Corner Creek Reserve

[Guest **DONOTDELETE**]

During my visit to Kentucky this week I picked up a bottle of Corner Creek Reserve. It says "Corner Creek Distillery, Bardstown, KY". Yeah, right. I was there, and there isn't such a distillery.

Heaven's Hill boasted the fact that they have 1200 brand names. Plus, this bourbon reminds me of Evan Williams. So, is it a HH product or what?

[cowdery]

Where did you buy it?

--Chuck Cowdery

[Guest **DONOTDELETE**]

Liquor Barn in Lexington. Liquor Outlet in Louisville has it too. Aren't you in Chicago? (I'm in the 'burbs)

[Guest **DONOTDELETE**]

I've seen this bourbon in springfield a few times...but had never heard of it before

[RyanStotz]

I'd bet it's HH stock. Only other possibility would be Willett, and I'm fairly sure that any leftover Willett is going straight into Johnny Drum and/or Noah's Mill - that is, if there is actually any Willett whiskey left. I haven't had the Corner Creek yet (had my eye on a bottle for a while, though), but every tasting note I've read on it brings up classic HH hallmarks. Is there a distillery number on the bottle anywhere?

Stotz

[Guest **DONOTDELETE**]

Ryan,

I looked fairly carefully and the only unique markings or words were:

"For Marvin and Sydney" written on the back label, at the bottom just above the UPC.

This Bourbon was carefully crafted under close supervision by the Master Distiller at Corner Creek Distillery, Bardstown KY. Chuckle Chuckle.

[cowdery]

Yep, I'm here in Chicago, near Wrigley Field, but I know the Louisville and Bardstown liquor stores pretty well from spending a lot of time there. (Not just in the liquor stores, of course.) I lived in Louisville for nine years.

--Chuck Cowdery

[Guest **DONOTDELETE**]

Chuck,

Of course there's no real way of knowing for sure who made the bourbon or even who bottled it, but isn't there a registry (either federal or in Kentucky) where the owners of labels are listed. If that's public information, is there any way to access it? That would clear up several mysteries such as this one that Aaron brought up.

By the way, just why ARE bourbon bottlers so reluctant to be identified? Is it because of trade agreements with the suppliers? Or are the same conditions that once made it desireable to hide one's involvement with the liquor biz still in effect?

I have a bottle of Corner Creek, by the way ($25.99 at Party Source, Bellvue KY) and you can add me to the list of those who believe it to be HH. There is a flavor that reminds me of the Willet-based Kentucky Bourbon Distillers series, but I think that's just an "over-barrelled" taste that they have in common. The KBD bottlings (Noah's Mill, Rowan's Creek, Pure Kentucky XO, and Kentucky Vintage) are all identified as such and Corner Creek isn't.

-John Lipman-

http://w3.one.net/~jeffelle/whiskey

[cowdery]

HH is usually a good bet because they have always been the leader in private label bottling.

The reason the bottler/distiller isn't identified is purely marketing. The owner of the Corner Creek Reserve label (which may be a distributor) wants the consumer who likes it to have to buy Corner Creek Reserve and not think, "well, since the same distllery makes this less expensive brand over here, why don't I try that one and maybe I will like it just as well." Since every distillery makes some products under its own name, I'm sure they figure they are "out in the open" enough, so that a person who wants to try the product of a given distillery certainly can.

In the case of Heaven Hill, they make a distinction between their brands that they own and the ones they make for other people. Their PR releases list all of their bourbons, but not their private label bottlings.

--Chuck Cowdery

[dgonano]

This seems to go way back.

Corner Creek is(accordingto the label) a bourbon with both rye and wheat as the flavor grain. Was this accomplished through the mashbill?

This brings up another query. Can a distributor buy

various whiskeys from different distilleries and

batch them together to create a unique product.

Could rye and wheat bourbons be dumped and bottled together?

If so would they still be KSBW?

[cowdery]

As long as all of the whiskies in the bottle are KSBW, the whole is considered KSBW, even if the whiskies were made at different distilleries in different seasons. CCR is not a Heaven Hill product, although it may be (wholely or in part) Heaven Hill whiskey.

[Gillman]

Chuck, can you explain these rules in more detail? For example, could Jim Beam market a whiskey that incorporated some bourbon whiskey made by another company? I realise Beam could sell as straight bourbon bourbon made at different production facilities of Jim Beam, but can it buy bourbon whiskey on the wholesale market and blend it into its own?

