Indiana Liquor Situation

[Gillman]

Dawn (or other friends in Indiana), what is the situation for bourbon in the state and for finding older bottles? I have a friend who lives near Evansville (not part of SB or the other board), and he has offered to check out local resources for me, but I would need to orient him. I am interested mainly in bottlings from past decades, e.g., ND bottlings, original S-W, and so forth. Do you see any possibilities in that part of the State, or is it not worth trying?

Gary

[luv2hunt]

I haven't looked in that area....so I'd say....yes, worth trying

I also don't seem to have the same interests in oldies as some of you guys, so alot of those I have left on the shelves.

Dawn

[Gillman]

Okay thanks, I'll send him out post-haste.

By the way driving through Ohio back north, I stopped for a while in an interesting town called Troy. It had a handsome square with building facings employing a multi-colored planking or trim, they were very reminiscent of similar things I've seen in, say, Alsace-Lorraine. Only after did I see that the names on many stores sounded Swiss or Germanic. I stopped in one of those drive-through beverage stores you see in Ohio and noted the 20% abv diluted bourbons (with brand names I never saw) that Chuck has often mentioned. I almost bought one, just for the novelty, but was full-up. Also saw in Indiana across the river from L'ville a McCormick blended whiskey (seemingly a current bottling) but didn't bite.

Gary

[kbuzbee]

Been there (Troy) several times. Used to have a customer there. I hated that drive, but you're right, it's a nice little town.

I don't know anyone who drinks the dilluted offerings. You can buy them in the grocery stores. I always figured they were for those folks who feel "dirty" walking into a liqour store.... :grin: Like it's a gentlemen's club or something. Oh well.....

I assume you shot right up 75 to Windsor?? Some time when your down this way you should swing East. I'll pour you some of those barrel projects.

Take care,

Ken

[Gillman]

Thanks, Ken, the drive was as you described, and I was wondering indeed who buys the diluted offerings. Definitely will pass by one day, and thanks again.

Gary

[cowdery]

The main reason there's a market for the diluted products is because the stores that sell them can keep longer hours than the stores that sell the real things. There are also a lot more of the stores that sell the diluted products, so there's a convenience benefit as well. Presumably, diluted vodka is better than no vodka at all, when it's all that's available.

What this is about is a peculiarity of Ohio Law that makes the typical "beer and wine" license many states have into an "anything 21% abv or less" license in Ohio. "Spirits" are defined as any product having an alcohol content higher than 21% abv, and can only be sold in regulated liquor stores. The number of such stores is limited and so are their hours of operation.

I grew up in Ohio and only lived there a few years after reaching legal age, but I never had occassion to buy one of the diluted spirits products, never saw them at a party, never saw them in the "field" in any context. Someone must buy them, but it's nobody I know.

One of the benefits of the Ohio law over the typical beer and wine license is that those licenses regulate on the basis of production method, i.e., fermented beverages only, nothing with any distilled spirits contents, so those places can sell "malternatives" such as Smirnoff ice, but can't sell pre-mixed cocktails of the same proof that are made with actual vodka. So, the Ohio way is actually more sensible. Low proof liqueurs, such as Bailey's Irish Cream, can also be sold.

[ILLfarmboy]

Been there (Troy) several times. Used to have a customer there. I hated that drive, but you're right, it's a nice little town.

I don't know anyone who drinks the dilluted offerings. You can buy them in the grocery stores. I always figured they were for those folks who feel "dirty" walking into a liqour store.... :grin: Like it's a gentlemen's club or something. Oh well.....

Ken

Being born and raised in the Land Of Lincoln I find it odd; all these peculiar regulations. Kinda makes me think such laws were designed to make people "feel dirty" going into a liquor store. Putting liquor purveyors on the same level as pornographers.

[kbuzbee]

I think you may be right about that Brad. I've always thought the same thing about liquor stores being "cash only". Supposedly this is to prevent people from going into debt to buy "sin juice" but the result of it is BGs know that robbing a liquor store is a cash rich proposition. They are more likely to be "hit" which may deter some folks from patronizing them. Just a theory.

Also you're banned from CCW so they also know everyone there will be unarmed.

BTW - Many around here now accept debit cards but (IIUC) no credit cards are allowed by state law.

Ken

[ILLfarmboy]

BTW - Many around here now accept debit cards but (IIUC) no credit cards are allowed by state law.

Ken

I sure would hate to be driving through Ohio, low on cash, and come upon some unbelievable dusty bottle find. I don't have a debit card and I'm sure they wouldn't take a personal check. God bless 'em. They would have saved me from that "sin juice". Of course if it was really worth the extra money (no grace period on cash advance etc.), I could just get a cash advance on a credit card. What a bunch of.............

[kbuzbee]

And most of the stores have managed to install ATMs right in the store so if you reach that crises point, they have you covered.

Ken

[ThomasH]

In Ohio, the state pays the agency store about 6% commission on their retail sales and slightly less on the wholesale sales to bars and restaurants. Wholesale prices to bars are also also cheaper than the retail. For example, a 1L bottle of JD black sells for 30.00 retail while it goes down to about 24.00 if you have a liquor permit for a bar/restaurant. Some stores do take checks and credit/debit cards but the fees either get absorbed by the store owner or get passed onto the customer. The reason that the stores are mainly cash is because all deposits to the states bank account are strictly in cash and must be made by 12 noon on the next business day. Every sale is recorded by a bar code scan system that send the daily sales info directly to the state. Some store owners have a system set up to add on any card/check fees associated with a purchase directly on the customers bill.

This is not mandated by the state, it is at the owners discretion. Also, if a store owner takes a check from a license holder and it goes bad after being deposited into the state's bank acount, the full amount of the check plus any bank fees gets deducted from the store owners next commission check and it is then up to the owner to go after the person who wrote the bad check. To give an example on what a scam 42 proof whiskey is, our local grocery store sells Canadian Club 42 proof for 9.99 a 750ml bottle. At the regular liquor store, and identical 80 proof bottles sells for 10.90. this past Christmas it was even crazier. The 42 proof was still 9.99 but the 80 proof was only 10.20. To make matters worse, the 42 proof bottle was subject to 6% sales tax while the higher proof bottle already had the sales tax included in the shelf price. Similar price gouging also occurs with brands such as Early Times and Southern Comfort, 2 more popular brands that are also offered in 42 proof versions. You might be wondering how I know all of this? Simple, the father of one of my friends owns the local liquor store!

Thomas