squire Posted April 17, 2014 Share Posted April 17, 2014 I wouldn't say I'm past the age of exploration but I am at an age where I'll take it the way they make it and be glad for the opportunity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andre28 Posted April 17, 2014 Author Share Posted April 17, 2014 Thanks again for all the replies guys. I will keep an eye out for many of the products mentioned. If the price is halfway decent I will give them a go, but depending on who is importing it into Australia it can go for 2x-10x retail stateside! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sutton Posted April 18, 2014 Share Posted April 18, 2014 What about some of the grain distilleries in Scotland, Carsebridge or North British? Might find something there to your taste. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bourbonv Posted April 21, 2014 Share Posted April 21, 2014 Actually what i said was that Dickel 12 was 10yo when I was at UD but may have risen to as much as 12-16 years of age before they shut down the distillery and and gotten their overstock problem under control. Mike Veach Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cowdery Posted April 21, 2014 Share Posted April 21, 2014 (edited) Aging in new barrels creates a different style of whiskey. It's not a matter of quality and it's not a short cut or accelerated aging. It's a different style of whiskey that emphasizes wood extractives. Whiskeys aged in used barrels aren't a little lower in extractives, they are a lot lower. You can't get a bourbon flavor profile from used cooperage, no matter how long you age it or what else you do. It won't taste like bourbon because most of the flavors we associate with bourbon come from that fresh, charred barrel. In a second use barrel they simply are not there. Mellow Corn and Early Times are two interesting examples. The distillate used for Mellow Corn would be considered bourbon if it was aged in new, charred barrels so comparing Mellow Corn BIB, which is aged four years in used barrels, to a young bourbon like Jim Beam will show you the difference. Beam has a little bit more rye but essentially the distillates are the same, the main difference is used v new barrels.Early Times is interesting because it has a bourbon profile even though 20 percent of the cooperage is used. At 20 percent, it doesn't change the taste very much. ET is also only 3 years old.This is why Diageo's disinformation campaign is so pernicious, it's planting ideas like that. It's also interesting how what Mike said was so broadly misconstrued. Many of us started getting into bourbon during the glut period, so we got a lot of old whiskey in NAS bottles where we didn't expect it. Lucky for us to have that experience, which you can still have by dusty hunting, but the heyday of that was a long time ago. Edited April 21, 2014 by cowdery Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
White Dog Posted April 24, 2014 Share Posted April 24, 2014 The Hirsch 20 mentioned above is exactly what you are looking for. Bourbon mash, used cooperage, 20 years old. Not crazy expensive and can be found since most bourbon diehards won't touch the stuff.http://caskers.com/product/hirsch-20/Sold out there but it is still on shelves around me.Yes, indeed! It was a Bourbon mashbill distilled at the old Hiram Walker plant in Peoria, thrown into used barrels, but was never intended to age that long. When I first tried it, I hated it, but it really started to grow on me. There's an odd sweetness up front that differs from Bourbon sweetness. If that sounds strange, I guess it is. The finish is very "resiny" in a nice way. It's such an oddball that I kinda cherish the last bottle I have, as you won't see this type of spirit again. (At least not anytime soon.) And I thought that $55 was not a crazy price for a 20yr whiskey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cowdery Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 Very much a piece of history too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andre28 Posted April 30, 2014 Author Share Posted April 30, 2014 Aging in new barrels creates a different style of whiskey. It's not a matter of quality and it's not a short cut or accelerated aging. It's a different style of whiskey that emphasizes wood extractives. Whiskeys aged in used barrels aren't a little lower in extractives, they are a lot lower. You can't get a bourbon flavor profile from used cooperage, no matter how long you age it or what else you do. It won't taste like bourbon because most of the flavors we associate with bourbon come from that fresh, charred barrel. In a second use barrel they simply are not there. Mellow Corn and Early Times are two interesting examples. The distillate used for Mellow Corn would be considered bourbon if it was aged in new, charred barrels so comparing Mellow Corn BIB, which is aged four years in used barrels, to a young bourbon