High West Distillery

[doubleblank]

I first reported about this venture about three years ago. My father-in-law lives in SLC and heard about this guy. Anyway, he has started distilling but his first product is a blend of two straight ryes he purchased. What is nice is that he states that it is a blend of a 6yo and a 16yo rye on his website.....he's not pretending he did the distilling.....just the blending. He has also made a vodka from oats. Someone to keep an eye out for. He told me several years ago he wants to make a specialty bourbon using "exotic" varieties of corn someday.

www.highwestdistillery.com

Randy

[cowdery]

I have gotten into it a little bit with this guy in the past. Right before his web site went up he generated a bunch of publicity in which, somehow, all of the writers got the impression High West made the whiskey. Then the web site went up, where he admits he didn't. The point is that, like Scott Bush at Templeton, these guys are happy to create the illusion they made the product they're selling, and when they are called on it and admit they didn't, they get their backs up and get all hurt.

Screw 'em.

Although Perkins admits he didn't make the stuff, he won't tell us much that is meaningful about it and what he does say (e.g., "a 6-year-old 95% rye and an 16-year-old 80% rye.") is confusing. To what do the 95% and 80% refer. Mash bill? Why in the world would you make a 95% rye mash? Assuming the other 5% is malt, why bother? That's too little malt to effectively convert the starches. It just makes no sense. Who would make a rye that way? He won't tell us, naturally.

He also writes, "A higher proportion of unmalted rye gives Rendezvous a unique flavor profile with notes of spicy cinnamon, caramel, honey, mint, and vanilla." Why say it's unmalted? Only Fritz Maytag uses malted rye. Unmalted is the norm. No one else points out that the rye in their rye whiskey is unmalted. Why does he? Naturally, he doesn't have answers to any of this.

As for the oat vodka, from what I can tell he hasn't actually made anything yet. The web site talks about, "the 100-year-old livery stable that we are restoring as High West's home and the only ski-in distillery in the world." If they have some kind of current operation, they don't tell where it is.

As I wrote when Perkins and I had our dust-up in January, "Far be it from me to strangle a baby in its bed, and I get the idea about getting some products out to get some cash coming in and some publicity going out, but the buzz you're creating is about people wanting to try that 18-year-old rye made in Utah, when it's nothing of the kind. I still have a problem with somebody calling himself a distiller and his company a distillery putting out a product he merely bought and bottled. It's not good for him in the long run. It's a bad way to start."

[SBOmarc]

I received a bottle for my birthday, along with 2 glasses that have a hand blown look. I haven't tried it as of yet, will let you know what I think once I do.

[SBOmarc]

I tried the Rendezvous Rye,

And now I never have to try it again. Of course I am going to let it rest now and give it another try.

Don't ask me when.

[Sir Toby Belch]

Chuck Cowdery says, "I still have a problem with somebody calling himself a distiller and his company a distillery putting out a product he merely bought and bottled." I agree. So I find myself annoyed by the concept of "Kentucky Bourbon Distillers" or "Old Pogue Distillery". Both outfits coyly imply that they distill their own products when we all know they do not. I even recall once meeting one of the Pogue clan at a local liquor store. I asked him where his product was distilled. He admitted that he did not distill it himself. Instead, he offered the explanation that Old Pogue is distilled by KBD. When I pointed out that KDB also does not distill (at least not yet), the Pogue guy maintained otherwise, directly contrary to the truth. I know that some enthusiasts argue we should only judge the product, not the advertising puffery. But history and tradition play a big role in the bourbon enthusiast's enjoyment of the drink. When non-distilling bottlers deliberately give the impression that they are distillers, the good name of a traditional product is diminished.

[Sir Toby Belch]

Make that, "they distill their own products..." My 6th grade English teacher would have been ashamed of me!

[NorCalBoozer]

the practice of brands and non-distillers using whiskey they did not produce was around long before micros.

