What is Bonded Exactly?

[cowdery]

Generally, Beam doesn't haul whiskey or barrels around any more than it has to, so if something is distilled at Clermont it goes into the warehouses there and if it's distilled at Booker Noe, then it's aged there. They also have some warehouses at other locations. The barrels clearly indicate where distilled so it wouldn't be hard to keep them straight to do a bond. Also, I have been told that all of the "good stuff" is made at Clermont, but I think that may have been simple partisanship, as it was one of the managers at Clermont who told me that.

[Old Lamplighter]

Saw a couple of Old Charter 7yo BIB the other day. I am sure this one is no longer made since it has been a while since seeing it on a shelf anywhere. Does BIB have to be a certain minimum age, or, under a certain maximum age? Most I have seen have been 4-6 years old.

[barturtle]

Saw a couple of Old Charter 7yo BIB the other day. I am sure this one is no longer made since it has been a while since seeing it on a shelf anywhere. Does BIB have to be a certain minimum age, or, under a certain maximum age? Most I have seen have been 4-6 years old.

Minimum of 4yo...maximum is another issue, last I read you could only go 20 years in a bonded warehouse until you had to pay the taxes (BIB is all about not paying taxes on product you can't sell yet because it is too young-you pay when it is ready to sell). This may have changed and there may be no maximum age now. IIRC the regs for this are in with the tax law, which I am not quite familiar with.

[craigthom]

Generally, Beam doesn't haul whiskey or barrels around any more than it has to, so if something is distilled at Clermont it goes into the warehouses there and if it's distilled at Booker Noe, then it's aged there. They also have some warehouses at other locations. The barrels clearly indicate where distilled so it wouldn't be hard to keep them straight to do a bond. Also, I have been told that all of the "good stuff" is made at Clermont, but I think that may have been simple partisanship, as it was one of the managers at Clermont who told me that.

Since Clermont and Boston both use DSP-KY 230, does it matter?

[barturtle]

Since Clermont and Boston both use DSP-KY 230, does it matter?

But should they?

27CFR 1:

19.132 Continuity of premises.

The continuity of the distilled spirits

plant shall be unbroken except for separations

by public waterways, thoroughfares,

or carrier rights-of-way.

However, where there are other separations

of the plant premises and all

parts of the plant premises are in the

same general location, the Director

may approve the registration of the

distilled spirits plant if he finds no

jeopardy to the revenue.

Boston to Clermont is 13.5 miles...not exactly the same general location.

[craigthom]

And yet there on the signs for both plants is "DSP-KY 230". It makes no sense to me, either.

[TNbourbon]

But should they?...'However, where there are other separations

of the plant premises and all

parts of the plant premises are in the

same general location, the Director

may approve the registration of the

distilled spirits plant if he finds no

jeopardy to the revenue.'

Boston to Clermont is 13.5 miles...not exactly the same general location.

In other words, bonding is about the tax revenue. Since there no longer is a government agent with keys to the warehouse on-site at each distillery/warehouse, they seem to be saying that the locations are the same because it doesn't affect how the taxes are collected.

[cowdery]

I think Tim hit it on the nose.

However, I wouldn't be sure that "by the same distiller at the same

distillery" for BIB labeling purposes would be linked to this provision for registration purposes, although it might very well be. What I'm saying is does "same distillery" necessarily mean the facility covered by a given DSP number?

It may very well, but I'm not sure it does.

Another wrinkle we haven't considered is that several of the distilleries in question have multiple stills. If we care about which location distilled something, shouldn't we care just as much which stills they used?

[TnSquire]

We might but I doubt seriously if the tax man does.