wedel

You aren't the only one who tasted similarities.  Check out the VBT # 575 thread.  ANd, apparently, there's yet another whiskey out there with similar properties.  Help us guess it, PLEASE.

[Mako254]

1 hour ago, Harry in WashDC said:

You aren't the only one who tasted similarities.  Check out the VBT # 575 thread.  ANd, apparently, there's yet another whiskey out there with similar properties.  Help us guess it, PLEASE.

 

I'll second this. SAOS definitely reminds me of E mash bill from Four Roses.