I agree with the idea that I would prefer that they be honest. But they entered into a realm where this was already going on. It doesn't make it right but it also makes it understandable that they might do it.

Micro's have a tough job, to build a brand and company in a pretty competitive marketplace. It would certainly make sense to get a whiskey brand going way before you actually distill and age whiskey because you can start building acceptance and a following long before any whiskey you produce is ready. I would prefer they be honest about doing this.

I think it's an industry issue and would like to see it addressed as such. However something tells me the big guys wouldn't want that type of restriction so I guess we are left where we are with us, as customers, having to "bust" them and hope they want to be honest but with no real regulation to force producers to tell us where it came from.

Greg

[cowdery]

One extra criticism I have for many of the micro guys is that they assert their craft superiority over the majors, then do exactly what the majors do, in terms of deceptive provenance labeling; or they apply even less craft than the majors do, although they claim to apply more. I've also noticed that they get briefly indignant when busted, then back off, because they know they don't have a leg to stand on.

[Powertrip]

Before I read or was even aware of all the hullabaloo and controversy with this product, I picked up a bottle in Park City, Utah (on 12/09/2008) and tried it. (Batch#8, Bottle#50, 46%abv)

These were my notes:

-Nose absolutely dominant in vanilla, butterscotch.

Delicious flavour profile. On the sweeter end but extemely well balanced. Huge rye coated by layers of sugar cane nestled in toffee. An oak presence but it sits perfectly in the mouth. Finish is long drawn out butter toffee with a whisper of fresh cream. Wow, fantastic stuff.-

I rarely buy product blind and most always do my due diligence first. This was a complete gamble for me and it ended up being terrific. I am fascinated by what I have read but for some reason find myself not overly concerned this time.

Why? Because I simply enjoy the product. Sometimes it pays not to be tainted first.

I do hope the truth gets sorted out and that High West's agenda is laid out in black and white.

Until then however, I'm going to really enjoy my bottle of High West Rendezvous Straight Rye Whisky.

[jinenjo]

I think it's an industry issue and would like to see it addressed as such. However something tells me the big guys wouldn't want that type of restriction so I guess we are left where we are with us, as customers, having to "bust" them and hope they want to be honest but with no real regulation to force producers to tell us where it came from.

Greg

Good point, Greg. (Slightly off-topic) How come there isn't more strict regulations? After all, this may be the dawning of the age of aquar...I mean, regulations.

[sku]

I followed Chuck's blog entries on this whiskey in which he made some excellent points and, in general, I don't like mystery whiskies that don't disclose who made the stuff and am even less fond of those who imply that they made whiskey they didn't.

However, after trying it, I have to say that I really enjoyed the Rendezvous Rye. For being that high in rye content, it is incredibly smooth and has a great flavor, not pure rye spice, but lots of complexity. Clearly, great care went into blending this, and blending is a skill, just as distilling is; they just need to be upfront that they are, at this point, blenders.

[Lost Pollito]

For anyone in the Chicagoland area, you can come ask some questions in person on Wed, July the 1st. David Perkins will be at Binnys S. Loop from 6:30 - 8:30. Pm me if you're interested. Should be a great night.

[Bourbon Geek]

Although Perkins admits he didn't make the stuff, he won't tell us much that is meaningful about it and what he does say (e.g., "a 6-year-old 95% rye and an 16-year-old 80% rye.") is confusing. To what do the 95% and 80% refer. Mash bill? Why in the world would you make a 95% rye mash? Assuming the other 5% is malt, why bother? That's too little malt to effectively convert the starches. It just makes no sense. Who would make a rye that way? He won't tell us, naturally.

There are at least 3 ways I know to make a 95% rye mash bill ...

1. Use 5% Gibb malt and hold the final mash temperature at about 146 degrees F for an unusually long time before pump out, then accept a moderately low conversion in exchange for the flavor profile you do get.