What is the situation regarding a "blend of straight bourbon whiskeys" (which we hardly see today if at all)? Is Corner Creek possibly doing that without however being required to state on the label that the product is a blend of straight bourbon whiskey (i.e., 100% bourbon but just sourced from different companies)? Putting it another way, if they don't say that on the label (as they do not I believe), does this mean the bourbon has to be from one company only albeit that they don't have to say which one?

Gary

[cowdery]

I'll post an answer in General Bourbon Topics.

[ikewillett1]

My name is Ike Willett. My grandfather Bill Willett was involved in the distribution side of business at the old Willett distillery. His cousin was Thompson Willett, who until he passed away last year, ran the Willett Distillery. I have long been fascinated by the role bourbon has played in my family's history and finally got a chance to visit the Willett distillery a few months ago.

On my visit to the Willett distillery I learned that their still has not been operational for some time. I don't know the last time any bourbon was actually distilled there but it is likely that it was before Corner Creek went into the barrels. So, if I were to guess, I would say Corner Creek is not made by the Willett distillery.

Someone mentioned a Willett connection to Noah's Mill. The Willett Distillery bottles Noah's Mill but did/does not distill it. They buy it from a third party, bottle it, and distribute it to sellers.

Finally, I agree that Corner's Creek has distinctive Heaven Hill characteristics. It has been a fun addition to my collection.

[Gillman]

Delighted to "meet" you on these boards. Some of the wisest words I ever read about bourbon whiskey were written by distiller Charlie Thomasson who worked for Willett's certainly into the 1960's and had experience stretching back to before the Volstead Act. His essay on bourbon included in the main Kentucky Bourbon Festival magazine issued for the event in 2002 is essential, in my view. If you have not read it, I am sure the office of the Festival could give you a copy. His comments on bouquet and flavour, mashbill, vessel cleaning, wood choice for new barrels, and warehouse location and design are classic and were expressed with charm and a modesty that could not hide his real knowledge. After I read that two years ago (at the Festival) I set upon getting my hands on some genuine Willett's whiskey, and have been trying ever since.

Gary

[ikewillett1]

Thanks for the information on the article you referenced. I am going to try to contact the festival to get a copy. You mentioned wanting to get our hands on some original Willett bourbon. My Dad and I used to have quite a few bottles of Old Bardstown that were actually distilled by the Willett distillery. We are down to two bottles now. One for him and one for me. Needless to say, I have no plans to open the final bottle. I think it needs to be kept as a piece of family bourbon history.

Again, thanks or the information about the article. I look forward to checking it out.

[Gillman]

Just bringing forward this post about Corner's Creek to add a comment about a current bottle I sampled recently. I thought it was excellent. This one seemed much less in the Heaven Hill mold than earlier bottles (from a couple of years ago). It has good balance, finesse, and a complex taste. Worth the price, whereas earlier bottles seemed lacking to a degree. Clearly the current barrels, whatever their source, are the best yet for this brand. If I had to generalise, I'd say it is on the dry side of the spectrum, as Baker's or Basil Hayden are. I tasted it next to a EWSB '94. In comparison, the latter was deeper (seemingly older), sweeter from more vanillins, with a "mint" tang the other lacked. Both are fine products.

Gary

[LeNell]

We have consumed quite a few bottles of Corner Creek ourselves. Many of my customers really enjoy this whiskey, too. For around the same price, the EWSB does offer a more complex, deeper flavor, but the CC is drinking well.

I'll offer a little retailer "secret" about this brand. It's priced wholesale to give retailers a way of making a little extra money than most other brands. Ted Kraut, one of the guys heading up the Corner Creek project, told me he wanted to provide a good bourbon in a great package that would allow a little bit more gross profit to retailers. For example, I can sell the EWSB for 23% gross profit while I sell the CC for 26% gross profit. Spirits margins are tight. Much better for wine. OK, hopefully I won't get shot for discussing profit margins publicly.

[cowdery]

OK, hopefully I won't get shot for discussing profit margins publicly.

Don't worry. Ted told me the same thing when I interviewed him for my newsletter.

Most of these private label brands I can take or leave, but Corner Creek is a good one.