like Jim Beam will show you the difference. Beam has a little bit more rye but essentially the distillates are the same, the main difference is used v new barrels.Early Times is interesting because it has a bourbon profile even though 20 percent of the cooperage is used. At 20 percent, it doesn't change the taste very much. ET is also only 3 years old.This is why Diageo's disinformation campaign is so pernicious, it's planting ideas like that. It's also interesting how what Mike said was so broadly misconstrued. Many of us started getting into bourbon during the glut period, so we got a lot of old whiskey in NAS bottles where we didn't expect it. Lucky for us to have that experience, which you can still have by dusty hunting, but the heyday of that was a long time ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cowdery Posted April 30, 2014 Share Posted April 30, 2014 Glenrothes uses the most nearly new barrels in Scotland. They take new, charred American oak barrels, season them with sherry, then use them for their malt whiskey. They aren't technically new but about as close as you'll get. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tanstaafl2 Posted May 26, 2014 Share Posted May 26, 2014 Saw the Hirsch 20 on the shelf. More than I wanted to pay but, unlike the JR Ewing bourbon, temptation got the best of me and I took a bottle home. This thread and the HW 21 rye was enough to convince me to take a chance. Not sure when I will get to this "Illinois" whiskey but I am sure an opportunity will present itself! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WAINWRIGHT Posted May 26, 2014 Share Posted May 26, 2014 I'll be curious to see what you think Bruce,but in my book it's a winner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tanstaafl2 Posted May 26, 2014 Share Posted May 26, 2014 I'll be curious to see what you think Bruce,but in my book it's a winner.I will definitely report. I confess it has me curious so I may try to check it out sooner rather than later.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amg Posted May 30, 2014 Share Posted May 30, 2014 Compass Box Hedonism is a blend of fairly old Scotch grain whiskeys (i.e. corn/wheat/etc. in addition to malted barley), but I don't know what the mashbills are, and I'm not sure whether they're aged in ex-bourbon or ex-sherry casks (or some combination). I can say it's definitely unlike any other Scotch I've had and worth trying if you haven't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tanstaafl2 Posted May 30, 2014 Share Posted May 30, 2014 Compass Box Hedonism is a blend of fairly old Scotch grain whiskeys (i.e. corn/wheat/etc. in addition to malted barley), but I don't know what the mashbills are, and I'm not sure whether they're aged in ex-bourbon or ex-sherry casks (or some combination). I can say it's definitely unlike any other Scotch I've had and worth trying if you haven't.John Glaser said he likes to look for older grain whiskies that used a large proportion of corn. That said I am not sure even he always knows what the grain mashbill is for everything he uses. It is also worth noting the scotch is not as constrained when it comes to ABV off the still as they can go up to 94.8%! That would of course keep it from being a straight whisky by US standards. A lot of it seems to come from Cameron Bridge distillery which is the largest grain whisky producer in Scotland and part of the vast Diageo whisky empire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squire Posted May 30, 2014 Share Posted May 30, 2014 I wouldn't be concerned much about the mashbill, it's grain distillate designed to produce the most alcohol as cheaply as practicable and the high proof off the still is as devoid of flavor as vodka. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LCWoody Posted January 3, 2015 Share Posted January 3, 2015 Saw the Hirsch 20 on the shelf. More than I wanted to pay but, unlike the JR Ewing bourbon, temptation got the best of me and I took a bottle home. This thread and the HW 21 rye was enough to convince me to take a chance.[ATTACH=CONFIG]18457[/ATTACH]Not sure when I will get to this "Illinois" whiskey but I am sure an opportunity will present itself!Did you try the Hirsch 20y whiskey yet? Just curious what you thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tanstaafl2 Posted January 3, 2015 Share Posted January 3, 2015 Did you try the Hirsch 20y whiskey yet? Just curious what you thought.No, it kind of got lost in the shuffle so I need to dig it out and try it. Maybe I can make my own great American blended whiskey with this Hirsch and the HW 21yo Rye! Although I would hate to waste any of the scarce HW21. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LCWoody Posted January 3, 2015 Share Posted January 3, 2015 Yea, I don't know if I would waste the HW21, that is some mighty fine rye. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts