New Wild Turkey Master's Keep, bottled at 86.8 proof

[zillah]

On PA's website, there is currently 1000s, 1000s!, of Diamond in inventory. No one is buying it.

This shit will languish on the shelf.

[BigRich]

My memory may be foggy, but I don't recall ever being insulted by the proof of a whiskey.

The next time I spent 150.00 on a bottle of bourbon will be the first time. The entire industry is overheated so I'm glad I got in and out of the premium game early.

I'm with you on this Ox. I'm more bothered by the price than the proof. I've had many enjoyable bourbons in the entire range of proofs from 80 to 140+. Unfortunately the "new normal" on pricing is discouraging and frustrating.

[Josh]

I'm with you on this Ox. I'm more bothered by the price than the proof. I've had many enjoyable bourbons in the entire range of proofs from 80 to 140+. Unfortunately the "new normal" on pricing is discouraging and frustrating.

Whether 80 proof bourbons can be enjoyable is not the issue for me. It is the bottling of high price, high end expressions at low proof. Campari seems to think enthusiasts will buy anything they slap a high price and high age statement on it, in spite of what seems to be the poor sales of Diamond which was bottled at a higher proof. The trend is downward in proof and upward in price, which is bad.

If it's $150, what are we getting for that money? Sub 90 proof & 17 y/o. The first is a minus for just about anybody at that price and the second may be a plus for some, but not for me. Campari is proving itself a very poor steward of the WT legacy.

[BigRich]

Whether 80 proof bourbons can be enjoyable is not the issue for me. It is the bottling of high price, high end expressions at low proof. Campari seems to think enthusiasts will buy anything they slap a high price and high age statement on it, in spite of what seems to be the poor sales of Diamond which was bottled at a higher proof. The trend is downward in proof and upward in price, which is bad.

If it's $150, what are we getting for that money? Sub 90 proof & 17 y/o. The first is a minus for just about anybody at that price and the second may be a plus for some, but not for me. Campari is proving itself a very poor steward of the WT legacy.

So to be $150, regardless of taste, age, and rarity isn't worth it if it's sub 90 proof? That's a little facile Josh.

[Josh]

No, not worth it. In most cases I don't think under 100 proof is worth it.

if we keep giving them a pass on this low proof high price garbage we'll keep seeing more and more of it.

Edited February 17, 2015 by Josh

[BigRich]

No, not worth it. In most cases I don't think under 100 proof is worth it.

if we keep giving them a pass on this low proof high price garbage we'll keep seeing more and more of it.

You don't drink much whiskey outside of American made do you? The 100+ proof is mostly an American thing. Are US producers extending inventory and profits? Sure. However, as the popularity of our whiskey spreads around the world it's just possible that they may be catering more to international preferences instead of US bourbon elitists. I have no more facts about motivations than you do. But it's just possible it may not be entirely as nefarious as some of the commentary posted here would lead us to believe. To me it's about how it tastes. If it sucks I won't buy it. Some bourbons drink well sub 100. Some drink surprisingly easy over 100 proof. It's bottle by bottle for me. For you, it's your money so by all means spend it how you choose.

[sailor22]

The old brown label 86.8 was a good pour and I would be tickled if this was as good. It was never a premium or a limited release, just a good solid spirit at a good price.

If the glass is half full......Maybe this is a new age stated standard release that will retail for under $50 and be in wide distribution.

[TheNovaMan]

You don't drink much whiskey outside of American made do you? The 100+ proof is mostly an American thing.

[BigBoldBully]

You don't drink much whiskey outside of American made do you? The 100+ proof is mostly an American thing. Are US producers extending inventory and profits? Sure. However, as the popularity of our whiskey spreads around the world it's just possible that they may be catering more to international preferences instead of US bourbon elitists. I have no more facts about motivations than you do. But it's just possible it may not be entirely as nefarious as some of the commentary posted here would lead us to believe. To me it's about how it tastes. If it sucks I won't buy it. Some bourbons drink well sub 100. Some drink surprisingly easy over 100 proof. It's bottle by bottle for me. For you, it's your money so by all means spend it how you choose.

[garbanzobean]

Plenty of bourbon, rye, malt, and grain whisk(e)y drink well under 100 proof. There are bottles of bourbon under 100 proof that plenty of people would probably donate a kidney to own a case of, and thank you for the opportunity to do so. I do understand the general consensus that Wild Turkey should stick to its traditional 101 proof (or higher), but maybe we should wait for the ridiculous MSRP to be announced and mediocre reviews to roll in before really laying into this release? You know, for another four to twenty pages, anyway.

For all any of us knows, this could be very good. I mean, I won't find out because it's already way older than I prefer, but maybe someone will love it.

