2002 Kentucky Bourbon Festival

[Forbes]

Well we’re back in Indiana and Peggy and I were discussing what fun we had at this year’s festival. It was great seeing some of you over the weekend. This forum has great information, but in my opinion the best thing staightbourbon.com does is bring a diverse group of people from around the country together on a common interest, bourbon.

We arrived Friday afternoon in that we had tickets to Heaven Hill’s Bourbon, Cigars, and Jazz. However, prior to heading to the event Peggy and I stopped at the Talbot’s Tavern for a Maker’s Mark reception. It was a real pleasure to spend a few minutes speaking with Bill Samuels, Jr. for the first time. We were just about to leave when we met up with a couple we had met for the first time at the prior years festival. Peggy then sees Linn and Vickie Spencer and called them over. Ed, who had never met Linn before knew exactly who he was from reading the straightbourbon.com postings. It’s a small world. Now, how was it that Linn was at a Maker’s Mark reception?

After an enjoyable weekend once again the festival ended for us at the Gazebo at the General Nelson motel. Some of the same crowd from last year were there – Chuck, Omar, and Chris & Kristin as well as some new folks that you seem to get to know from their posts but it is great to put a face with their names. It was also nice meeting Jim Butler and finding out just how straightbourbon.com got started. We all had a great time catching up and discussing bourbon. In regards to bourbon, this night was also a highlight in that as we shared different bourbons among ourselves Omar had brought a bottle of twelve-year-old Very Very Old Fitzgerald. An unopened bottle of this fine bourbon is probably my most prized bourbon. Omar gave us the opportunity to taste what I cannot yet bring myself to open. Needless to say it tasted wonderful.

Again thank-you all and we look forward to seeing you at the next year’s festival.

Todd

[Guest **DONOTDELETE**]

Hey Todd it was great to see you and Peggy again. We droped off a few purchases upstairs in our room and ditched my hat and then we made our way downstairs where we were stopped at 'Checkpoint Maker's'. "Are you an Ambassador?" asked the plainclothes guard. "No we live here and this is our bar." I answered as we strutted behind enemy lines. Dave Pickrel was just inside and he turned me an evil stare. "Oh-Oh", I thought, "Our cover's been blown!" No sooner did we enter the bar than Todd yelled "Linn!" Even Bill Samules Jr. looked up from signing autographs. Linn and Vickie Spencer in the Maker's Mark Ambassador's Club?????? We managed to escape with our lives.

[kitzg]

wish I'd been there with a camera!

Bill Samuels is a great guy and as we've said before he gets great credit for holding to his tradition and for keeping a beautiful distillery going.

I don't think he'd throw you out!

[Gillman]

I was able to attend the Festival, just Saturday and Sunday, and greatly enjoyed it, my first Festival.

I liked the Spirit Garden, and focused on "local" brands, eg. Very Old Barton, anything by Heaven Hill.

I found the museum really interesting. I love reading old ads, eg. in 1902 whiskey was sold at up to 13 years

of age; maybe not all that much has changed. I was amazed how many full bottles from the prewar era are on display.

I met Elmer Lee which was a real privilege, we discussed whiskey in the old days and now. He feels whiskey has

never been higher in standard than today.

I did not attend any distillery events but toured some sites Sunday morning, just to view them in their natural aspect: Heaven Hill, Maker's Mark, Jim Beam, Four Roses.

I met a whisky blender with Four Roses. A very serious gentleman who took pride in the high percentage of rye

in the Four Roses mashbill. It seems Four Roses Straight Bourbon will soon be more widely available in the U.S.

I was fortunate to attend the Gala where I met J. Van Winkle and Bill Samuels, both fine gents.

Whiskeys that stood out for me: anything from Van Winkle, the new Blanton's, some of the Wild Turkey premiums, the Evan Williams single barrels. Also, the 18 year old Craig, just a stunner.

I bought a bonded Heaven Hill to take home, it looed like a bottling of some years back, that and a pint of Barton's 86 proof. The store owner was most helpful with suggestions, and his cronies at the end of the counter, but clearly amused that someone would ponder of their purchase.

I don't know if I'll ever get the chance again, but it was memorable.

[kitzg]

Gary, sounds like you really accomplished a lot! You met some great people and tasted some great bourbon.

I've been lucky to get Four Roses bourbon here and though some shun it because it is well mingled I really appreciate the smoooooothness. Their products for the Japanese market knock my socks...make that pants.... off.

[cornsqueezins]

Greg, speaking of Four Roses, I recently came across some bottles of Four Roses Blended Whiskey. I've had the Four Roses straight bourbon before and understand from some of the members here that it is a mingled product. But what goes into the blended product? Do they blend their own bourbon with other distillery's bourbons or do they introduce some neutral grain spirits into the mixture?

-Troy

[MurphyDawg]

</font><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr />

the new Blanton's

[cowdery]

I haven't seen the Four Roses blend (I thought they took that off the market years ago), but I'm sure it is just like other American Blended Whiskey products, which are about 20% aged whiskey (i.e., bourbon), with the rest of the blend being unaged whiskey (i.e., white dog) and grain neutral spirits (i.e., vodka), plus flavorings and colorings. In other words, something along the lines of Seagrams Seven Crown.

[cornsqueezins]

The bottles I saw looked to be as old as dirt. They were on the bottom shelf and covered with dust. I think they were priced at around 10 bucks apiece.

