Rye Conundrum

[kaiserhog]

Overbroad statements can be a great starting point for discussion. :cool:

Historical whiskey has been an interest to me. I have tasted only three historical rye. One was an 18yo made before prohibition and sold as medicinal (Doughertys , pic in my avatar). It was very good and the closest of todays rye I thought was Vintage 23 from a few years back. The other was Mt Vernon, a PA rye distilled '37 bottled '42, bonded. It was quite unique and I can't think of anything currently made that is similar. I still have an unopened bottle of that, and one day will need to revisit it. The third was the first edition of 13yo VanWFR. While not technically of great vintage, it could currently be considered a modern classic.

Cheers

RW

[oke&coke]

Thanks for the kind words. I developed an interest in Rye when I saw a Youtube video of a winter float trip that passed by the Old Overholt Broad Ford Distillery. A massive complex that has been completely abandoned, but still standing. I found it very haunting. I realized that Rye Whiskey was a major industry in this country. In fact, for a long time the biggest commercial whiskey industry until Kentucky and Bourbon took over.

I find it very sad that prohibition killed a very important part of the economic and social fabric of this country.

And yet thankful to the people that saw fit to keep it alive. A toast to them.

[Gillman]

No jug yeast meant IMO that they were doing the older form of sour mashing, where a portion of the ferment was added to a subsequent one or possibly microorganisms resident in fermentation vessels achieved the fermentation. Over the years here, and on the other board, these variations on what is known as sour mashing today were discussed.

Gary

[squire]

Could it be they were suggesting their production methods were superior by using consistent modern commercially prepared dry yeast.

[shoshani]

Could it be they were suggesting their production methods were superior by using consistent modern commercially prepared dry yeast.

In 1904? I'd doubt it. Compressed cake yeast was barely off the ground. Maybe Old Joe was a sweet mash?

[squire]

Commercial yeast types for bakers, brewers and distillers has been available since the 1870s. Fleischmann began in 1868 or thereabouts, and Red Star in 1871. I'm sure there were others but the mention that jug yeast wasn't being used must mean the distiller had something better in mind.

[shoshani]

Commercial yeast types for bakers, brewers and distillers has been available since the 1870s. Fleischmann began in 1868 or thereabouts, and Red Star in 1871. I'm sure there were others but the mention that jug yeast wasn't being used must mean the distiller had something better in mind.

[squire]

Yes, kids today think of 1904 as being the last era of the dinosaurs yet my Grandfather was in grade school by then. Turn of last Century society considered itself very modern, even to the extent that in 1899 a quote was attributed to then head of the U.S. Patent office Charles Duell as saying his Agency may as well be closed because everything that could be invented had already been invented.

The subject of commercial yeast being used by Rye distillers deserves more research.

[tanstaafl2]

Yes, kids today think of 1904 as being the last era of the dinosaurs yet my Grandfather was in grade school by then.

YIKES! That's a bit scary as my grandfather turned 24 in 1904! I must be older than I thought...

:cool:

[squire]

We could start an Old Farts Anonymous Chapter complete with Lodge, wheelchair ramp and Rye whisky on tap.

[tanstaafl2]

We could start an Old Farts Anonymous Chapter complete with Lodge, wheelchair ramp and Rye whisky on tap.

That works for me!!!

[tmckenzie]

It was apparently also something thought significant enough to advertise to the wholesale trade. He doesn't mention what the alternative was (and I didn't know that commercial yeast was available that early), but it could be that the trade of that day knew what the alternatives were and thus didn't have to be told.

[squire]

Please expound on that Tom, what is the percentage of alcohol in the converted rye mash?

[tmckenzie]

Well that depends on the amount of grain. I hit 16 Brix, so about 8 percent on the ones I done.

[WhiskyRI]

Herman Mihalich at Dad's Hat Rye in Bristol, PA is making a true Pennsylvania Rye. Whether it is comparable to the pre-prohibition ryes from PA, I'll let others decide. I've tasted it and I like it. http://dadshatrye.com/distillery-videos/

[TunnelTiger]

That works for me!!!

Works for me as well, Old Fart Bourbon Drinkers (OFBD).

[squire]

All I know about them is what I read on their website. I will say this though, their copy writer is on his toes, that's the first time I've read white raspberry seeds in tasting notes. Come to think of it I've never seen a white raspberry either.

[squire]

Well that depends on the amount of grain. I hit 16 Brix, so about 8 percent on the ones I done.

That's a good rate, why then would malt be needed, faster, cleaner?

[TunnelTiger]

Do they turn from green to slightly white before turning red? Been a long time since I've seen any growing.

[squire]

Maybe they're toasted.