[BigRich]

I don't know about Josh, but the only whiskey I drink is bourbon. Scotch and Canadian whiskies are completely different animals. I find 100 to be quite an excellent proof for bourbon. At this very moment, I'm drinking Evan Williams black label, which is 86 proof, and I like it a lot. But most of the time, I prefer EW BIB (I'm a BIB kind of guy). For the consumer, it's super easy to add a little water, but not at all easy to increase the alcohol content. I'm not one to spend a load on a single bottle; if someone wants more than $50 for 750mL, it better either be a dusty or age stated at 100+ proof. Diamond would probably have sold MUCH better at the price they wanted if it was 101 proof, or if it was the lower proof and much cheaper. But it's expensive and under 100 proof, and it's selling terribly. Maybe there's a lesson to learn there?

To each their own. I never said scotch tasted anything like bourbon. My point was that the regard for high proof seems to derive more from communities like this rather than a majority of whiskey drinkers. There is a lot of whiskey out there. If you chooses to zero in on your sweet spot with the qualifiers that it a) be bourbon and must be 100+ proof and that works for you then great. For me that excludes some things that I've really enjoyed and others may enjoy too. When threads like this come up we spend WAY too much time talking in absolutes rather than opinions driven by actually tasting the stuff. I think that kind of attitude can do a disservice to other forum members who haven't zeroed in on their sweet spot yet.

[CorvallisCracker]

Keep in mind that this may be destined for just the Japanese market. Most of the other age-dated expressions of WT (as opposed to RR) are Japan market only.

[amg]

Keep in mind that this may be destined for just the Japanese market. Most of the other age-dated expressions of WT (as opposed to RR) are Japan market only.

Would they need a US label approval for a Japan-only release?

[kjbeggs]

Plenty of bourbon, rye, malt, and grain whisk(e)y drink well under 100 proof. There are bottles of bourbon under 100 proof that plenty of people would probably donate a kidney to own a case of, and thank you for the opportunity to do so. I do understand the general consensus that Wild Turkey should stick to its traditional 101 proof (or higher), but maybe we should wait for the ridiculous MSRP to be announced and mediocre reviews to roll in before really laying into this release? You know, for another four to twenty pages, anyway.

For all any of us knows, this could be very good. I mean, I won't find out because it's already way older than I prefer, but maybe someone will love it.

[Josh]

Booker's 25th was 130 proof or thereabouts.

Whether this new WT tastes good or not, it's a sign of an unfortunate trend in high end releases. That's my main point here. Those of us who think that trend is bad need to vote with our pocketbooks and speak up on social media to let producers know that we don't like it.

[CorvallisCracker]

Would they need a US label approval for a Japan-only release?

[amg]

Probably not; I just checked the WT COLAs back through 1/1/2010 and don't find ones for the Japan-only 8, 12 and 13yo expressions.

Seemed like a reasonable proposition, as (it's my impression) that the Japanese care far more about age statements than they do about proof.

Looking at the COLA, I see they've got every size bottle listed, from 50ml to 1.75 liter.

[flahute]

Exactly! I remember reading a lot of negative comments regarding Booker's 25th before it was released, and it turned out to be fantastic!

Let's not be like one of those entertainment forums, where every movie ever "Sucks" for one reason or another.

Conjecture based on known variables (mashbill/proof/age etc.) is all well and good, but none of us know if it will be good or bad until we've actually tasted it.

[PaulO]

Maybe this was created by the same workers that created Forgiven. This time they accidentally added a bunch of water. Seriously though, I'm with Josh. The way I see it: RR 101 well loved, RR 90 just so-so, WT Rye 101 sought out, WT Rye 81 not wanted, Forgiven & Diamond who cares?

I will say that I like the latest Rare Breed, but it is 112 proof and under $40 out the door.

[qman22]

This is a waste of what is probably some pretty good 17 year old whiskey. This company is constantly trying to piss on our legs and tell us it's raining.

[garbanzobean]

Whether this new WT tastes good or not, it's a sign of an unfortunate trend in high end releases. That's my main point here. Those of us who think that trend is bad need to vote with our pocketbooks and speak up on social media to let producers know that we don't like it.

[MTNBourbon]

WOW! I like a few WTs and they are at a good value (RB, KS, 101) I've had RR, but like someone said above "Who are they trying to target". To me for that price 86 proof, what are they thinking? I like the age of it though, but still $150!

[danz]

Campari just needs to find enough store owners to buy another expensive limited edition trophy to put in the window/on the top shelf. Campari gets paid even if no customer buys it, as long as the store owners don't think things through.

That said, I am enjoying my WT 101 and Rare Breed (new model) at fairly reasonable prices, so I guess I'm not too fussed with this. It would be nice to try an older Turkey, but in this hyped market, I don't see that happening, since I value other things more than bourbon at the likely price.

[MTNBourbon]

Most likely it will never even show up here in UT.

[smokinjoe]

Quick question: We keep hearing the pricing of $150. Where is that from? Is there something from WT stating such?