Just at the liquor store...

[NickAtMartinis]

...and I saw 9 bottles of PVW20!!!! Wow, I thought this stuff was get scarse, but not at this liquor store. Also, four of the bottles were in a red, velvet bag. I have only seen the PVW23 come in a velvet bag and that was black, I believe.

Anyway, while standing there looking at the bourbons, I came across this Whiskey hand book (Whiskey Bible) so I decided to look up some whiskeys to check their ratings. The first ones I looked up were the ORVW 10 and 15 107's which were 92 and 93 respectively, if memory serves. But, the shocker of it all was the rating this guy gave the PVW20, a 79!!!! And, the PVW23 he gave a 88. Also, the Lot B he gave an 80 saying the smell gave it a bad rating.

Ridiculous. For the most part, it seemed like the guy wrote this little book disliked the VW name. I believe the author's name is Jim Murray.

Does anybody know anything about this book and/or author and why he may not like VW products other than taste?

[DrinkyBanjo]

Like anyone else his opinions are not always in line with others. I usually agree with him for the most part, however I do not necessarily agree with him on his Van Winkle reviews.

Speaking of Van Winkle I had an ORVW 10 107 last week with a cigar, it was a very, very pleasant experience.

[snakster]

Without answering your real question....I was also just at a liquor store and they had 4 bottles of PVW20 on the shelf, with one in the red velvet bag. If i had my stash of cash with me i would have bought it. I may go back tomorrow and pick it up, just because it looks cool. (Plus it will give me an excuse to open my one bottle that I already have.)

To your original question, I'm sure there are many qualified individuals here who will offer informed opinions. The only one of the 4 that I have ever tried is the "Lot B". I remember not being overly impressed, but that was a while ago (early in my bourbon life) and my palate may have developed a little more. Probably worth trying again. I have one bottle of PVW20 but have not opened it. The other two are not available in PA.

[ggilbertva]

Do try the Lot B again. That's the odd thing about bourbon, first impressions are not always the most correct impressions. There are so many factors that go into ones enjoyment of a bourbon, that giving it a second or third shot is really required to make final judgment. Moods, emotional state, time of day, food, etc. all play a role in how a bourbon is perceived. I really like the Lot B; it's one of my top 10 pours. While I have a bottle of the Pappy 20, I have not opened it yet. I have had the Pappy 15 and find it to be wonderful. The ORVW 10 107 is also a very good pour. I really like the Van Winkle line and this is testament to Julian's skill at picking the best barrels for his line of bourbon.

[Mamba]

I always found Lot B to be an exceptional whiskey for friends whom have no experience with nice bourbons. Not too expensive or rare, and almost never fails to illicit some sort of positive response, from "this isn't as bad as I thought" to "I could see getting into this."

I pretty much ignore expert ratings. Find them destructive to the whole discovery experience that whiskey is for me. Happiness is finding a whiskey for your mood... not fitting your mood to a whiskey.

[snakster]

I pretty much ignore expert ratings. Find them destructive to the whole discovery experience that whiskey is for me. Happiness is finding a whiskey for your mood... not fitting your mood to a whiskey.

I agree with that. Case in point: Jefferson Reserve does not seem to get a whole lot of love here and Baker's is generally well received (both here and in competition apparently). I have both of those bottles open at home right now. This past weekend I had a card game at my house. I first poured myself the JR and enjoyed it quite a bit. Then poured the Baker's. I took a couple tastes and then put it down and poured myself another JR. I enjoyed the JR much more than Baker's.

If I had relegated myself to buying what the consensus of opinions were, I might never have tried JR. It still probably is not worth the cost (strictly speaking), but I find it quite enjoyable; certainly more so than the Baker's. So viva discovery and to each his own.

Oh and I will definetly be giving Lot B a second chance.

