Give up the funk

[Jav]

I'll be the first to admit that I don't have a very sophisticated palate.  And my bourbon journey is less than a year old.

 

But I have bought and enjoyed many bourbons over that time, including several Beam products.  And I never tasted what others have only described as the "funk".

 

Unfortunately I happened to pick up a bottle of Basil Hayden's a few days ago (at the same time I bought a bottle of Eagle Rare, the first time I've seen one in town).  I had a pour of the ER a few nights ago and I enjoyed it thoroughly.   So last night I thought I would try the Basil Hayden's.

 

Since it's only 80 proof I figured I would just drink it neat.  My first sip was rather pleasant, with a lot of oak.  The mouthfeel was surprising for only 80 proof, and I have to admit this is likely the smoothest 80 proof liquor of any kind I've drank.  There's a hint of the high rye in the finish that likely hides the small amount of alcohol heat.

 

So I thought to myself that this was actually pretty decent.  And then it happened.  What I can only describe as a musty, rotting vegetable flavor slowly started to come to me. And it just got stronger and stronger with each sip.  By the time I was half way though my 2ish ounce pour I didn't even want to touch it.

 

I literally added water to the last half of an ounce just so I could finish it (that did help alot, but there wasn't much bourbon flavor left either).

 

I don't think I can drink the rest of this bottle.  I will definitely give it another try later, but this was easily my worst bourbon experience, and its not even close.  I read through the Basil Hayden BOTM threads here and it didn't seem like I'm the only one that gets this flavor, but maybe its not too common either.  As a contrast I do not remember feeling this way about JB Black, and Knob Creek has been one of my favorites for the price...

[smokinjoe]

Standard Beam recipes have a definite flavor profile, though I find it less pronounced as the age of the whiskey increases.  I don’t find it to be “funky” in any way, but more of a roasted peanut with semisweet caramel.  Tough to describe, and I know it when I taste it, but it’s not a “funk” IMO.  That’s a rather pejorative description that’s gained traction over the years, as a descriptor for Beam whiskies, and Beam is unfortunately stuck with it.  I find OGD recipe labels, like the BH you are speaking of, to be much different.  As they should be, with different yeast and mashbill.  More of a burnt corner of the brownie pan note that just sings to me when my palate is up for it.  When OGD recipe Beams are in my wheelhouse, there’s not much better for me.  

I’d recommend just to keep plugging along with it, and see if it eventually comes around for you.  Perhaps, that mashbill  doesnr suit you.  We all can’t love everything...  ????

[Jav]

I read some tasting notes on this bourbon and someone mentioned figgy pudding and stewed plums???  Maybe that's what I'm getting.  I can't say, but the strength of the flavor was overwhelming to me.  I will definitely give it another try on another night with a clean palate.

[Harry in WashDC]

45 minutes ago, Jav said:

I read some tasting notes on this bourbon and someone mentioned figgy pudding and stewed plums???  Maybe that's what I'm getting.  I can't say, but the strength of the flavor was overwhelming to me.  I will definitely give it another try on another night with a clean palate.

FWIW, I, too, like smokinjoe find a peanut-y flavor sitting under Beam's "basic bourbon" with, especially, JBW, but I avoid calling it "funk"; rather, I figure it's an ester, like that banana note in lower proof Jack Daniels or the metallic tang I sometimes get in Woodford Reserve, that is just part of the mix so I sublimate it or hide it with a mixer.  The older the Beam-branded product gets (Double Aged, black label) OR the higher the proof (bonded which I use a lot in cocktails) OR fancied up (the "Craft" offerings), though, the less I taste it.

 

NOW, about Basil Hayden (AKA Old Granddad @ 80 proof and about 8 years).   Here's a link to a relatively recent thread featuring Basil Hayden as the BOTM.  https://www.straightbourbon.com/community/topic/25449-botm-917-basil-haydens/  Betcha find some comments like yours!

 

All that said, my most consumed bourbon is OGD BIB.  And, although BH is the same mash bill and yeast at, maybe, a year or two older than my OGD BIB, I really don't care for it and cannot tell you why.  So, rather than fight it, I just buy OGD BIB at a higher proof and lower price.

 

[Mako254]

22 minutes ago, Harry in WashDC said:

.So, rather than fight it, I just buy OGD BIB at a higher proof and lower price.

 

One mans bourbon zen?

[Harry in WashDC]

26 minutes ago, Mako254 said:

One mans bourbon zen?

Yep.  No point hurting yourself drinking something that hurts.  There are too many others out there.  Took me 40 years to learn that.  And, tasting is not an art, it is a process.  Whatever THAT means.  But, it sounds good.