2. Use 5% malted barley (Gibb or not) and enough malted rye to complete the conversion from starch to alcohol normally.

3. Use 5% Gibb malt and supplement with enzymes to complete the conversion. There ARE bourbon mash bills in use right now that only use 5% Gibb malt with supplemental enzymes.. and they do just fine.... it's just not my method of choice ...

[cowdery]

The best information I've been able to obtain is that this whiskey came from Seagram's in Lawrenceburg, Indiana (now LDI). I can see them using a very high rye mash, since they were making it as blending whiskey, but there would be no reason to use an inefficient process, when say 90% rye and 10% malt (or whatever, Dave knows better than I) would have been an easy conversion.

I also have no trouble believing they used supplemental enzymes.

[cowdery]

Click here and look under "products" at what it says next to "rye."

[nor02lei]

As I am interested in the ryes from high west I did mail to the distillery and asked were the different ryes (rendezvous, 16 and 21) were distilled. David Perkins answered that it was a secret, but that the 3 of them all came from different distilleries!? When I did prone and ask Brett at Binny´s about rendezvous, he said that they had found the barrels at a Barton’s warehouse and that he though it probably was distilled at the old Seagram’s in Indiana (as have been said before here) or at Barton’s (now Tom More) in Bardstown. Lots of questions mark as I see it, but of big interest so I hope anyone that get further information post it here.

Leif

[cowdery]

The information I have is that while all of the whiskey was distilled at Seagram's in Lawrenceburg, IN, it was obtained from different sources. Seagram's made it for blending and presumably sold some to other producers, such as Barton, who ultimately didn't need it and sold it to High West and Templeton.

I have two issues with people who do this: (1) while most won't outright lie, they do try to get people to think they distilled the whiskey they're selling, and (2) I wonder if they ever really intended to make anything themselves?

[silverfish]

A recent post by John Hansell reports of a new

"Bourye" - a blend of straight rye and bourbon

whiskies.

"The bourbon is a 10-year-old with a 75% corn,

15% rye, 10% barley malt mashbill. The rye is

a straight 12-year-old 95% rye, 5% barley malt

mashbill."

post here: tinyurl.com/bourye

[Gillman]

I've only had the one that combines 6 and 16 year old straight ryes. It is very good and quite different to any other straight rye I have had, it has a creamy but light taste, with a mango-like hint as well. It makes sense to me that it might have been made originally for blending. I wonder how the mild character was achieved? Perhaps by using a high distillation proof (but under 160 proof of course) and a yeast that lends to this characteristic, hard to say. But it is very good and I will definitely buy it again.

Gary

[JohnHansell]

A recent post by John Hansell reports of a new

"Bourye" - a blend of straight rye and bourbon

whiskies.

"The bourbon is a 10-year-old with a 75% corn,

15% rye, 10% barley malt mashbill. The rye is

a straight 12-year-old 95% rye, 5% barley malt

mashbill."

post here: tinyurl.com/bourye

Yeah, he actually informed me today that there's a second rye in the mix too--a 16 year old, 53% rye. I got a review sample today and doubt I'll make it through the evening without tasting it. I posted a label of it up on my blog for those interested in seeing it: http://blog.maltadvocate.com/2009/09/28/high-west-bourye-a-blend-of-straight-rye-and-bourbon-whiskeys/

[dgonano]

I've been sippin' this Rye for some time. For all who wish to experience the taste of "Old Maryland Rye", try the Rendexvous. The high rye content reveals the minty aroma and spicy taste. I like it!

[sailor22]

Anyone seen/tried the Bourye yet?

[Lost Pollito]

Yeah, and I liked it quite a bit. Four Roses is the most likely candidate for the bourbon. So, a nice High rye bourbon with a High rye rye. Makes for a spicey vanilla ride.

[p_elliott]

Anyone seen/tried the Bourye yet?

I don't see that one listed on their site between you and Joe you have me intrigued, please elaborate.

[sailor22]

this should clear it up:

http://www.whatdoesjohnknow.com/2009/10/22/review-high-west-bourye-batch-1/