[jwrussell]

That brings up an interesting question Snakster. Is it possible your enjoyment of Baker's was "tainted" by your previous pour of JR? Maybe because they were too different or even maybe too similiar while at the same time being different? Am I making even the slightest bit of sense?

I've just noted that I can have a pour of one Bourbon, move to another pour I know I like and not be able to get into it, and I've always put that up to the previous drink.

Just a thought.

[mgilbertva]

One of the great mysteries of bourbon is how a single beverage tasted at different times in different contexts can create such dramatically different experiences. Do we have such varied reactions to Coca-Cola, Milk or Iced Tea? Not at all. How about wine? I love good wine and champagne, but even those are not so varied and even fickle.

I can't count the number of times I have tried a bourbon and it was the most wonderful beverage I had ever consumed, only to try it at another time and while it was fine, it was merely good. Then I try another only to find that bourbon is the best ever. And so on.

This phenomenon amazes me. The changing character of my reaction to particular bourbons is part of the mystery and charm that is bourbon (er, maybe that sounded too much like a magazine ad. Anyway, I'm sure you get the point.)

To return to VW Lot B, I love it. It's mild, but a terrific pour that I've enjoyed many times. I had a bottle of PVW 20 yr and oddly, it wasn't until the last quarter of a bottle that it finally convinced me. It was too soft and subtle. Maybe it was too much on the overaged side. For me, the PVW 15 yr is just right.

[mythrenegade]

I had this experience with Wild Turkey 101. A couple of pours I thought it was terrible. Other times, I found it excellent.

The one bourbon I can't seem to get into is the Old Forester 100 that I have open right now. It came recommended by someone here, but I'm sure this is just one of those things I have to chalk up to difference in taste...

I like PVW 20, but the bottle of ORVW I bought was 90 proof, not 107, and I wasn't too impressed. It wasn't bad, but I didn't feel a need to go buy another bottle when I finished it.

Joel

[mgilbertva]

That may be one of those whiskeys you need to put away for a few weeks and come back to. I'm fan of the OF BIB, although the one from the early 80s is superior to the current offering, IMO. Still, I liked the current one quite a bit as well. Unfortunately, I don't have any with me to open and refresh my memory.

Then again since I have a number of bottles open, maybe that's fortunate...

[snakster]

That brings up an interesting question Snakster. Is it possible your enjoyment of Baker's was "tainted" by your previous pour of JR? Maybe because they were too different or even maybe too similiar while at the same time being different? Am I making even the slightest bit of sense?

I've just noted that I can have a pour of one Bourbon, move to another pour I know I like and not be able to get into it, and I've always put that up to the previous drink.

Just a thought.

I see what you're saying, and there may be a little to that. BUT I had had a pour of Baker's earlier in the day (when I opened it) with nothing before or after, and I still was underwhelmed. The nose had a strong rubbing alcohol quality that just wouldn't die. Only after I threw a cube into it that it became a little more tame.

[CrispyCritter]

I can't count the number of times I have tried a bourbon and it was the most wonderful beverage I had ever consumed, only to try it at another time and while it was fine, it was merely good. Then I try another only to find that bourbon is the best ever.

I've also noticed that sometimes a pour will seem to change quite a bit as I'm drinking it, as if different layers of flavor make themselves known. Saz 18 seemed to be one of the most changeable for me - never ever bad, just different from sip to sip.

[fussychicken]

...and I saw 9 bottles of PVW20!!!! Wow, I thought this stuff was get scarse, but not at this liquor store.

I personally see PWV20 in many places. Each store usually won't have more than about 2-5 bottles, but it is pretty easy to find.

Just like everything else, it is all about supply and demand. While I LOVE PWV20, it is an expensive bourbon. This price will thus keep the demand down. Most of us probably have one bottle, but there probably are not many who can afford to bunker this one particular bourbon. (although I would like too! )

I'm sure that if Julian has trouble distributing this year's bottling, the price will indeed come down a little bit, but I wouldn't bet on it.