[Mako254]

18 minutes ago, Harry in WashDC said:

Yep.  No point hurting yourself drinking something that hurts.  There are too many others out there.  Took me 40 years to learn that.  And, tasting is not an art, it is a process.  Whatever THAT means.  But, it sounds good.

 

Was at a buddys house the other day. Wanted me to try something blind, so I’m game. Great pour. Classic nose, not much burn, nice spicy finish. 

The pour? Off the shelf Four Roses single barrel. I spent 6 months finding all 10 private barrel recipes, double up on the ones I like etc. had forgotten how good off the shelf 100 proof four roses is. And it is $38 in my area. I think there is a lesson to be learned. 

[smokinjoe]

22 minutes ago, Mako254 said:

 

Was at a buddys house the other day. Wanted me to try something blind, so I’m game. Great pour. Classic nose, not much burn, nice spicy finish. 

The pour? Off the shelf Four Roses single barrel. I spent 6 months finding all 10 private barrel recipes, double up on the ones I like etc. had forgotten how good off the shelf 100 proof four roses is. And it is $38 in my area. I think there is a lesson to be learned. 

The lessons never stop in this hobby, it seems, ya know?  But, the exploration like you describe Mak keep it so, so, interesting.  

[kcgumbohead]

Well I have tasted the funk and it is no indictment of Beam as they make a very high quality product. My feeling is that just as some are pre disposed to reject broccoli others palates reject other flavors that are perfectly acceptable and enjoyable to others. I have never had a favorable experience with JBW from the days of my yout , early 80s to now, if I take a sip of JBW my first response is to spit it out, immediately. To my palate there is a VERY objectionable flavor in there and you may be onto something with the rotten veg. The sucky thing is it kept me away from exploring bourbon for many years except WT, I always enjoyed that. To my tase it ages out, back when JBB was 8 yrs I could detect it but at a MUCH lower level, KC at 9yrs drinks just fine to me and I enjoy it. All that said, the OGD line uses a different recipe including a different yeast and the yeast is what I suspect in my dislike of young Beam distiillate. As much as I have a negative reaction to young Beam, OGD is an all time favorite though BH not so much, its a shadow of its OGD bretheren. Could be that you have a sensitivity to a component of OGD. Point is the “funk” is very real and if you are pre disposed to it you know instantly. There are plenty of other bourbons to enjoy as you know, maybe OGD ain’t your thing, though give the BIB a go just in case. Cheers.

[Charlutz]

Add me to the group who tastes strong peanut in Booker’s and KCSB. I like both a lot, but it’s sometimes distracting. I don’t get it much in regular KC. I don’t notice it in JB distillers cut and haven’t had Baker’s in a while. 

[Vosgar]

7 hours ago, Jav said:

And then it happened.  What I can only describe as a musty, rotting vegetable flavor slowly started to come to me. And it just got stronger and stronger with each sip. 

Reminds me of whenever I try to drink Budweiser 

[Jazz June]

Maybe it's psychological at this point,  but I get that very distinct flavor from the Jim Beam branded products, even "nicer" ones like the single barrel, but not in any of the small batch offerings. I have an unopened bottle of Jim Beam BiB and will be interested to see if the distinct JB flavor is there. Taste and memory are linked, so I wonder if the negative association formed from choking down Beam White while a teenager is too strong to overcome. Also, add me to the list of OGD BiB appreciators, no unwanted funk there.

[smokinjoe]

I’ve noticed “funk” recently creeping into descriptions of even Wild Turkey bourbons, as in that “Wild Turkey Funk”.  Huh?  I’m totally in on folks noticing something in a distillery’s offerings that makes it identifiable.  That something can be enjoyable, or not, to any individual.  But, that’s “house style”, not “funk”.  They shouldn’t be construed as synonymous.

[NDN98]

I used to never notice a funk, but in the last year I have noticed some "funk" in certain bourbons produced by Jim Beam, Wild Turkey, and most recently, a 1792FP store pick.

[musekatcher]

If Beam products have a funk, then wouldn't their expensive products like Basil Hayden have...Uptown Funk?  couldn't resist...

 

 I've enjoyed BH, and I too thought it was unusually smooth, unusually flavorable  for an 80 proofer - and I didn't really see the resemblance to OGD80 either.  The OP's experience almost sounds like something was in the bottom of the bottle, a layer or something, that was stirred up and contaminated subsequent pours?  Anytime I grew to dislike a whiskey, I had that reservation from the beginning.  I've never gone from full approval to disapproval, especially in the same bottle. 