[kitzg]

Chuck & Troy, I've seen the blended often enough to believe it is still bottled. Jim Rutledge, MD at Roses, cautioned me in conversation to be certain I was buying the bourbon not the blended product so I believe blend is still in distribution. Jim and I hope new ownership will agree to at least a broader US distribution of 4 Roses bourbon. I don't think we can hope they'll distribute their premium products here as they can make more money on every case they can sell to Japan.

Of course Chuck's right about the blend ingredients.

[Gillman]

Thanks to Greg for earlier note.

I understood from the blender I spoke to (a young Japanese man, recently transferred by Kirin to Four Roses here) that the Bourbon is currently available in the U.S. only in Kentucky.

He said as stock allows (they need to increase production because of the existing foreign markets),

they will expand distribution to other States.

[Gillman]

I was told the Blanton's served at the Gala was a different version and a few points higher in proof than the existing one.

Unfortunately, I did not take written notes and cannot remember (ahem) further details except that this one was very complex.

Subtle and complex. Blanton's to date has been great but I would type it as rich and big rather than complex; so the new one seems to fit well in the range.

[kitzg]

Jim Rutledge has been pushing for broader distribution. It is currently available in Kentucky AND parts of Indiana so employees can buy it. That's how I get mine.

[bobbyc]

I have noticed both the Blended and Straight versions at Liquor Barn in Louisville this store isn't all that old so that would preclude it from being too old altogether. The people I know who work the single barrel line at 4 Roses here have told me what their quota is so far this year . It's not a very substantial amount so it's not as though the japanese are sucking this stuff in like a black hole.So the other thing may be that they don't have enough aged product to meet production for a stateside sale.

[kgiammarco]

Is it possible that the blantons at the gala was some 'export only' blantons that was bottled at a diffrent proof?

[kgiammarco]

It gets depressing to see great bourbons go only to japan/overseas... I hope the four roses superpremium and single barrel eventually make it to the US...

[Gillman]

This is possible, even probable. In looking at the Blanton's site (www.blantonsbourbon.com), 4 versions are mentioned:

the Original, Special Reserve, Silver and Gold. Last two seem directed to international/duty free markets.

The Gold is just over 100 proof. The taste and color notes given suggest they are not just the same

liquor differentiated only by alcohol level, eg. they speak of richer colour in the Gold version. So maybe

they chose the Gold or Silver to offer at this showcase function.

[Guest **DONOTDELETE**]

Please allow me to butt in here Gary. All Blanton's is derived from mashbill BT#2 as are Rock Hill Farms; Elmer T. Lee, Hancock's President's Reserve, Buffalo Trace, and Ancient Age just to name a few. New make whiskey is pumped into new charred white oak barrels and off to warehouse 'H' they go. All Blanton's is made with the BT#2 mashbill and all Blanton's is aged in warehouse 'H'. The difference lies in the barrel selected and it's intended purpose. The darker color of the 'Gold' would normally indicate that the bourbon is older.

[kitzg]

I say doubtful OR expect a very high price on products that now go to Japan.

Try the model yourself. You have a very good customer who buys all you have of limited product (Japan) at high prices. Some other customers (us) would like some. Are you going to risk pissing off your first customer who pays high price to try to please your second customer. And in this case most of the second customer ( folks in the U.S.) think Jack Daniels is a high-priced, top shelf bourbon (don't call me on this, I am only stating the mistake they make) so they are not missing the product that goes to Japan.

That said, maybe Kirin will be interested in broadening their base someday anyway! One argument Jim Rutledge makes for U.S. distribution is that the folks that make the product can't even buy it!

[jbutler]

...Or less dilute. The Gold is 51.5% ABV and the silver 49% ABV, whereas us measly Americans are "stuck" with the 46.5% ABV expression.

[Gillman]

Well yes, and thanks Linn for the mash bill info.

I got a mickey of Triple A in Bardstown also; it seems as different as could be from any Blanton's version.

I found the AAA a little hot, and not as rich as I recall from ten years ago.

I guess the differences must be explained by different barrels, warehouses and rick locations, and of course aging.

The Heaven Hill bonded is a bruiser, with a heavy rye bite - nothing sugar barrel about that one, I would say.

That must be from another mash type.

[Guest **DONOTDELETE**]

Jim please use proof numbers. Bourbons are measured in proof - not some scotichifed ABV crapola! We must preserve the purity of proofage. Our American Heritage is at stake. Don't give in to ABV - Demand PROOF!

[kgiammarco]

What do you mean by 'risk pissing off'? Do you mean that the japanese would be angry if something they pay $100 for is on sale in the us for less? I can understand that... but why is it that they don't offer all products in the US anyway, at the same price (or even more?) I don't understand why it seems that many places like to keep their more desirable bourbons for export only... Is there money to be lost by having a higher priced (and therefore lower volume) bourbon in the US?

Is it possible that there is a large amount of paperwork to be done for each bottling that is to be sold in the US and that unless something is to be a big seller they would rather not go through the hassle?

I would think that it would be more profitable to sell less bourbon at a higher markup (like most japan only things seem to be) rather than lots of 'average' bourbon...

(i guess i am just frustrated at tasting all those great bourbons at the festival, and all but one of the best can't be purchased here)

-Chris

[ratcheer]

Whoa! Heaven Hill is a totally different product from the others. Different warehouse, different mash bill, different distillery, and different company.

[MurphyDawg]

103 Proof, 98 Proof & 94 Proof, respectively. BLEEE!!

TomC