 

 

[GaryT]

I've definitely used the "funk" term to describe that thing I get with Beam.  I get that a whole lot more on the Jim Beam line (although similar to Charlutz, it is less pronounced on the Distiller's Cut).  Basil Hayden is one that for whatever reason I don't recall having that, but haven't owned a bottle in a while.  I'd definitely revisit - could be other factors (what you were eating during or prior, what was in the air, just daily palate variation).  I know in the beginning of my journey, there were bottles I bought, tried, and didn't much care for (Bookers was one of those for me), so I pushed them to the back of the cabinet and moved on.  Months/years later I'd revisit, and sometimes was pleasantly surprised to find I really liked them.  If I get 1/3-1/2 way through a bottle I expected to enjoy and it just isn't happening - I give up and either gift it, save it for whiskey projects (barrel mingles, infusions, etc), or dump it.  Doesn't make sense to me to force myself through it if I'm not enjoying it.

[Swamp55]

OK, I can't resist any longer adding this video to this thread.  (Thanks to the OP, this tune has been stuck in my head since yesterday!)

 

 

 

[flahute]

On 3/30/2018 at 9:25 PM, smokinjoe said:

But, that’s “house style”, not “funk”.  They shouldn’t be construed as synonymous.

This, right here.

[flahute]

On 3/30/2018 at 3:08 PM, kcgumbohead said:

............and the yeast is what I suspect in my dislike of young Beam distiillate. 

Correct sir.

[fishnbowljoe]

I have to admit that I'm one of the people that has used  "Beam funk" in a misproper way. Joe is right. "House Style" is a more accurate decription. I promise to try and use this phrase in the future. 

 

I've been thinking a little about this lately. Partly for an odd reason. My wife made a big crockpot of beef barley stew a while back. FWIW, it was really good.  To cut to the chase, after having a couple of bowls of stew, I kicked back with a pour later on, and got to wondering about barley. I know full well that there are different types of barley used for different things. I also know that the percentage of malted barley used in bourbon mash bills is minimal. Still, I couldn't help but wonder about a couple of things. How much does the percentage of malted barley in a bourbon mash bill affect the flavor of that bourbon, and, how much does that percentage and the interaction between it and a mash bill's yeast play in a bourbons flavor?  Yeah I know, this is kinda nitpicking, and may have been covered here before, but...

 

Biba! Joe

[lcpfratn]

I have to admit that I'm one of the people that has used  "Beam funk" in a misproper way. Joe is right. "House Style" is a more accurate decription. I promise to try and use this phrase in the future. [emoji4]
 
I've been thinking a little about this lately. Partly for an odd reason. My wife made a big crockpot of beef barley stew a while back. FWIW, it was really good. [emoji14] To cut to the chase, after having a couple of bowls of stew, I kicked back with a pour later on, and got to wondering about barley. I know full well that there are different types of barley used for different things. I also know that the percentage of malted barley used in bourbon mash bills is minimal. Still, I couldn't help but wonder about a couple of things. How much does the percentage of malted barley in a bourbon mash bill affect the flavor of that bourbon, and, how much does that percentage and the interaction between it and a mash bill's yeast play in a bourbons flavor?  Yeah I know, this is kinda nitpicking, and may have been covered here before, but...
 
Biba! Joe

Joe, I'll bring last year's Woodford Reserve Masters Collection Cherry Wood Smoked Barley to Bardstown so you can see some effects of what I think is too much malted barley in the mashbill. I love scotch and I love bourbon, but with 30% malted barley in the mashbill of this bourbon, it really takes over the flavor profile. It's not horrible, and some folks really like it, but Bruce and I are not big fans of last year's release.

[Mule Skinner]

The power of suggestion and the computer can convince a lot of folks of a lot of things.  

Edited April 3, 2018 by Mule Skinner

[mcspin]

I've wondered for awhile if people who are picky about what they eat are also picky about what appeals to their bourbon palette. Me, I can eat almost anything generally served as food and can't say I've ever disliked a bourbon.   

 

[Richnimrod]

12 minutes ago, mcspin said:

Me, I can eat almost anything generally served as food and can't say I've ever disliked a bourbon.   

 

Buy and try all the over-priced "craft" offerings you find.    You'll likely need to amend the last part of that statement.    ...Just sayin'...

[lcpfratn]

Buy and try all the over-priced "craft" offerings you find.    You'll likely need to amend the last part of that statement.    ...Just sayin'...

Rich, that is a prophetic statement that I wholeheartedly agree with...although there are certainly some "craft" offerings that are pretty good even if still over-priced.


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